Really don't want to vaccinate my kid

amother

Red

Mon, May 06 2024, 9:36 pm

amother Emerald wrote:

So glad NY doesn't accept religious excemptions anymore. What's this bluff all about? Why are you holier than all of us? If your child goes to school, you have a responsibilty as part of a community to vaccinate your child. There are unfortanetly kids that can't be vaccinated and rely on herd immunity. Don't fool with those things!

Agreed. Its such a selfish attitude you dont want to vaccinate no problem dont send your kid to my kids school with some bogus exemption.(not talking about legit immune compromised kids who are actually put most at risk by these selfish people)And dont make a huge chillul hashem with religious exemption.

amother

Melon

Mon, May 06 2024, 9:48 pm

amother Emerald wrote:

The first ammendment in the constitution is freedom of religion. When you start messing with that, we become vulnerable to other religious persecutions. Eg. After the religious exemptions where abolished in NY, the govt started coming after the schools about what they can teach.

You have a responsibility as a parent to take care of the child that G-d gave YOU. That means doing whats best for them. Most parents don't stop vaxxinating because their kids were doing fine. Many times they had 1 or more vaccine injured children to prompt that, or a genetic predisposition in the family. Many of these kids are in fact immunocompromised, you might not be privy to that info.

You are not required to light your child on fire to please another parent.

Please research what real herd immunity is. Drs. tout it as having majority of people vaxxinated,but that is a false narrative to get people to vaxx. True herd immunity, is when most of the people actually got these childhood illnesses and therefore the few that didn't were protected. It almost doesn't exist today because vaccines cannot offer herd immunity, because they are not completely effective and they wear off.
If you feel so strongly about vaccines being effective, vaxx your kids and don't worry about anything. You seem to be overly concerned about those kids that are immunocompromised- in fact many of those families that you judge prob do have immunocompromised children.

amother

Chocolate

Mon, May 06 2024, 9:50 pm

amother Peach wrote:

Just dont. Listen to your gut.
And dont worry now for then. Daven to hashem for a solution.

There are ppl workimg to have the religious exemption ban repealed in NY. You dont know anything about the future

Her gut says she’s worried about schools. Can she listen to that or does she have to listen to your nonsense? Our religion does not teach to avoid vaccination. Anyone who claims that is of another religion or just brainwashed. Which one are you?

amother

Tanzanite

Mon, May 06 2024, 9:58 pm

amother Melon wrote:

The point is that anti-vaccination is not a belief of Judaism and so using religious exemption is a bastardization of Judaism.

It is not different than when an exemption to the Draft in the US on religious grounds was limited to certain religions like Quaker or forms of Buddhism in which it is a core belief of that religion and was not allowed by people who claimed that they had a vague "religious" belief in Pacifism.

Polygamy is illegal even though the Mormons claimed it was a valid exercise of their religion.

FWIW, the level of review for theoretical violations of the Bill of Rights is "strict scrutiny' - the government must have a compelling justification and not just a "good" reason.

amother

Powderblue

Mon, May 06 2024, 10:25 pm

amother Tanzanite wrote:

This is not strictly accurate.

While there is no canonical stand on vaccinating in Judaism (neither for nor against) it is very much in the purview of practice of religion.

There is no mitzvah in the Torah "thou shalt not smoke," but many Rabbonim do forbid it on halachic grounds.

That's because there is a clear mitzvah of guarding one's health, and many Rabbis interpret this to make smoking a Torah-proscribed activity. (Do bear in mind that many others do not.)

While vaccinating may be appropriate for part of the population, there are others for whom it would be a serious question of harming health unnecessarily. For the latter category, it may indeed violate "Venishmartem."

That's because this is not a one-size-fits-all mitzvah; a diabetic may be forbidden Al Pi Torah from eating hamentashen but that doesn't make sugar asur for all.

Even with the herd immunity argument (which only is relevant in a small subset of vaccines; most do not prevent transmission), there are criteria which would need to be valid in order to make it compulsory for an individual to take a health risk to themselves on behalf of the community.

(Torah does not allow us to compel a person to donate a kidney, even if the person will die without it and both will almost certainly live with the transplant. There are times when the Rabim supersede the Yachid, but it is not that simple.)

If a Jewish person feels that vaccinating poses an unnecessary risk to their health, there is valid reason to say that they feel it is against their religious beliefs (Venishmartem) to do so.

While I understand that many would love for vaccination to be a mandate of Judaism, the burden of proof is on them. In the meantime, we are left only with an exhortation to guard one's health, which for many means avoiding vaccines, and yes - on religious grounds.

amother

Red

Mon, May 06 2024, 10:31 pm

amother Powderblue wrote:

But then that would be a medical exemption not religious but of course you wont find a mainstream doctor to sign off on something bogus. Hence not part of our religion.

amother

Powderblue

Mon, May 06 2024, 10:41 pm

amother Red wrote:

But then that would be a medical exemption not religious but of course you wont find a mainstream doctor to sign off on something bogus. Hence not part of our religion.

Judaism does not state that medical care is strictly under the auspices of mainstream doctors. Many askanim and medical referral organizations are staffed by individuals with no formal training, and many Rabbis avail themselves of alternative medicine.

Venishmartem is still applicable, even if your local pediatrician will not give any exemptions.

(I will also object to your use of the term "bogus." On what grounds are you making that claim?)

Ema of 5

Mon, May 06 2024, 10:43 pm

amother Red wrote:

But then that would be a medical exemption not religious but of course you wont find a mainstream doctor to sign off on something bogus. Hence not part of our religion.

No a medical exemption can only be gotten if there is a KNOWN risk. Many people feel that the risks that vaccines pose, and the risk of injury, is greater than the protection the vaccines offer, therefore NOT vaccinating would fall under the mitzvah of “v’nishmartem meod…”

amother

Seashell

Tue, May 07 2024, 12:13 am

amother Melon wrote:

...
You have a responsibility as a parent to take care of the child that G-d gave YOU. That means doing whats best for them. Most parents don't stop vaxxinating because their kids were doing fine. Many times they had 1 or more vaccine injured children to prompt that, or a genetic predisposition in the family. Many of these kids are in fact immunocompromised, you might not be privy to that info.

I find this very fascinating actually... would a doctor be able to give you a medical exemption if other children in the family have had an adverse reaction? While I do vaccinate my children, I can understand the fear of vaccinating younger children after witnessing a bad reaction in am older sibling...

amother

Powderblue

Tue, May 07 2024, 12:19 am

amother Seashell wrote:

Often they cannot. Medical exemptions are very difficult in certain states. Even for an anaphylactic reaction, they may tell parents to give future shots in the hospital instead of avoiding vaccines.

Ema of 5

Tue, May 07 2024, 12:19 am

#BestBubby wrote:

I think schools will accept your child even if not completely " caught up" as long as the child had one of each vaccine

1 mmr, 1 dpt, 1 polio, etc.

So you could wait till a year before and give just one shot at each visit (which could really be 3 vaccines in one shot).

But check with the school to make sure.

Right, I think most schools (who care about vaccinating) will allow students in as long as you can prove that you are ACTIVELY getting them on schedule.

heidi

Tue, May 07 2024, 3:36 am

amother OP wrote:

He's a year old, hasn't been vaxxed since 2 months. I really don't want to get him shot up but don't know what will be with schools Crying

Excellent idea!
Please feel free to PM me for the parents names of 2 previously perfectly normal children who are in a permanent vegatative state, accompanied by full blown seizures every few hours. They were both unvaccinated and developed measles.
I'm sure they'll be happy to support and advise your anti vax stance.

I'm obviously kidding- I can't give out names due to confidentiality