HELP! step-sister having trouble with marraige lisc.

ora_43

Tue, Jul 15 2008, 7:54 am

I'm surprised the parents' get from the Rabbanut wasn't enough. That's exactly what dh used to prove that he's Jewish before our wedding, and it was fine.

I, OTOH, had to meet with the beit din, and in the end it took 9 weeks, we got our ketuba less than a week before the wedding.

I agree with what others here have said--the best thing is to stay calm as much as possible, and ask "what can we do to prove that she is Jewish? Would a letter from Rabbi X help?" etc. If they really won't accept what you have, there are organizations that help Jews in that situation (mostly Russian Jews) by hunting down distant relatives and pictures of headstones in Jewish cemeteries; hopefully it won't come to that though.

Marion

Wed, Jul 16 2008, 3:32 pm

The rabbanut seems to give everyone a hard time. Although they tell you to open your tik "not more than 3 months" before the wedding, they are frequently on strike and they won't even talk to you then. Then, they say to come back two weeks before, with a copy of the invitation and they'll do everything on the spot, no matter what.

That was NOT my experience. Not on the spot. DH was easy, as his parents were registered with the rabbanut. But I had to track down an "approved" Rav in chu"l during bein hazmanim (we got married 16 Av) to confirm that I'd been single in Canada (a year earlier), and DH was asked for a letter confirming he'd been single when he arrived in Israel...14 years earlier! And the Rav in charge of our tik must have gotten up on the wrong side of the bed that day because when we provided the letters he still insisted there was something missing.

miriamnechama

Tue, Jul 22 2008, 7:35 am

I had a very hard time... I was told then it is because ofa ll teh russian olim, that half are not even jewish taht tehy need to check out everything.

the rabanut sentme to the beis din where I needed 2 eidim.. one of my friends knew not a wordof hebrew so the dayanim decidedit was not good enough. notonly that my mom passedaway and no one knew where the kesuba was, we onlyhad a dutch marriage license that they thought was german... so the beis din sent a letter to the bais din in london.... only afterthat did they give me an ishur.

by then it was getting late, and I forgot to bring the rebetzen teh peteck that I had learnt teh laws of TH so thy wouldn't give me my kesuba... it get writtenout in teh rabanut.. well 3 days before teh chasuna tehy claimed that hey couldn't find my file.... by thenwith my foster father tehre I exploded and well eventually I got the kesuba.

oh and teh lisense?? well the funny thing is that on of teh men working there at that timelives in beitar.... where we had moved.. so he said to dh fter teh chasuna.. oh youlivein beitar.. I also live there, I'll bringitin to you.... though haven't seen him since. I asked himwhat do I do about teh paper from te hmikva that was signed... he said forget taht it's ok....

the rabanut are very tough cus they are dealing with all sorts.... my dil'd sll ernt to the badatz instead.

oh and now I need to go back to the rabaunit to get my license translated.... I hope theywon't giveme trouble with taht!!!

Marion

Tue, Sep 23 2008, 11:04 pm

shalhevet wrote:

Stepmum wrote:

She should be prepared for battle. I got to Israel a week before my wedding. I wasn't planning on getting married there civilly, just halachically, but you can't do one without the other. We each had letters from our Rabbis confirming our Jewish status, that was enough for me, but cause my husband's father is a convert, they needed alot more from him (certificate of conversion and Kesuba). I dont know why it mattered - it's the mother that counts...

They also didn't know the Rabbi who vouched for my husband, so we needed to get someone to vouch for the Rabbi!

I think basically, it was a power struggle. The Rabbi seemed annoyed that we'd showed up a week before the wedding, thought we were pompous foreigners, and was determined to make this as hard as possible. As soon as we made him feel like we needed him, and he could 'save the day', he changed tunes.

All in all, it took a LOT of trips to the Rabbanut, and calls and faxes, to make it work.

Good Luck!

Look I don't know the whole story and how you or other people behaved.

But I still find your post offensive. If you had needed a passport somewhere, would you just expect to get to the passport office and say I need to travel in a week and I just got here, and expect everyone to drop everything and say thank you?

If you would have checked before hand you would have known that the paperwork takes several weeks, even for those who are not pompous foreigners, and that as soon as something is a bit more complicated (gittin, parents' divorce, conversion etc) it is going to take longer.

I am not a great fan of the rabbinate, but I find this thread very unfair. People feel justified in moaning that they were checked out to ensure their Jewishness. Well, legally and halachically they need to be sure you are Jewish. So sometimes it does take a while, and yes, that is more important than booking the hall.

There was nothing offensive in the post. I LIVE here and only opened a tik 10 days before. Not because I was lazy, but because they were on STRIKE when we went the first time and they told us "come back 10 days before the wedding and we'll do it on the spot". So we did.

"On the spot" turned into a power struggle. They wanted a letter from DH's high school rebbe that he was single when he left the school (13 years earlier!). They wanted a letter from my rabbi in Canada that I was single when they knew me (3 years earlier). It was bein hazmanim and it was NOT easy to get hold of either of these people. And when we finally did and we brought the letters the "dayan" had the chutzpah to lie to my face and tell me that we brought the wrong things and he threatened to tear up the tik and make us start again. Even though the menahel had already signed off and authorized it WITHOUT SEEING THE REQUESTED PAPERWORK! This was 5 days before the wedding.

baba

Wed, Sep 24 2008, 3:46 am

I dont know if this still aplies once you've already gone to the rabbanut, but I found it really matters where you go. I've had friends went to Jerusalem, or other big cities and had to spend many hours sorting things out. We went to the rabbanut in a small city/yeshuv and it took us about 15-20 min with the rabbi (and over half of it was talking bout unrelated stuff). I only had my parent ketubba, but he said that wasnt enough, cause I didnt have proof I was my parents child. So we faxed a letter from a rav, and that was that. Never went back and it was all sorted out.
I've heard from many people it was much easier to go to smaller places! But again, I dont know if this helps, since she already opened up a tik somewhere else.

catonmylap

Wed, Sep 24 2008, 3:59 am

baba wrote:

We did that do. But they still made us both go through proving we were single in the J-M Rabbinical court, but it was pretty easy overall.

baba

Wed, Sep 24 2008, 4:38 am

catonmylap wrote:

baba wrote:

We did that do. But they still made us both go through proving we were single in the J-M Rabbinical court, but it was pretty easy overall.

Really? I guess maybe we just lucked out. Dh is in the yeshive in the same place, which they ended up discussing most of the time. He just assumed everything was ok with us (he literally said so) and that was that.

Ruchel

Wed, Sep 24 2008, 8:16 am

Ima2Netanel wrote:

my step sister, and Israeli citizen etc is having trouble getting the rabanut to give her a marriage lisc because she doesnt have 'proof' she is Jewish. Any advice?

The funny thing, she is literally the 'poster child' for the Jewish child. She was the little girl in the famous poster of the little Israeli girl and Ethiopian boy sitting in front of the AHAVA monument!

Write to the rabbinate of her birth country/origin country and ask them to send either ketuba of parents, maternal grandparents... or just a certificate of Judaism. You'll probably need 1 or 2 witnesses saying they knew the parents/mother/maternal grandmother was Jewish, and that's it.

Ruchel

Wed, Sep 24 2008, 8:23 am

Marion wrote:

ditto.

And we had to go twice in Israel for that! not everyone can afford.
And dh brought his cousin who is a rabbi and it's only because of him that we had the papers done. The guy was saying he was finished for that day - except the wedding was 2 days after! The cousin told him to do his job and he would drive him where he wants to go after (the bank or whatever). And it happened that way. Incredible.

And if you don't talk Hebrew... oy va voy! they'll ask you tons of questions about why you don't, etc.

And their so called th course??? what the??? it's just a waste of time, BH I got mine in France!