praying at the gym

chocolate moose

Sun, Jun 18 2006, 5:50 pm

crayon I don't think so...saying a brcha is not the same as davening.

naked or no.

Crayon210

Sun, Jun 18 2006, 5:54 pm

People DO daven in the mikvah. Saying the yehi ratzon is davening.

And besides...saying a bracha IS davening, so it doesn't make sense that the halachos of brachos would be different than the halachos of tefila.

chocolate moose

Sun, Jun 18 2006, 6:38 pm

crayon, ask your rov. I have been tomany shiurim that say a girl/lady must be fully dressed to daven.

daveningis not saying a bracha.

Crayon210

Sun, Jun 18 2006, 6:39 pm

What's the difference between davening and saying a bracha?

Also, what's appropriate and what's technical halacha are not always the same thing. A man can also technically daven with very little clothes on, but practically, this is not done.

shalhevet

Sun, Jun 18 2006, 6:45 pm

Crayon210 wrote:

And besides...saying a bracha IS davening, so it doesn't make sense that the halachos of brachos would be different than the halachos of tefila.

No, it's not. For davenning you have to be properly dressed, preferably in the clothes you would wear to go outside.
For a bracha you don't.
Otherwise you wouldn't be able to eat an apple on the beach.
(There are sources - Mishna Brura and Halichos Bas Yisrael, but maybe someone else can dig them up...)

shalhevet

Sun, Jun 18 2006, 6:48 pm

For saying a bracha a woman has to have her erva covered and have something between her heart and her erva. For a woman sitting down is considered such a division. If she is standing up or lying down she must have a division (the elastic on your underwear is enough)

Halichos Bas Yisrael Chap 4, halacha 7

Last edited by shalhevet on Sun, Jun 18 2006, 6:51 pm; edited 1 time in total

Inspired

Sun, Jun 18 2006, 6:49 pm

SaraG wrote:

crayon, ask your rov. I have been tomany shiurim that say a girl/lady must be fully dressed to daven.

daveningis not saying a bracha.

So if you are in the hospital or confined to bed or don't own clothes you CANNOT daven? come on. Somethiongs are assur, some things are not advised and some things it depends on the situation.
A woman is allowed to say certain parts of davening naked. If sitting down. But that is really besides the point, that was an extreme example I used to show the discepency between what is *allowed* lehalacha and what is deemed appropriate. Is it appropriate to use an ayin rah to look at somone who saying tehillim?? NO. And that was my point.

Inspired

Sun, Jun 18 2006, 6:51 pm

mummyof6 wrote:

A woman does not *need* a division. We are makpid to make one anyway- the reason we cross our arms at the mikvah, which does not work for a man, btw, because for woman it is a strigency for men it is a requirement.

Crayon210

Sun, Jun 18 2006, 6:56 pm

That's fine for you, but no one here knows you, the person who gave the shiur, what s/he said, and how you interpreted it.

Inspired

Sun, Jun 18 2006, 7:01 pm

Crayon210 wrote:

That's fine for you, but no one here knows you, the person who gave the shiur, what s/he said, and how you interpreted it.

Exactly. If you want to say something like that and want to argue with people, bring sources.

shalhevet

Sun, Jun 18 2006, 7:02 pm

Inspired wrote:

Crayon210 wrote:

That's fine for you, but no one here knows you, the person who gave the shiur, what s/he said, and how you interpreted it.

Exactly. If you want to say something like that and want to argue with people, bring sources.

So, where's your source, Inspired?

Inspired

Sun, Jun 18 2006, 7:09 pm

mummyof6 wrote:

Inspired wrote:

Crayon210 wrote:

That's fine for you, but no one here knows you, the person who gave the shiur, what s/he said, and how you interpreted it.

Exactly. If you want to say something like that and want to argue with people, bring sources.

So, where's your source, Inspired?

Of what?
I wasn't arguing with anyone when I first mentioned a woman can daven naked. But I'll get you the source in a sec.

shalhevet

Sun, Jun 18 2006, 7:10 pm

Inspired wrote:

for this?

Inspired

Sun, Jun 18 2006, 7:12 pm

Remah, orach chayim 75. MB says only if she is sitting. (Since a woman's ervah is covered when she sits).

The seperation thing can be found in SA OC 75:4

Do you want a lionk or a scan of the above?

Inspired

Sun, Jun 18 2006, 7:13 pm

mummyof6 wrote:

Inspired wrote:

for this?

SA OC 75:4

dleah

Sun, Jun 18 2006, 8:23 pm

Quote:

Yes, you are wrong. Jewish people don't think they are holy, they are holy. The urge to do/think/speak something else during the time they have - to their credit-set aside for davening (witness the fact that they are in shul) comes from the "left ventricle of the heart" the seat of the yetzer hora, and drives of the animal soul.

sarayehudis, just to clarify, I copied and pasted the original poster's post and changed gym to synagogue and exercise to gossiping. Just trying to make a point that was clearly lost on most pple. Your comment to my post should have been made to the original poster.

Sparkle

Mon, Jun 19 2006, 12:10 am

[quote]
sarayehudis, just to clarify, I copied and pasted the original poster's post and changed gym to synagogue and exercise to gossiping. Just trying to make a point that was clearly lost on most pple. Your comment to my post should have been made to the original poster.

There is a difference: OP is speaking about raising the mundane - some would say that is appropriate and even admirable. Talking in shul is just the opposite - one is bringing down something that is intrinsically holy. I think there is a big difference and the comparison is not a good one.