Question for those who don't vaccinate

Hashem_Yaazor

Thu, May 13 2010, 1:21 pm

Inspired wrote:

MrsMom wrote:

Hashem_Yaazor wrote:

MrsMom wrote:

Vaccinations are not hurting anyone.

That's pretty ignorant.

enlighten me then.

Second hit on the google search "vaccine damage".
http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/Di.....26664

lmk if you need more

(You can mention there's also a database of adverse reactions to vaccines, http://wonder.cdc.gov/vaers.html -- from the government, not "conspiracy" theories or "quack scientists"....if the government needs to keep a database, it's because there ARE reactions. Sad

)

Cookies n Cream

Thu, May 13 2010, 1:21 pm

saw50st8 wrote:

Cookies n Cream wrote:

I have the same question as you.
All fine and dandy when people want "the very best" for their kids, and researched vaccines and decided it's not for them blah blah.., but please think about others.
Thanks to you my baby was exposed to the measles at age 2 weeks and my baby was exposed to the mumps.

The mupms outbreak included plenty of previously vaccinated kids.

If you don't want your kids exposed to any germs, keep them in hermetically sealed rooms in your own home.
And FTR, I vaccinate.

There's germs, and there's chicken pox, and there's meningitis.
I believe there is a difference between the three.

Hashem_Yaazor

Thu, May 13 2010, 1:23 pm

Cookies n Cream wrote:

saw50st8 wrote:

Cookies n Cream wrote:

The mupms outbreak included plenty of previously vaccinated kids.

If you don't want your kids exposed to any germs, keep them in hermetically sealed rooms in your own home.

And FTR, I vaccinate.

Correct, we were exposed to the mumps from people that WERE VACCINATED.
Basically meaning, that the fact that I vaccinate doesn't really help if many other people around me DON'T VACCINATE.

Please explain that logic to me.

You were exposed to the mumps from people that were vaccinated. Therefore, vaccination isn't a surefire way of making sure children will not get sick.
Where do people who aren't vaccinated come into play?

saw50st8

Thu, May 13 2010, 1:32 pm

Cookies n Cream wrote:

saw50st8 wrote:

Cookies n Cream wrote:

The mupms outbreak included plenty of previously vaccinated kids.

If you don't want your kids exposed to any germs, keep them in hermetically sealed rooms in your own home.
And FTR, I vaccinate.

There's germs, and there's chicken pox, and there's meningitis.
I believe there is a difference between the three.

If you keep your kids inside a hermetically sealed room they won't be exposed to anything. You'll be safe from every virus, bacteria and any other form of possible infestation.

And what HY said.

small bean

Thu, May 13 2010, 1:36 pm

this is so funny because my SIL who does not vaccinate (and wasn't vaccinated) recently got the mumps and her children are now in the waiting period. anyhow she doesn't believe that there's anything worng with me being around her kids - I'm afraid my kids will get mumps even though they are vaccinated (except my baby). she didn't even tell me when she invited me - I found out thru somone ele.

anyhow I do think that there is a large part of selfishness on ppl who don't vaccinate, very few ppl have real concern. I think it's a fad - I actually think NP is a fad. I know s/o who's son by the bris got whooping cough from s/o else's kid there - who didn't vaccinate... and the kid died....

when a child who isn't vaccinated get's polio - I want to hear what the parent who didn't vaccinate has to say.. .when they get mumps which all side effects are rare, it's usually not a big deal - that saying I know s/o who got mumps and was preg - and had a miss late on because of it....

Hashem_Yaazor

Thu, May 13 2010, 1:42 pm

Small bean, you think it's unfair for someone who refuses to give the MMR vaccine to their child who is severely allergic to egg and is rightly concerned about their child's life because of the chance that perhaps he will transmit one of those diseases, and someone else will get sick? Where are your limits in terms of who should/should not receive vaccination? How can YOU make that decision for someone else? I don't know anyone who doesn't vaccinate to be "trendy". Not one person. Only mothers who are concerned about the health of their children and have real concerns with the current regiment of vaccination.

Do you also make sure not to be in contact with someone who recently got a live virus vaccine and is shedding the virus?

dalia1

Thu, May 13 2010, 2:24 pm

While I admit I havent read all the responses I do have to say that I feel its very selfish of others to not vaccinate their children and expose other children.
I dont care if the symptoms of the illness are mild, I dont want my child to be sick...period. I know some things you cant prevent, but these diseases you CAN prevent.
Yes vaccines are not perfect...do I think that a child should have 6 shots at one time, no...do I think all kids should be vaccinated....YES because the potential harm from vaccines is much less that the harm from the actual disease.
However, at the end of the day, I cannot convince someone who wants to believe that ALL vaccines are harmful, to vaccinate...I can however make sure my child is up to date on his vaccines and limit their exposure to those who arent.

Hashem_Yaazor

Thu, May 13 2010, 2:27 pm

dalia1 wrote:

Sigh. Here we go again.

Quote:

Yes vaccines are not perfect...do I think that a child should have 6 shots at one time, no...do I think all kids should be vaccinated....YES because the potential harm from vaccines is much less that the harm from the actual disease.

You're lumping all vaccines together.
The first step in discussing vaccine risks and benefits intelligently is to evaluate each one individually.

amother

Thu, May 13 2010, 2:29 pm

Hashem_Yaazor wrote:

small bean wrote:

let me tell you - vaccines comes also in egg free - I have a neice who is severely allergic - and she gets vaccinated... there are ways to work around things - if you wanted your children to be vaccinated it can be worked out.

actually I don't know anyone who has a good personal reason why they don't vaccinate. and I know a bunch of ppl that don't vaccinate.

I guess you have never met someone with immuno-comprised symptoms. Or with previous reactions to vaccines who were told NOT to vaccinate.

OP here- HY, I have a friend with a son with SEVERE SEVERE allergies who cannot be vaccinated for those reasons. I totally understand and respect that. That is not who I was referring to people in my original post.

WriterMom

Thu, May 13 2010, 2:38 pm

small bean wrote:

when a child who isn't vaccinated get's polio - I want to hear what the parent who didn't vaccinate has to say.. .when they get mumps which all side effects are rare, it's usually not a big deal - that saying I know s/o who got mumps and was preg - and had a miss late on because of it....

Why is it so hard for so many people to discuss this rationally? The above is a prime example of hystrionic and illogical argument, not to single you out unduly, small bean.

If I wanted to be equally alarmist and unhelpful, I'd reply:
"When a child who's vaccinated goes into convulsions and develops a high fever as a resuilt, I want to hear what the parents who vaccinated has to say ... when they get the shots all side effects are rare it's not usually a big deal, that saying I know s/o who got a vaccination and died because of it .....

There are differences between all vaccines when it comes to risk, efficiency, and the likelihood of contracting the virus, and then of suffering harm, whether or not one has had the immunization. Serious discussion must take this into account. I also find it profoundly alarming how seldom people in this discussion address the philosophical and human rights implications of requiring vaccination; I guess the upside is most of the frothing at the mouth types are highly unlikely to contribute to the public discourse, for a number of cultural, demographic and educational reasons.

amother

Thu, May 13 2010, 2:54 pm

WriterMom wrote:

small bean wrote:

OP here, my attempt was to discuss this rationally. I don't consider myself a "frothing at the mouth" type and I do not usually contribute to the public discourse regarding vaccinations because I live in the US and I agree that they should be required. I have also lived and traveled in 3rd world countries, so I have seen the reality of some of these diseases for myself. I have a degree in Biological Anthropology which I believe also gives me extra education on this topic.

amother

Thu, May 13 2010, 3:11 pm

I used to work at a prominent medical center in a prominent frum community where many parents did not vaccinate. I never heard one parent give a good reason for not vaccinating, but I have heard some very stupid reasons like "well, my other kids got sick from the shot so why should I give them shots if they are gonna get sick anyways". I truly think its become like the "in" thing not to vaccinate your kids especially among certain frum circles (I'm not stereotyping, I saw this firsthand) so people just go along not realizing how stupid and dangerous their decision to not vaccinate is. If your child has no vaccines they are not protected from things that literally used to kill children. The reason you don't hear about it so much anymore is thanx to us parents who DO vaccinate our children and therefore protect YOUR children from horrible sicknesses that could KILL your child. People who do not vaccinate do not protect your child and therefore endanger our children who are vaccinated (because as we know vaccines are not 100% perfect).

Bottom line is that its a free country so you can choose whether or not to vaccinate. But just please I beg you be educated about it. Don't make these stupid choices just becuase "everyone else is doing it". Do you TRULY realize what risk you are taking by not vaccinating? And yes, of course there is always one kid out there who had some serious complications from vaccines but does that compare to a society where its normal for children to contract serious fatal illnesses constantly and possibly die from them on a regular basis?? Its the lesser of two evils people....!!! I mean seriously!!

Fabulous

Thu, May 13 2010, 6:27 pm

amother wrote:

I don't have any first hand experience, this is just what I have heard from "around" but I really agree with this poster. I have seen from this site that there are many mothers like HY and Inspired etc... that don't vaccinate because of a lot of research and a decision that's right for their children. I can respect that even if I don't agree with it. What I can't respect is how many stories I hear about women who choose not to vaccinate for above named reasons. "I'm afraid it could cause autism because I have a friend whose son is autistic and he started acting that way after his vaccines" yes, could be true but autistic tendencies usually show around that age regardless of vaccination. If after a lot of real research and discussion with a medical professional, a decision is made because of extenuating circumstances, that's one thing.

Just my two cents, from a pro vaxxer. (my father had something that makes his life much harder till today that can be prevented with a vaccine because they did not have it back then and I know that's just as anecdotal as the autism idea but that's how I feel, in addition to the fact that I have not read a single article linking things like autism to vaccines that was not discredited later).