Spinoff of: Is cleaning help a luxury?

Grandmama

Wed, Aug 25 2010, 9:32 pm

I know people, that do not own their own home, and cry poverty, yet they go to a hotel every month for two or three days. Its a cheap hotel, its nearby, and costs them maybe $200. They do not consider it a luxury.
They consider it a necessity to preserve their wonderful marriages. They live in small apartments, with lots of kids, and I guess this preserves their sanity. I know lots of people that go on vacations while owing other people lots of money. I know of some people that never take a vacation, they feel that their life is so wonderful as is, they do not need a vacation. Cleaning help? I do not think I personally know of one person in the USA that does not take cleaning help, from the poorest of the poor, the cleaning lady has to come at least once a week, or at least for the few months before Pesach once a week.
Cleaning help is not a luxury, it is cheaper than therapy.

Simple1

Wed, Aug 25 2010, 9:35 pm

I generally don't go on vacation, I almost never go away for Yom Tov or Shabbos or for Simchas like others do. But I still think it's not really a luxury, because I keep on thinking that if I go, I would function much better, similar to shutting down a computer when it's acting wacky.

If you want to go with your dh, there are cheaper things you can do like find a hotel on price line and go 2-3 hours away for one night -assuming you can place your kids. We have nowhere to leave our kids, so we do a one-night trip with them, it's not that much of a vacation, but good quality family time.

life'sgreat

Wed, Aug 25 2010, 10:11 pm

Grandmama wrote:

Every MONTH shock

? Month? 200? Wow. You've got be filthy rich to be able to swing 200 bucks a month for vacation. I also don't think it is in any way a necessity.

saw50st8

Wed, Aug 25 2010, 10:13 pm

Grandmama wrote:

I live in the US and don't have cleaning help. My mother was a single parent, working full time and did not have cleaning help. My sister is a SAHM in NJ and does not have cleaning help.

In fact, I know plenty of people that don't.

Grandmama

Wed, Aug 25 2010, 11:48 pm

I totally agree with you LG but apparently these people don't.
There are some people that live life according to their whims, not according to their reality.

As far as cleaning help goes, I do not know where those people live, but where I live (Brooklyn) NOT having cleaning help is almost unheard of. Some have more and some have less, but everyone has some.
Whether they are SAHM or working women it makes no difference. The SAHM need it even more so that they can have more time and energy to take care of their families. I know people that bake and cook everything from scratch, scrimp and save on almost everything else, but the cleaning help is not negotiable.

life'sgreat

Thu, Aug 26 2010, 12:56 am

Grandmama wrote:

They're insane for doing the 200 a month vaca instead of a grand vacation once a year. That'd add up to what? $2400? That can get them a great vacation for a week to ten days.

I don't have a cleaning lady and I'm far from the only one that doesn't.

Grandmama

Thu, Aug 26 2010, 1:00 am

life'sgreat wrote:

Grandmama wrote:

If you took a survey of everyone you knew that has a few kids, or more than a few, how many really clean their own homes? How many people do you know that never take cleaning help?
Maybe you know of some, I don't know of any.
I am thinking of the hundreds of people I know, and they all have at least a few hours of cleaning help when they can get it. Not everyone can get away once a year, some people cannot leave their work more than two or three days at a time. Its easier to find $200 every month, than to put away $2400. These people will take the $200 and spend it, because if they knew how to save $2400 they would be owning their own homes by now.

ILOVELIFE

Thu, Aug 26 2010, 2:18 am

I wouldn't say that vacation is in my budget and yet, there were times that we needed one desperately and we took it for as reasonable as we could do. We did an AWESOME Niagara trip in the winter where we flew there for I think it was $150 in total for the two of us, got hotel right by the falls for $49 a night and we didn't rent a car since we were right near all the attractions. Because it was off season, we paid practically nothing in admissions. In total, I remember we spent something like $500 on 3 days 4 nights. It was just what we needed.

Another time, I did a home-based vacation. I sent kids away, got take-out (better kind) and we went on a $25 boat ride. It was a great re-charge for a day.

Yes, some ppl indulge but many like me who are not making it financially and kill themselves working still feel that sometimes the investment of a decent vacation even if on a lo-budget is of utmost importance to function. I know that I can reach a point of crashing from various stresses in my life and I don't want to get there. A vacation is my investment. I can go a good cpl of years without one and then need one sometimes twice in a certain year. I don't have a 'planned' vacation time but yes, if I need one for legit reasons, I go regardless of money situation.

Oh and horribly enough-- I do have cleaning help. I HATE cleaning for the most part and it was giving my shalom bayis grief sometimes (mostly cuz I couldn't tolerate that I was a lousy homemaker) and my cleaning lady is my life-saver. Y'know what? I really shouldn't have her cuz I can't afford her but to me, NOTHING IS MORE IMPORTANT THAN HAVING A HAPPY AND STABLE HOME and I'll do what it takes....

Liba

Thu, Aug 26 2010, 6:47 am

I think that is the point, *if* you have the money and it will provide shalom bayis, allow you to work, or keep social services from taking your children cleaning help isn't a luxury.

There are plenty of necessities that very poor people don't have because they can't afford them. Just because destitute people don't have toilets that work because they can't pay for a plumber when it breaks, water because they didn't pay the bill for too long, gas to cook with, or electricity that doesn't mean they are luxuries. You may or may not die from being without any of the above.

Just because some people can survive without heat doesn't make it any less of a necessity for the person who would otherwise freeze to death in the winter.

We don't have a car since we have good public transportation and it would be a luxury but when we lived in the suburbs of a major city with no real bus system we had a car to commute to work. That was not a luxury. No car would have meant no school, no work and no groceries.

Mirabelle

Thu, Aug 26 2010, 7:00 am

We do both, have cleaning help and go on vacations...if we can afford it, depending on the year. We both work full time, aren't on any sort of gov't aide and don't get tuition cuts....

But we did work hard to get to this place, both of us have graduate level degrees and have advanced in our careers over the years.

rosehill

Thu, Aug 26 2010, 8:16 am

Some people who travel alot at their employer's expense, are allowed to keep the miles they accrue for their own personal use.
For years, we put EVERYTHING we possibly can on the credit card (and pay it off in full each month, of course), and accrue miles that way. We use that to pay for airline tickets to visit my family who live far away, but you could also use them for hotels, rental cars etc.
I know of several grandparents who pay for their grandchildren's "First trip to Disney", or a Pesach getaway.

If somebody earns their money legally, they can spend it however they want. The subtext here, is if somebody owes you money, or is taking tuition assistance, and indulging in apparent luxuries-such as a vacation or a cleaning lady-how should that be handled?

Grandmama

Thu, Aug 26 2010, 9:15 am

shalhevet wrote:

Grandmama wrote:

Cleaning help is not a luxury, it is cheaper than therapy.

Oh, of course. Everyone who doesn't have cleaning help goes to therapy.

Washing your floors can cause a normal healthy person a nervous breakdown you know.

What I meant was that if the house is a mess, and the mother cannot function normally, and the children are suffering because of it, sometimes with long lasting effects, then cleaning help is the least of the expense.
There are people that manage to clean up for and after themselves and their families, while still being patient and calm. Others cannot handle both the children and the cleaning, and whatever else they are facing in their lives. If the mother is calm, the household runs smoothly.

Grandmama

Thu, Aug 26 2010, 9:21 am

Inspired wrote:

Grandmama wrote:

Inspired wrote:

I have never been on vacation. I also don't have cleaning help.

Why?

Don't have the money. Did you really think there was some other reason?

I know of many people that do not go on vacation because they do not feel the need.
They may have the money, but are happy in their own homes.
They do not take cleaning help because they enjoy cleaning their own messes.
(they also consider it like exercise, and why pay for a gym when you can wash floors/toilets)

chica

Thu, Aug 26 2010, 9:37 am

We go on vacations and don't have cleaning help (or any other help for that matter!)
I'm sure people look at me and say that I'm cheap when it comes to so and so, that I live in a small apartment etc.
But right now it's something that we enjoy. Right now my kids are young enough to not be in school, expenses are low and we're happy renting someone else's basement.

But I believe everyone has their thing they like to spend money on, and if they have that extra cash they can choose how they want to spend it. We choose to be frugal and then save up and go on a nice vacation once in a while. (Once every two years about....) But those are our values, I would trade cleaning help for a week away from cooking and cleaning, but that may change in the future, and I certainly don't judge people who think the other way around!