Kiddush Levana - why not for women?

Motek

Fri, Aug 11 2006, 6:23 pm

Anybody ever say Kiddush Levana?

Probably not, as it's not something that women say.

How come?

We can shake a lulav, sit in a succa, daven three times a day, go to shul - although we are not obligated to, but not kiddush levana. Why?

ButterflyGarden

Sat, Aug 12 2006, 3:26 pm

No one to my knowledge said women CANT say kiddush levana. It's exactly like Sukka, Lulav, etc. Please correct me if I'm wrong.

chocolate moose

Sat, Aug 12 2006, 9:02 pm

You can't say it by yourself, thoughl. If a woman wants to do it, she needs a partner to say it eith.

rosehill

Sat, Aug 12 2006, 11:34 pm

I believe women are NOT SUPPOSED to say Kiddush Levana. It has something to do with the Pgam in the moon etc. The Shlah Hakadosh talks about it, but I don't remember exactly the details.

Motek

Sun, Aug 13 2006, 12:07 pm

mali wrote:

Sounds like a Mitzvas Asei Shehazman Grama

do you participate or light the Chanuka menorah? hear the megilla on Purim? drink 4 cups of wine at the seder? they are rabbinic mitzvos asei she'ha'zman grama too which women do

here's one answer I found (google):

Quote:

Even though there are several time-bound mitzvos that women have, over the generations, accepted upon themselves, Rabbi Yosef Chaim Sonnenfeld (Salmas Chaim 1-259) explains that women traditionally do not publicly congregate outdoors, hence women have not taken this mitzvah upon themselves.

mali

Sun, Aug 13 2006, 5:13 pm

Motek wrote:

mali wrote:

Sounds like a Mitzvas Asei Shehazman Grama

do you participate or light the Chanuka menorah? hear the megilla on Purim? drink 4 cups of wine at the seder? they are rabbinic mitzvos asei she'ha'zman grama too which women do

The particular examples you listed, are a Chiyuv for women because we were part of the Nes.

Motek

Sun, Aug 13 2006, 6:48 pm

I heard of that reason specifically for Chanuka. True for 4 cups of wine?! (don't remember about megilla)

realeez

Sun, Aug 13 2006, 7:44 pm

Motek wrote:

(don't remember about megilla)

Women are obligated in the mitzvos of Purim b/c Esther, a woman, had a main part in it.

I remember learning something about women and specifically not doing kiddush levana but that's all I remember. Gotta rack my brains to recall that one!

flippinout

Sun, Aug 13 2006, 7:46 pm

Motek, you are not obligated to daven three times a day - if you can, thats great, you are not mechuyav to go to shul and you dont need to sit in a succah..............

Motek

Sun, Aug 13 2006, 8:56 pm

flippinout wrote:

Motek, you are not obligated to daven three times a day - if you can, thats great, you are not mechuyav to go to shul and you dont need to sit in a succah..............

did you read my first post?

MOM222

Sun, Aug 13 2006, 9:18 pm

Motek , why pick on kiddush levana. You could say this about tefilin, davening with a minyon, becoming a rabbi....

happy2beme

Mon, Aug 14 2006, 1:56 pm

Quote:

thank u for teaching me something new! can we please start a lesson a day here? (on overall subjects)

Quote:

Motek , why pick on kiddush levana. You could say this about tefilin, davening with a minyon, becoming a rabbi....

The ones u mentioned seem more obvious then kiddush l'vana

shalhevet

Mon, Aug 14 2006, 2:10 pm

Motek wrote:

I heard of that reason specifically for Chanuka. True for 4 cups of wine?! (don't remember about megilla)

Of course! Weren't the women taken out of Egypt too? And didn't we get saved from Haman?

shalhevet

Mon, Aug 14 2006, 2:16 pm

MOM222 wrote:

Motek , why pick on kiddush levana. You could say this about tefilin, davening with a minyon, becoming a rabbi....

tefillin = man's clothing
There is also a problem about keeping your mind on them which is why whoever is not obligated with putting them on, doesn't. That is why a boy is given chinuch in all the mitzvas from a young age e.g. tzitzis, brachos etc, but he does not put on tefilin until close to his Bar-Mitzva. It is also why nearly all men today wear tefilin only for davenning, although, in theory they would have a mitzva to keep them on all day long.

davenning with a minyan= a woman can if she wants (assuming it doesn't interfere with other mitzvos)

becoming a rabbi= not tzniyus to lead a congregation

MOM222

Mon, Aug 14 2006, 3:15 pm

mummyof6 wrote:

davenning with a minyan= a woman can if she wants (assuming it doesn't interfere with other mitzvos)

A woman can not be part of minyan. Ever heard a woman filling in for a tenth?

shalhevet

Mon, Aug 14 2006, 3:18 pm

MOM222 wrote:

mummyof6 wrote:

davenning with a minyan= a woman can if she wants (assuming it doesn't interfere with other mitzvos)

A woman can not be part of minyan. Ever heard a woman filling in for a tenth?

The question here was davenning with a minyan, not being part of one.

She can't be part of one because she's not obligated with tefila b'tzibur (praying with the congregation)

shabbatiscoming

Wed, Aug 16 2006, 8:38 am

my sister always says kiddush levanan if she is at maariv and there is another female there.....

Motek

Thu, Aug 17 2006, 10:21 am

mummyof6 wrote:

Of course! Weren't the women taken out of Egypt too? And didn't we get saved from Haman?

Of course (and with all three holidays, women were the source of the miracle - Yehudis, Esther, "the nashim tzidkaniyos"), but I don't recall learning that that is the reason that women hear the megilla and drink 4 cups of wine. I would want to see a source for that being the reason.

mom222 wrote:

why pick on kiddush levana. You could say this about tefilin, davening with a minyon, becoming a rabbi....

tefillin - it's rare but women have worn tefillin, Rashi's daughters

davening with a minyan - as mummy wrote, women do that if they want to

becoming a rabbi - that's not a mitzva