Attn Seraph: Really? Spoiled Milk Pancakes????

sequoia

Sun, Dec 26 2010, 1:12 pm

mommalah wrote:

Don't forget kefir. A deliberately soured drink. And incredibly healthy.

All my grandparents drink kefir every day! I can't stand the stuff but maybe when you're old you like it automatically Smile

nylon

Sun, Dec 26 2010, 1:24 pm

OK - yes, raw milk will clabber rather than spoil. If you do it right. It's a chancy business. You don't just leave it on the counter and hope. You don't know what bacteria are floating around in the air. It's not true that it's impossible for bad bacteria to get in the milk. If it were, no one would ever get sick from raw milk, and every year, it happens.

Spoiled pasteurized milk should not be eaten, cooked or not. It's SPOILED. I don't get the Ami but I hope, Seraph, you weren't suggesting that gone-off pasteurized milk is safe because the bacteria have been killed in cooking. That's how your post reads. the issue isn't just "bad" vs "good" bacteria. Spoiled milk should not be used. Period.

Mama Bear

Sun, Dec 26 2010, 1:25 pm

never touched, tasted, nor planned to use buttermilk or kefir. I've never heard of 3/4 of the things Seraph uses in her meals Smile

.

Seraph this is just friendly banter, dont take what I'm saying personally. I'm impressed that Ami was willing to touch such an interesting and unusual topic.

I actually enjoyed Nissi Unger's article on Flea Market shopping right after your recipe. You wouldve loved that!

Mama Bear

Sun, Dec 26 2010, 1:34 pm

Nylon there's a difference between milk that has active clumps of cheese in it or milk that just tastes bitter/off. I just pour it down the sink when it starts tasting/smelling bad, I guess Seraph would then turn it into pancakes.

Seraph

Sun, Dec 26 2010, 1:36 pm

nylon wrote:

I have it on guarantree of a few doctors that spoiled milk is absolutely fine to use once cooked. If you want to know which bacteria it is in spoiled milk, its roughly the same ones that its sourdough starter. But these bacteria die at a very low temperature and are totally fine to ingest, and are actually pre-digested so they make the spoiled milk (once cooked) and grains (once cooked) much easier to digest. So they're actually healthier to use than using regular milk.

Nemo

Sun, Dec 26 2010, 1:59 pm

One summer about 4 bottles of milk spoiled in my house. We looked up every recipe possible to make. I call it the summer of the muffins because I made so many muffins. I also found an AMAZING cinnamon bun roll recipe as well. My family has always used spoiled milk in pancakes and whatnot so it would not go to waste.

Isramom8

Sun, Dec 26 2010, 2:43 pm

I just think this kind of tip should be reserved for situations where people seriously lack for food. It doesn't seem wise lechatchila. B"H we don't have to resort to this. If we would have to, we would, and hope to remain healthy. It's similar to saying that potato peels can be eaten because people lived on them in the Holocaust. But thank G-d we don't have to.

There is a difference between being wasteful and making a habit of eaing spoiled or possibly contaminated food. When I toss a cracked egg or food past its expiry date, I'm respecting my family and taking responsibility for their health. The food may not make them sick, but why take that chance? I'll still be able to afford a roof over their heads and a blanket for cold nights. I'm not forced to compromise on food safety. When I feel that my kid's leftovers shouldn't go to waste, but my kid has been sick, I make myself toss the leftovers. Don't look for trouble when you don't have to.

I'm not interested in hearing how spoiled milk can be safe. It's spoiled. Down the drain, zehu. Mold? Into the garbage, and wash your hands. Expired l;ast week? Go buy another can. That's not an aveira; it's a mitzva.

egam

Sun, Dec 26 2010, 2:43 pm

Seraph wrote:

egam, milk in the US and milk in Israel are homogenized and pasteurized. They spoil, not sour, and you don't want to be drinking that raw- it can make you sick. But once you cook them in pancakes or anything, the bacterias get killed and its fine to eat.

I tried to make pancakes from american milk that just started to go bad, and they were bitter and horrible! It never happened in Ukraine. And milk there was pasteurized as well, don't know about homogenized.

nylon

Sun, Dec 26 2010, 2:54 pm

It's pasteurization that stops it from clabbering. You need to reculture the milk, the way you do for commercial buttermilk, to get it to sour and thicken rather than spoil. I use commercial buttermilk all the time.

Seraph, I know which bacteria are in raw milk. I'll say it straight: I think it's disgusting to use spoiled milk. I've seen what happens to milk when it spoils. The proteins coagulate into lumps and it is stinky, not pleasantly sour. Again, I use buttermilk, sour cream, and creme fraiche. I've made creme fraiche on my counter. I would never, ever use spoiled pasteurized milk.

Consumer Reports also says it's not safe:
http://blogs.consumerreports.o......html

If you want to be frugal, buy dried milk. It's cheaper than fresh and takes a year to spoil.

PinkFridge

Sun, Dec 26 2010, 3:00 pm

Chocoholic wrote:

I grew up with beer in pancakes, not spoiled milk

What about using old beer in pancakes? I have beer from last Purim. I have no idea if it's good or not. So the question is, do you have any recipes for spoiled beer pancakes?

nylon

Sun, Dec 26 2010, 3:02 pm

Beer can't spoil as such. It just goes flat and tasteless. There's no protein or fat so it can't spoil in the same way.

The bubbles in beer may contribute to a recipe, so it might flop, but it won't make you sick.

HindaRochel

Sun, Dec 26 2010, 3:08 pm

I think there is a difference between spoiled and sour, and I do think Seraph is talking soured not spoiled. Spoiled milk, whether raw or pasteurized, means that bacteria is growing and it is not good for you.

My FIL can't eat food that is moldy, so when preparing food for him I cannot use food that had mold on it even if I cut the mold out.

So mold does survive cooking, and you do have to take care. Oh and I agree about cracked eggs...out they go.

Seraph

Sun, Dec 26 2010, 3:16 pm

Isramom, if eating something isn't dangerous or unhealthy and can taste good, throwing it out is bal tashchis. Bottom line.

I honestly don't care what consumer reports says. I listen to the doctors I asked. They said its absolutely fine.

And I'm not talking about clumpy milk. I'm talking about milk that smells "off".

And btw, I do have powdered milk now. :-D

sky

Sun, Dec 26 2010, 3:20 pm

I "sour" milk for recipes when it calls for Buttermilk.
(I mix vinegar or lemon juice with milk and let it sit a few minutes before using) but I'd be afraid to use soured milk from the fridge. I wouldn't know the difference between that and spoiled.

Seraph

Sun, Dec 26 2010, 3:23 pm

sky wrote:

Lets put it this way. If its clumpy, toss it. If it just doesn't smell nice, you can use it.

Isramom8

Sun, Dec 26 2010, 3:25 pm

Well, you can come pick up all my spoiled food if you want it. Personally, if I wouldn't give it away, then I think it's at the point of being allowed to be tossed. Avoiding bal tashchis to me means trying to use what we have before it spoils.

I do reuse, such as by putting Wednesday night's leftover meatballs into the cholent. Last week I thought of Seraph, and scoured my fridge for leftover veggies to add to tomato paste for said meatballs! It was delicious. We had an unexpected guest, and I told him that he would not believe how many vitamins were in the tomato sauce.

So I do things like that, but only within a few days. Spoiled or moldy isn't for my family or my guests. If the animals at the dump feel they can handle it, then B"H who provides for all creatures.

egam

Sun, Dec 26 2010, 3:28 pm

PinkFridge wrote:

Chocoholic wrote:

I grew up with beer in pancakes, not spoiled milk

What about using old beer in pancakes? I have beer from last Purim. I have no idea if it's good or not. So the question is, do you have any recipes for spoiled beer pancakes?

Don't think it went bad, but I have a recipe for beer cookies if you want.