Do frum women get more help than non frum women?

amother

Fri, Jul 26 2013, 6:23 pm

This has always floored me but perhaps this is the way it is these days. Growing up and in my early 20s, while I was not frum, I didn't see anyone with regular household help unless they were very wealthy. Now I imagine when families get very large, it's really helpful to...have help, especially with a working mother! I only have 4 little kids right now and I'm a SAHM. So I have it "easy", imo. Carpool and errands aside, I'm around all day. It's easy to cook and clean as I go, even with 1-2 kids at home.

But since I've been frum, I've noticed that all the women around me have regular help for babysitting or cleaning, whether they have extra money laying around or not. It's just a given. And they don't all have large families either, some of these women are so young!

Is there really just a different mindset between the two worlds? People look at me like I'm crazy or trying to be superwoman...but really, my attitude is more like, this is my "job." The heavy duty cleaning really does take a long time, which I'd rather spend with my husband at night, so I hire someone twice a month. But weekly babysitting, twice a week cleaning....it's just so eye opening that young moms want/need this. Yet no one in my middle class neighborhood used to have this.

Anonymous because I seem to be to only one who feels like some women are kind of spoiled!

causemommysaid

Fri, Jul 26 2013, 6:32 pm

amother wrote:

Anonymous because I seem to be to only one who feels like some women are kind of spoiled!

I think you are being judgmental.

Some reasons frum women need more help:

1) much larger families

2) having families at a much younger age so much less established and mature

3) much harder lives in terms of Shabbos and yom tov

SplitPea

Fri, Jul 26 2013, 6:46 pm

I have wondered this as well. I grew up non frum and NO ONE had cleaning help. Even my catholic friends with 7-10 kids! Then again it might be where you came from. I know overseas and in South America even poor people get cleaning help. Maybe in Europe is was normal and became the standard? Also here cleaning help can be gotten for 10/hr. my mom tried to hire help last year in texas and it was 35/hr (and there the cost of living is much lower!) it might be partially the availability of help.

I do know few of my non Jewish friends have cleaning help but most have one max two kids decently spaced.

Oh well to each their own. I grew up without it. Can't afford it and NEED it. 3 under 3 and one autistic. Some day maybe...

flowerpower

Fri, Jul 26 2013, 6:51 pm

Yes, we frum families do have more cleaning help. The reasons are because we have larger families and more work to do. For example- we have shabbos and yom tov. There are more dishes, more cooking, more preparing and cleaning for shabbos.....

gold21

Fri, Jul 26 2013, 6:56 pm

We make more elaborate suppers (think hungarians!)
We make shabbos
We get married younger
We have larger families
Our kids spend more time indoors making a mess and less time at soccer practice, karate lessons, etc.
And why not get help! It's no sin!

groisamomma

Fri, Jul 26 2013, 6:57 pm

Nobody at work has household help besides the two wealthy women I know. The other teachers tease me whenever I complain about cleaning up toys and things or if I ever say anything about my cleaning lady not coming in casual conversation.

I actually did wonder, so maybe OP can answer this: Heavy cleaning you said the help does twice a month. What is heavy cleaning to you, the bathrooms, the floors? If so, that is not very often to clean a bathroom at all. Floors have to be washed more often than that. Windows? To me does not need to be done so often so twice a month is a lot.

What is considered heavy cleaning that you would get help for (as opposed to regular picking up)?

oliveoil

Fri, Jul 26 2013, 7:00 pm

groisamomma wrote:

I can't talk for the OP, but heavy cleaning typically means cleaning that requires moving furniture. So under and behind the fridge, beds, etc. I would also include cleaning the outside of windows and going along the baseboards of the house in "heavy cleaning" that only gets done every few weeks.

gold21

Fri, Jul 26 2013, 7:02 pm

Uh... what exactly is detrimental about it, oliveoil?

Why not bring women down some more. Enough that Kate middleton's post-baby body was criticized by the media, enough with all other ridiculous expectations and pressures placed on women (particularly moms)- now cleaning help is being criticized too?

Bringing women down some more. Lovely. I especially love how it's us women bringing ourselves down.

mummiedearest

Fri, Jul 26 2013, 7:12 pm

I will say that since I started having regular help (2 hours once a week), I've gotten VERY lazy. it has not been good for me in that respect. I do see where the op is coming from, and I don't think she's trying to tell anyone off. she's trying to understand the viewpoint. and it is VERY disheartening to hear people call you "superwoman" when you are just trying to do your best. it's meant as a compliment, but usually given with the "wow, you're nuts" look.

anyway, back to cleaning up...

Rubber Ducky

Fri, Jul 26 2013, 7:15 pm

When I was growing up in a secular upper-middle class neighborhood in Los Angeles in the 60's, many families had household help. My (not observant) aunts all had household help at least several times a week, and one had 2 kids and full-time help.

If a woman has the means to delegate some of the housework to paid help, and if it gives her more time to raise her children, that's a net plus.

blini

Fri, Jul 26 2013, 7:33 pm

I think the "less or more" really depends on who you ask. For example, in my job everyone is very wealthy and they look at you like you have two heads if you don't have home help. BUT in my community where I live, wealthy people mostly do their own housework and are very proud of being so thrifty. I would never judge either way. If you can afford it and it improves your quality of life, go for it and don't judge yourself for one minute. Life can be hard and if we can make it easier, why not? I don't think there's virtue in being miserable. Likewise if you have no responsibilities and live alone in one room on a pit of money and you want a housekeeper, I say: why not? You are creating employment!

saw50st8

Fri, Jul 26 2013, 7:44 pm

I do think frum women have more help. My non-Jewish friends rarely have help, even the ones with 5+ children.

I also think you are neglecting Saturday. For many people, saturday is chore day. 1/7 of our week is cut out of chores AND requires a lot of prep work.

My mother never had cleaning help and right now I don't. Its pretty expensive (here its about $12-13/hr). But my house is certainly not as clean!

I do wonder how people deal with cleaning help coming and then their kids making the same thing dirty an hour later. That;s not just my family right?

notshanarishona

Sat, Jul 27 2013, 1:42 pm

The sense of entitlement that cleaning help is a necessity is exaggerated I.e. families who are collecting tzedakah or asking for major tuition breaks when getting a weekly cleaning lady. Cleaning help is a luxury but frum women work very hard and if they can afford it, great.
I am happy for people who are able to make their lives a little easier and don't have to be superwomen.

Delores

Sat, Jul 27 2013, 2:44 pm

I can't answer your question OP but remember that different people have different priorities and different ways to spend their money. I personally prefer to use "extra money" on going out to eat and nice vacations (I don't have cleaning help). Yes, I can make good meals at home for much less but I work hard for my money and this is how I choose to spend it. I'm sure there are things you buy that others would do without. That's how money works.

Delores

Sat, Jul 27 2013, 2:49 pm

gold21 wrote:

Women are awesome. Frum moms work really hard and are so invested in their families. What's to criticize? So someone needs some cleaning help? And therefore...?

Dear Gold21,

Why are you getting so defensive? There doessn't seem to be criticism in OP's statement. If you hire someone to clean your house you are not doing anything wrong (as long as you're not stealing money to pay for it). Why do you feel like you are under attack??

Tablepoetry

Sat, Jul 27 2013, 2:50 pm

I really think it depends where you come from. IME it's not a frum vs not-frum issue. Even among non-Jews, having 'help' varies tremendously from country to country/social circle to social circle.

I was opposed to the whole idea when I first got married twenty long years ago. It seemed to me very weird to have a stranger sifting through your stuff. Just didn't grow up with 'help' as a concept.

Now.....I can't fathom what's wrong with having help. Almost everyone I know here in Israel who can afford it, has an ozeret come once a week. And most of these are secular women. If anything, some of the very charedi women I know davka don't have help because they can't afford it.

It's all a cost-benefit issue. It's worth it for me to hire someone to free my time up for other things.