How accepted is Rabbanut Mehadrin? (Yerushalayim)

amother

Sun, Dec 08 2013, 5:52 pm

MH says that about 10 years ago many frum American tourists (even chassidish but not ultra like Satmar) would eat at Rabbanut Mehadrin restaurants. My brother tells me it's no longer the case.

Does anyone know? Would love to hear experiences.

I guess we'd be labelled as frum, yeshivish, black hat types.

We will be staying in the Plaza hotel, I believe it's Rabbanut Mehadrin.

Is there a difference between eating milchig and fleishig?

I hope this question doesn't offend anyone... It's something we need to know.

Any comments and advice would be great.

amother

Sun, Dec 08 2013, 6:06 pm

amother wrote:

I can't really answer your post...but there is a big different between rabanut and mehadrin. there are lots of places that are rabanut but are not mehadrin - and there can be a big difference. rabbanut mehadrin is a different story and I personally, would be comfortable with it, but I am not sure what the larger consensus is.

OOTBubby

Sun, Dec 08 2013, 7:20 pm

We are typical American, yeshivish (though OOT) and very machmir when it comes to kashrus.

When we started visiting Israel regularly around 20 years ago, we ate Rabbanut Mehadrin (though to be honest, we didn't know a lot about it).

Over more recent times, as we've had quite a few children living there while in Kollel, we no longer do, based on the advice of the children, who always research it thoroughly. Based on the advise they receive, we only eat Badatz (they don't have real restaurants) and Rav Rubin. There might be some exceptions, but my kids investigate them on an individual basis.

We have been told that the Rabbanut Mehadrin restaurants are just as problematic or more so as the fleishig ones. A year or so ago, we visited at the same time as some other relatives (who eat regular Rabbanut) and wanted to take us out to eat for michigs and would not be satisfied with a bagel joint or pizza place, and wanted a nicer place. Fortunately, my DS was able to find an acceptable place to go, and a few of us made a note of it to keep in mind of future similar situations.

Again, this is what we do, based on information our children receive, and not on any first hand information.

amother

Sun, Dec 08 2013, 10:00 pm

You are correct Op, because it was just about 10 years ago when the whole rabbanut Mehadrin got all messed up.

It used to be a very strict hechsher but about 10 years ago I'm not sure exactly what happened but something along the lines of the leadership of the hechsher going into the hands of the government so they were the ones appointing the mashgichim. It became much more lax.

I was living there at that time and it was all pretty sudden and the whole yeshiva crowd was thrown for quite a loop when they suddenly were told by the Rabbanim and Roshei yeshivos to stop eating at Rabbanut Mehadrin places. And since then things have pretty much stayed the same and the yeshivish crowd living there generally does not eat at those places. Meat or dairy.
I dont' know what tourists do. Most probably are still remembering the good ol days when Rabanut Mehadrin was an excellent hechsher.

yogabird

Sun, Dec 08 2013, 10:26 pm

amother wrote:

Is it possible that the ''whatever happened 10 years ago that you're really not sure about'' was political in nature? Afaik, the dati leumi are still lamenting the fact that the rabbanut is controlled by chareidim, so I can't begin to imagine what these big changes could have been about...

amother

Sun, Dec 08 2013, 11:01 pm

yogabird wrote:

amother wrote:

As far as I know, it was actual kashrus issues that was the problem. My dh looked into it a lot and though I don't recall the details. I do know that the level of kashrus had been compromised due to the changes. There were specific issues that I knew of then but completely forgot by now.

amother

Mon, Dec 09 2013, 6:56 am

amother wrote:

yogabird wrote:

amother wrote:

Was the problem or is the problem?

Peanut2

Mon, Dec 09 2013, 7:22 am

amother wrote:

Just to make things very clear: rabbanut always means government related.
Anything rabbanut is also NoT run by secular people and NOT run by dati people. It's generally under very politicized charedi control.

If charedim don't eat rabbanut mehadrin then I really don't understand why charedim try to define what it is. My head wants to explode now.

Kashrut in general is very politics based. Very difficult to know what's going on.

Having said all that - from what I know about kashrut in Israel in general there is a big difference between dairy and meat.

SJcookie

Mon, Dec 09 2013, 8:30 am

amother wrote:

We're a yeshivish kollel couple and we eat Rabbanut Mehadrin.

We are also a "yeshivish kollel" couple, but we don't eat Rabbanut mehadrin.
OP, the best thing you can do is to ask your Rav. If he doesn't know, he may be able to direct you to a Rav who does know.

ally

Mon, Dec 09 2013, 8:42 am

Peanut2 wrote:

amother wrote:

This is the million dollar question

amother

Mon, Dec 09 2013, 9:41 am

I live oot and my husband is the rav. he is in charge of giving hechsherim. We are makpid on pas yisrael, chalav yisrael etc. So therefore we do not eat in most of the places my husband gives hechsherim to, since it would be almost impossible (and expensive) to make those places CY and PY. Since we want there to be kosher food available for everyone else, my husband does not insist on CY and PY.

So yes, he controls the kashrus, and no, he does not eat the food in some of the places with his hechsher. A Rabbanut Rav might be doing the same thing - allowing kulos for the general public that he personally would not allow for himself.

Ruchel

Mon, Dec 09 2013, 9:47 am

I definitely know of rabbanim who allow, say, chalav stam for their kehila/those of certain minhagim, but won't take it for themselves and their family.

I also know in some countries, if you give the teuda you have to eat there. Now, I suppose they could just not go anyway, but in principle.

Heyaaa

Mon, Dec 09 2013, 9:59 am

afaik rabanut mehadrin means (with regards to a restaurant) that there is a mashigiach on premises and that he checks the vegetables himself. plain rabanut means there is a mashgiach who comes by but it's not regulated that well.

We are a chassidic and dh learns in kollel if that means anything.
We eat chalav stam in the states. Here, for dairy, we eat rabanut mehadrin but not plain rabanut. Also, I think we don't eat rabanut mehadrin for meat, but it's possible we do. In any event, I don't buy it for him because it's easier to go without than to call him every time. We also eat yoreh deah (which I think is sephardic) because according to dhs research, the litvish won't eat it for political reasons and not because it makes sense halachically.

I assume when you say plaza you mean the leonardo. I ate there this winter and it had a large percentage of very frum people there and my friend (who is really makpid on hechshers) told me that it's a better hechsher than most of those hotels.

imasoftov

Mon, Dec 09 2013, 10:07 am

I'd say kashrut here in Israel is precisely like kashrut in America, there are different hechsherim, and there are lots of rumors floating around but little real information. In both Israel and the US (and everywhere else you might wind up), ask your own rabbi what hechsherim to accept, not the internet.

Shuly

Mon, Dec 09 2013, 11:35 am

There was a time where everyone yeshivish stopped eating Rabbanut Mehadrin. Now many still do not eat it, some eat it for milchigs only and some eat it for everything. So you really have to ask your own shaila.

I didn't personally research it, but the Plaza is known as being the hotel with the best hechsher so when asking the shaila, you should ask separately about the hotel.

amother

Tue, Dec 10 2013, 8:10 pm

SJcookie wrote:

amother wrote:

We're a yeshivish kollel couple and we eat Rabbanut Mehadrin.

We are also a "yeshivish kollel" couple, but we don't eat Rabbanut mehadrin.
OP, the best thing you can do is to ask your Rav. If he doesn't know, he may be able to direct you to a Rav who does know.

OP here.

My Rav is chassidish, and besides for that, he really wouldn't know about Israeli hechsherim apart from Eidah.