Discrimination question

singleagain

Wed, Aug 13 2014, 9:57 pm

sequoia wrote:

There are no men working in Victoria's Secret or Sephora, except for security guards.

Not sure about Sephora, but for Victoria Secret that is not true, here's one article about a guy who worked for VS http://www.businessinsider.com.....013-5

rdmom

Wed, Aug 13 2014, 9:59 pm

I work in a Hasidic community. In a women's clothing store. We don't sell anything for men. Guy called today looking for a job. Wanted to email his resume. I told him he got the wrong number. He was definitely Jewish. He said he was willing to do anything but preferably clerical work. I was really busy and couldn't find the phone number for our office. Didn't have the fax number or email address. That's when he lost it. Told me that if his family lost its house he would have no choice but to camp out if front of my store and live there. I am sure he just got our phone number off the phone book because we didn't advertise for any positions. He was probably just cold calling.
I nicely told him that I didn't know of any open positions in our company when he started cursing me out saying that he really hopes my family never has the feeling his does of having no money.

I felt bad. I really did. But what was I to do?

Just a note. Ladies would not try clothing in the store if there is a guy there for tzniut reasons.

Was I crazy?

marina

Wed, Aug 13 2014, 10:02 pm

rdmom wrote:

It sounds like you wouldn't hire him regardless of his gender, because he sounds mentally unwell.

momX4

Wed, Aug 13 2014, 10:03 pm

sequoia wrote:

There are no men working in Victoria's Secret or Sephora, except for security guards.

Not true. I walked into victoria secret about 8 years ago to buy a bra there. I asked the cashier for help and she directed me to the changing room and said someone will come shortly. A male employee showed up and asked if I would be more familiar with a female.

singleagain

Wed, Aug 13 2014, 10:03 pm

rdmom wrote:

just a guess... but if since you said you were not advertising for help, and he was cold-calling, then you are probably safe from lawsuits, since there really isn't a way to prove that he was turned down for a job based on his gender, since there was no job available.

as for what to do in a situation like that. ask yourself, if a woman would have called with the same story, would you have tried to make a job for her, or would you have also told her, sorry, we're not hiring now?

rdmom

Wed, Aug 13 2014, 10:28 pm

Thing is, he called the wrong place. I am only an employee in the retail store. Clerical work is done entirely elsewhere, no clue where. It was really busy and I could not provide him with fax number or an email address. Male or female, it is not me who hires. The reason I told him we sell women's clothing was because I was sure he called the wrong number. Why would a guy call a retail women's clothing store looking for a job?

I also didn't pick up the phone right away cuz I was busy ringing ppl out and trying to help a customer on the phone so I didn't pick up the click. So when I did pick up the second time he called he started the conversation with " I am sure you guys can hire me, even just to pick up phones, took you long enough to pick up the phone".

Weird. But I wish him lots of luck. He desperately needs a job and I was there a couple of months ago. But you have to be realistic. I would not expect a men's clothing store to hire me to help men with suits and underwear. Seriously.

leah233

Thu, Aug 14 2014, 10:28 am

I was once speaking, at a neutral event, to someone who was employed by a state government to ensure affirmative action is being complied with.I asked her about the accusations that a qualified white male could never get a clerical government job over a less qualified minority etc .She looked genuinely puzzled and said "Well isn't that what AA is supposed to accomplish"?

amother

Thu, Aug 14 2014, 10:31 am

leah233 wrote:

I was once speaking to someone who was employed by a state government to ensure affirmative action is being complied with, at a neutral event.I asked her about the accusations that a qualified white male could never get a clerical government job over a less qualified minority etc .She look genuinely puzzled and said "Well isn't that what AA is supposed to accomplish"?

FTR, I am close friends with one of the regional directors of the EEOC, and she would be horrified by that comment.

Barbara

Thu, Aug 14 2014, 10:39 am

I cannot give legal advice, but there are definitely circumstances in which one may choose one's employees based on gender. Google BFOQ, or bona fide occupational qualification.

Quote:

[I]t shall not be an unlawful employment practice for an employer to hire and employ employees, for an employment agency to classify, or refer for employment any individual, for a labor organization to classify its membership or to classify or refer for employment any individual, or for an employer, labor organization, or joint labor-management committee controlling apprenticeship or other training or retraining programs to admit or employ any individual in any such program, on the basis of his religion, relations, or national origin in those certain instances where religion, relations, or national origin is a bona fide occupational qualification reasonably necessary to the normal operation of that particular business or enterprise

So your mikvah can rest easy that it will not be sued for discrimination if it refuses to hire men to watch you toivel.

amother

Thu, Aug 14 2014, 11:24 am

I would say that is quite discriminatory. I have been to buy underwear and lingerie from shops and there are men working at the cash desks. It is quite embarrassing but that's just the way it is. It's just a job and you can't really bar a gender from having that job. If a customer feels uncomfortable, they could I suppose ask for a woman worker. But you can't stop a man getting the job because he is a man. I am a nurse, and where I work there are a few male nurses. Occasionally, you get the odd female patient who says they would prefer a female nurse, if only at times when more close proximity is involved. That is completely fine, and the male nurses have no problem with this whatsoever, but nonetheless they can't be barred from the job. At least I've never heard of this type of thing. There are laws and then there are ways to work around them to ensure everyone is comfortable.