Why do these 2 weeks exist???

amother

Sun, Aug 24 2014, 4:33 am

Maya wrote:

Quote:

I don't know. If you can't manage to entertain your kids for two weeks out of the year, maybe you should be rethinking your family planning. If you're a working mom and can't afford childcare for these inevitable vacations, apply the same as above.

It's not even about summer vacation and it's not a matter of affording. It's a matter of even finding child-care. Let me give you the run-down of my school's schedule, and you tell me how a family with two working parents is supposed to make this work. (I'm doing a running total after each non-chag/non-federal holiday that school is closed)

First day of school is a half-day. Not sure why, but it is. So that's a few hours at work, then a half-day off.
.5
Kindergarten and pre-school starts two days after the high-school, so girls who could babysit younger kids are all in school. Good luck finding a day care that will take your child for those two days. Ditto for erev chag and school breaks, when girls are either watching their younger siblings or helping to make yom tov or simply enjoying themselves. Women who babysit generally do not work when school is out, so that option is closed as well, because they are home with their own kids.
2.5
First day of pre-school is a half-day.
3
Erev Rosh Hashanah
4
Erev Yom Kippur
5
Sukkos vacation days that are not chag or chol hamoed--3
8
Chanukah Vacation 4 days
12
Midwinter break 4 days
16
Pesach vacation days that are not chag or chol hamoed- 2
18
The day before Erev Shavuos
19

So that's 19 days to find child care or take off, on top of chagim, and that is only during the school year, not any time before school starts or ends. Finding child care for these days is almost impossible, even if you are willing to pay good money. (See note above re babysitting availability on these days.)

My husband and I make approximately the same amount, and each month, one of our paychecks (we each get two checks a month), or 25% of our take-home pay, goes to the school. That would decrease dramatically if I quit my job so I didn't have to worry about finding child care for school days off, days kids are sick or need to go to the doctor, etc.

We are both fortunate to have the ability to work from home on occasion. I turned down a promotion at work because while it would have meant two weeks paid vacation (I currently do not get paid for any time off) and better benefits, I would have lost the ability to take off as needed (without pay) to care for my children. Of course, the problem is that even with turning down the promotion, there are times when work is very busy, and taking off or working from home isn't an option if I want to keep my job. I don't know many people who have work situations that are as conducive as ours are being frum and having children.

So for those people being dismissive and rude about the real challenges of frum parents who don't have the luxury of having a SAH parent, maybe you should reconsider your words.

I found the rudeness and lack of understanding toward dual-career parents on this thread surprising. I love and cherish my children. I enjoy my time with them. They are not with a babysitter or in camp unless both my husband and I have to work.

It is painful that I miss out on things like mid-day presentations that other parents who don't work can come to. I'm sorry that I choose to work so we can pay more tuition and get less of a scholarship break. Maybe you should try having a little more understanding for people who don't have the advantages you have.

Ruchel

Sun, Aug 24 2014, 4:46 am

lol I sometimes feel J schools have both secular and Jewish holidays!

mommy3b2c

Sun, Aug 24 2014, 9:02 am

amother wrote:

Maya wrote:

Quote:

I am sorry if my post was one that hurt you. I didnt say that you dont have t hard. You do. Life is hard. That still doesnt make school or camp responsblefor your children. The attitude of its coming to me is just wrong.

Dont assume because I dont work that I dont pay full tuition. I do.

nyer1

Sun, Aug 24 2014, 10:10 am

As a teacher, I really appreciate the time to both spend time with my family once camp is over and to prepare my classroom

PinkFridge

Sun, Aug 24 2014, 10:14 am

Barbara wrote:

I was responding to someone who said that 17 days of vacation barely covers chagim. Which is untrue.

Which means not taking off for Purim, erev Pesach, and Tisha B'Av?

mema613

Sun, Aug 24 2014, 10:15 am

When my kids were young the working moms used to drop off there kids by my house. We were both happy about it. They had coverage and my kids were entertained! They used to bring over a pizza pie and nosh for all to eat! I didnot step out of my house! It was just fine!

Barbara

Sun, Aug 24 2014, 10:16 am

PinkFridge wrote:

Which means not taking off for Purim, erev Pesach, and Tisha B'Av?

Yup.

PinkFridge

Sun, Aug 24 2014, 10:17 am

Just wanted to add, I know a fair amount of educators who take on summer jobs, not just in camps, but office jobs.

Sun, Aug 24 2014, 10:25 am

mommy2b2c wrote:

The schools and day camps are not required to accommodate you. That attitude is so spoiled. What is wrong with watching your own kids for two weeks? I kept my kids home all summer this year. (Obviously, if you work it is very hard, and yet, it is still not the schools resbonsility to baby sit your kids.)

I think twizzlers was commenting on the fact that she's paying tuition for a month that she still has to find childcare for her children. I definitely don't feel the schools are required to accommodate me, but if I'm paying a month of tuition for two weeks, and then I still have to pay for babysitting for the other two weeks, to me that is unfair. If I'm paying for a month of childcare I should get a month of childcare.

Barbara

Sun, Aug 24 2014, 10:26 am

Now, if you want to talk about days that schools are closed that drive me crazy, it's the "cooking days." You know, erev every holiday, so that teachers can cook, unlike other working people who cook at night or weekends.

Not to mention the "teacher travel days." Days before holidays so teachers can travel. If the chag starts Monday night, school does not need to be closed on Friday.

But that's because they're too much of an interruption to the flow of school, not because of child care.

I do understand the difficulties of working parents finding child care. (I don't understand stay at home parents who can't deal with their kids being home, but I hear their frustration.) But working parents, in turn, need to understand the need of counselors for a break as well.

zaq

Sun, Aug 24 2014, 10:39 am

Those two weeks are your time to take the kids to the doctor, dentist, optometrist, clothes shopping, shoe shopping, school-supply shopping and...umm...oh, yes, visiting G-ma and G-pa who live a three-hour plane trip away and can't be visited any other time of the year.

If you live outside of the tricities of Monsey, Lakewood and Brooklyn, and your healthcare providers and so on do not have Sunday hours as so many in the Tricities do, and you object--as responsible parents who value education do-- to taking kids out of class for routine healthcare appointments, let alone shopping excursions, when would you get this done if camp ended Friday and school started the following Monday?

Yes, it's true that summer break is way too long--but the place where the cut should be made is in the middle. Let the school year be a month longer, let summer break be a month shorter, let camp be four weeks rather than eight. But segueing from camp directly into school would be a major hardship for most people, and not at all necessary.

amother

Sun, Aug 24 2014, 11:39 am

ok I am going to start ranting now because I am so frustrated about this very topic. apologies in advance if I insult the whole world but I don't care. and I know there are bigger problems in the world but let me forget that for a few minutes OK????????????????????????????

OK so here goes. I HATE, DEPLORE, DESPISE, DREAD and just cant stand the summer. I hated it as a kid. I liked school and hate lack of routine. I hated forgetting what I learned in school. A week of vacation would have been perfectly fine. The whole system is based on some agricultural model where kids have to help their parents harvest during the summer. WE DON'T HARVEST THINGS ANYMORE.
Now I have a son. I work full time so that we can eat. IT IS NOT MY HOBBY. This month I spent nearly my entire salary on day care. firstly, I have to pay the ganenet from the year for this month, even though she doesn't work, so her family doesn't starve. Then I had my nine days camp. Then I had the bein hazmanim camp. Now there is no camp. Starting Tuesday I have no idea what I will do with my son from 8-5 and I have only $200 to get me through til September which has to include phone bill, food, and STUPID STUPID EXTRA DAYCARE. It is so bad for him that he has a new arrangement every two weeks for the summer.
I know ganenets work hard and whatnot, but I ALSO WORK VERY VERY VERY HARD AND DON'T TAKE OFF EVEN AN HOUR FOR THE SUMMER. BECAUSE I CAN'T AFFORD IT. EVEN THOUGH I HAVE A FANCY GOOD JOB. BUT BECAUSE OF THE DAYCARE COSTS, THERE WILL BE NO SUMMER VACATION. JUST SUMMER GEHINNOM. this year we even have heat and missiles to make it even more pleasant.
I was waiting for three months to go out to eat with my husband in honor of our anniversary. We were going to go tonight but we don't have the money. AND THAT'S FINE. I DON'T EVEN CARE ABOUT IT- JUST DON'T TELL ME THAT SUMMER IS OK AND GOOD AND AMAZING!!! I hope all the teachers enjoyed their vacations and everything but those of us who work in other industries did not rest for a second this summer. And we paid VERY DEARLY for their vacations.

And maybe you will think I am spoiled. I know that this is not really a big problem in the scheme of things so don't bash me and anyway I don't care. sorry for sounding so obnoxious but this migraine isn't going away- I've had it since about June 21st.

amother

Sun, Aug 24 2014, 12:03 pm

Sorry the comment about rethinking family planning. .most jewish mothers don't have that option only bcs they're working.a little sensitivity towards working moms..pls...

SRS

Sun, Aug 24 2014, 12:21 pm

I'd love to see a frum school schedule that is more logical. I'm with Barbara, the summer doesn't bother me particularly although in theory at least I think there is a school schedule that works better for both educational needs and the Jewish calendar.

What kills me is when the teachers talk to the kids about how they need time off for making yontif and my kids come back to talk about how the teachers need time off to cook and I'm sitting there working AND cooking AND babysitting.

I'm accepting of the school calendar, but don't tell me the reason behind it please.

amother

Sun, Aug 24 2014, 1:47 pm

~~Shame, now you all have to figure out to actually spend time with your kids for a couple of weeks without letting the TV/computer babysit them...~~

Ok, I know that wasn't nice, but come on seriously - for 2 weeks you can't just try to enjoy your own kids without freaking out that someone else won't be doing your job??

rainbow dash

Sun, Aug 24 2014, 2:21 pm

Here in Antwerp we have 2 months. 4 weeks chabad day Camp and then 4 to 5 weeks home. There is day camp for 2 weeks but not everyone goes. but after 9 bav most people leave town for 2week vacation. A lot of people stay in town. I can't imagine how I would manage if I was working.

zigi

Sun, Aug 24 2014, 3:22 pm

what do secular working parents do?

I do agree the way that schools start is annoying, half day for this age etc.

Sun, Aug 24 2014, 3:30 pm

It's possible that secular day cares work year round, regardless.

And the amother above who doesn't understand the frustration but won't put people down using her screen name... I went continue. Because I was always taught if you don't have something nice to say, don't say it.

causemommysaid

Sun, Aug 24 2014, 3:54 pm

I just want to add that even if you do manage to scramble and find daycare for all these stupid days off most of them are only part time.

These camps start at 9:30 and end at 2:30. So by the time I drop my kid off and get to work its almost time to pick him up. If I am lucky I can pay extra and leave him till 3:30. WOW. now I just need to figure out how to get in another 3 hours of work each day.

really really stressful.

ora_43

Sun, Aug 24 2014, 4:22 pm

zigi wrote:

what do secular working parents do?

IME, same as frum parents. Send young kids to (ridiculously expensive) summer camp or find a babysitter. If they're lucky, call in favors from grandparents, siblings, etc. Older kids are either at even-more-ridiculously-expensive camp or alone at home, depending on finances.

I agree with previous posters that it's a vacation model that seems to have outlived its usefulness. OTOH, I do think it's important for kids to have some vacation, especially as they get older.