Spin off - Hot plates

ra_mom

Sun, Mar 22 2015, 12:17 am

seeker wrote:

This is why I haven't replaced my gas stove even though it doesn't work so well anymore. They don't make em like they used to. 2 day yomtov - no problem! Can turn on any burner or oven any time from the pilot light. Can turn it off when done. Have CO+smoke detector nearby but risk with this kind of range is very very low.

Shabbos of course needs a different story (for us, just a crockpot, anything that needs heating goes on top of the cholent)

How are you able to do this?

The Happy Wife

Sun, Mar 22 2015, 12:44 am

We also had a hot plate (warming tray) malunction. It was just over a year old, and some wires came loose. Fortunately it did not catch fire, but just stopped working.
We always use a timer with them so that they are not on all the time, and we upgraded to a higher quality brand. Some of them are just very cheaply made.

JoyInTheMorning

Sun, Mar 22 2015, 1:57 am

Are crockpots supposed to be on for over 24 hours? I don't think manufacturers expect them to be on for more than 12 hours. The only thing that I know of that is normally on for 24 hours is an electric urn. And who knows, maybe it's not safe to leave those on for 2or 3-day chagim.

I do sometimes use a crockpot on shabbat and I always use an electric urn on shabbat and yom tov, but I'm starting to rethink what I do.

shabbatiscoming

Sun, Mar 22 2015, 2:08 am

We have the israeli plata. We put it on a timer and so its on for about three hours. On friday night someone is home when it is on. On shabbat day, it goes on when we are still at shul, but it is not so hot when I usually get home.
But we always use the timer. We do it to save electricity but also so that it would not get so hot and have something on there that could burn.

etky

Sun, Mar 22 2015, 3:35 am

shabbatiscoming wrote:

We do this too. However I wanted to point out that the plattot used here in Israel are designed to be on for a long period of time and there are many people who do not use a timer for halachic reasons (not sure what they are but there are shitot that do not allow timers). The platot sold here are certified for use by the Israeli Standards Institute. Given that platot are ubiquitously used here (blechs are rare) it seems that they are generally quite safe. No they should not be put directly on the granite or ceasarstone countertop because they can damage them. Most people are aware of this. The fire risk attendant to platta use is usually linked to the system that people have of covering the platta with a flammable piece of fabric. If not done correctly (and it is easy to do this unsafely) the fabric can ignite. There were two such fires in recent years in Israel (b" h no one hurt) - both attributed to the incorrect covering of the platta and not to the platta itself.

Sanguine

Sun, Mar 22 2015, 4:14 am

We use a platta on a timer. My crockpot turns off on a timer after lunch on Shabbat (then turns back on at what was candle lighting time cause that was the time it started on Friday - In the winter I don't bother).

For Yontif we also have a Chagaz (I think it's just an Israeli product cause we'd never waste the gas by leaving a flame 25 hours). A Chagaz is a mechanical timer (you turn the dial and it goes tick, tick - like old fashioned egg timers). When the timer stops the gas to the stove is cut off (only good for a gas stove) and the fire goes off. To use it on Yontif you turn the timer to the amount of time you'll want your gas on. Only then is there actually gas flowing to your stove. Then you turn on the gas you want to use (if you have an electric start, make sure to unplug the oven before chag), and light it from a Yarzheit candle. The flame will extinguish when the timer ends.
They made it only 90 minutes which is a shame cause I'd love to use it Friday night with a blech and have it shut during supper. I once hooked it to my BBQ on Sukkot (maybe only Israelis BBQ on Yontif Very Happy

),but then I didn't have it for my stove

http://www.zomet.org.il/eng/?C.....D=133

kerida

Sun, Mar 22 2015, 4:25 am

Terrified of hotplates since saw a faulty ( new)!! one burn a worktop, since then we have a cold lunch, never been a problem, neither for our guests who have always appreciated a deli style buffet by us. Have hot water urn for drinks, and a smaller urn(flask) for soup, but no more hot plates, I just cannot risk it.

Over shabbos and yom tovim, we are very very careful of our candles, never anywhere near curtains, open windows drafts, etc.

And yes smoke alarms everywhere.

Sanguine

Sun, Mar 22 2015, 5:08 am

I once had a weird (dangerous?) thing with my candles. I light candles on my counter, usually more forward than the top cabinets but I don't really pay attention cause the cabinets are really a nice amount above the candles (I light 2 so it's not a big deal). Well one Friday night I kept smelling plastic melting/burning and couldn't find the source (so I ignored it). DH came home from shul and saw it right away. We had a radio installed on the underside of the top cabinets and my candles were right under the radio and the radio was melting down over the candles. I hadn't hit the candles but I guess it could have (ruined the radio)

myself

Sun, Mar 22 2015, 6:56 am

Does anyone use the gas stove with a blech? I know it's an actual fire but somehow it always seemed safer as it's a contained fire under the blech whilst the hotplate is electrical and can malfunction... I know I probably don't make sense but for some reason I'm afraid of the hotplate. I had one in the past and it sometimes made loud popping noises so I just threw it out.

I wish there was a simple safe solution. On Yom Tov I always leave on at least one flame and make sure it's covered with the blech before we go to sleep.

myself

Sun, Mar 22 2015, 7:00 am

Sanguine wrote:

I also had a weird story with my candles. The candles were on a tray on the table and were still on a little when we went to bed Friday night. The top part of the candlestick (that looks similar to those foil candle holders) is removable but very difficult to remove. Shabbos morning I see that part on stuck to the floor with wax and a hole on my plastic tablecloths.

Nobody had been downstairs AFAIK - and nothing else was missing or out of place to indicate an intruder. How in the world did that piece get to the table (rather than the tray) and then make it to the floor a couple of feet away?!?

Sanguine

Sun, Mar 22 2015, 7:26 am

myself wrote:

Does anyone use the gas stove with a blech?

Sure. Grew up in America with a blech. No one ever thought of it as a hazard. But in Israel gas is expensive so I wouldn't leave a gas fire burning for 25 hours. When I told my mother how wonderful my chagaz is (that turns off the gas on yontif) she wondered why I don't just leave the gas on all Yontif like she does.

BUT - I think stoves are different now (meaning from when I was young). Now the back of my stove has an electric panel sticking up. I know two overzealous Pesach cleaning balabastas who lit all four flames and then put a blech on top in order to kasher everything at once and they ended up melting that electric panel from the heat. So now the blech worries me.

mfb

Sun, Mar 22 2015, 7:33 am

myself wrote:

Flame can get big and lick out to counter. The blech should be smaller than the stovetop and not touching the counter so if the flame comes out the side it doesn't touch anything.

myself

Sun, Mar 22 2015, 7:34 am

Sanguine wrote:

Okay but since mine has no plastic or electric panels, is that safe? Is it considered safer/less safe than a hotplate?

myself

Sun, Mar 22 2015, 7:35 am

mfb wrote:

Flame can get big and lick out to counter. The blech should be smaller than the stovetop and not touching the counter so if the flame comes out the side it doesn't touch anything.

Obviously we're talking about relatively low flames, and yes, it can't reach the countertop...
Do stove flames generally get bigger on their own? Confused

Ruchel

Sun, Mar 22 2015, 7:38 am

The thing is, with all the tons of appliances some have now, even the "at standard" electricity systems that could support a plata can be overwhelmed.

Some older people mind the fire so much, they eat cold. Maybe they're in the right...

OUAT one would bring the chulent at the bakery oven, or leave ONE tray on the "gas" thing or in oven. Now you need the plata, some even two, the coffee, the this the that. Sad

I've seen people putting the candles inside bowls or sinks in case they fall, no idea how halachic it would be for the second one.

Happy my country made mandatory the smoke detector here last year - but you bet they don't go at people to see what happens. So many people don't have, or crappy, or non functional/installed.

Sanguine

Sun, Mar 22 2015, 8:20 am

myself wrote:

Okay but since mine has no plastic or electric panels, is that safe? Is it considered safer/less safe than a hotplate?

I never worried about the blech my whole life in America and I don't worry about the plata here cause I never leave it on overnight (it's on a clock). I don't worry about the crock pot - they're made to be left on a long time. I don't worry about my urn - it's also made to be left on a long time. I also don't worry about my house burning down while we're all in shul (we pay so much for home insurance that I'd love to finally collect Wink

). I'd only worry about fire while we're sleeping but that's why we have smoke detectors. A lot can burn in my house but the house itself isn't made of wood so a smoke detector would wake us up in time to get out.

Now - What I do worry about... (I can't be calm about everything). I worry about my kids - Older teens and older who stay out very very late at night and drive home at 2 AM or their friends do or they Tremp. They're grownups already so there's a limit to how much I can protect them. You have to live life. We take precautions and don't do crazy things but I can't/won't make my kids sit at home so I can watch them 24/7

The same thing with warming food on Shabbat. If you've always used a blech, don't start to panic. If your plata is in good shape don't worry about it. The smart precaution is to have a smoke alarm in the kitchen (and other places too)