"Tchup" a problem with tefillin, really?!

amother

Mistyrose

Thu, Jun 09 2016, 12:05 pm

My husband and I are totally not chassidish although we both come from chassidish backgrounds. I asked dh when he gets a haircut to leave his front hair a bit longer (a tchup) because I like the look.
Now hubby asked a real chassidish rav (whom I never liked, since I feel were on very different wavelengths) and of course he said no, duh! Something about it being in the way of tefillin.
I was so upset! I told dh I feel like his chasidis is influancing his psak! DH said it cant be because rav said thats what it says in shulchan urach.

Can anyone please tell me this isnt the case?! Extra points if you can post a link to a source that says otherwise! Wink

tryinghard

Thu, Jun 09 2016, 12:12 pm

AFAIK, it should make no difference - DH just pushes his hair bck for tefillin (I think, haven't seen him in tefillin in a while)

PinkFridge

Thu, Jun 09 2016, 12:13 pm

It can be a problem but a few questions:
1. Do you have a rav whom you fairly consistently go to? Get his opinion.
2. Minor detail: what does your son want? What does his yeshiva rebbe/school say?

amother

Peach

Thu, Jun 09 2016, 12:17 pm

I also heard that long hair in the front can be a problem with tefillin. We are yeshivish. I think you should find a rav in general who is more similar to you and dh's lifestyles.

amother

Sapphire

Thu, Jun 09 2016, 1:12 pm

Did you really expect a Chassidish Rov to tell you it's okay to grow his hair? It must not be a problem since hundreds of thousands of religious men grow their hair longer than a buzz cut.

It would be a good idea in general for you to find a Rov who is more in line with your current hashkafah.

LittleDucky

Thu, Jun 09 2016, 1:45 pm

http://www.eretzhemdah.org/new.....=2665

Says the issue is if the hair is abnormally long (down to waist was one example) it could be an issue but points out mourners can wear tefilin even if they aren't cutting for 12 months.

I always heard it is an issue if it makes the head tefilin cockeyed or slanted.

naturalmom5

Thu, Jun 09 2016, 2:42 pm

My husband says the medrash says there was a complaint that yosef was playing with his hair while his father was in aveilos
So you see that was the only taina, so otherwise it was OK or the medrash would mention it

How does a nazir put on tefillin

greenfire

Thu, Jun 09 2016, 2:54 pm

it's as bad as wearing a colourful t-shirt vs a white button down for tefillin shel yad ...

I am pretty sure they didn't have buzz cuts in the torah times

leah233

Thu, Jun 09 2016, 3:01 pm

Off topic (I'm no posek anyway) but I haven't heard the word Tchup in years.

I think in the 70s and 80s it was considered more of an issue because the secular world was much more into tchups and hairstyles back then. (When was the last time you saw an afro?) Today that the secular world isn't so into their hair, growing longer hair isn't looked at as copying them

I was looking a Torah Vodaas yearbook from the seventies. There were over 100 graduates. One of the things I noticed was that the yeshivshe looking crowd had much shorter hair and the not yeshivshe looking crowd had much longer hair then either group would have today

Last edited by leah233 on Fri, Jun 10 2016, 9:30 am; edited 1 time in total

greenfire

Thu, Jun 09 2016, 3:33 pm

leah233 wrote:

...
I think in the 70s and 80s it was considered more of an issue because the secular world was much more into tchups and hairstyles back then. (When was the last time you saw an afro?) Today that the secular world isn't so into their hair, growing longer hair isn't looked at as copying them...

everything including hair fashions come back around - yes people were wearing afros not too long ago & the "tchup" has come back around - I've seen yeshivish, modern, lubavitch, etc. all wearing the new old hairdo

amother

Mint

Thu, Jun 09 2016, 3:39 pm

I read a Rabbbi's analysis which said that the chatzitzah with hair is long hair in a ponytail, not a tchup.

Who, how and why, I don't know. But I do know many fine frum Yidden who have a tchup with no issue, including many of my family members. We're yeshivish.

Carmen Luna

Thu, Jun 09 2016, 7:46 pm

besides being a problem of chatzitza, a lot of poskim hold it also carries the issur of "ivuchukasayim lo salaichu"

yogabird

Thu, Jun 09 2016, 9:55 pm

According to halacha it's only a chatzitzah if the hair is long only in the front. If it's long all around it's not a problem.

amother

Turquoise

Thu, Jun 09 2016, 10:00 pm

A chatziza is something external to the body, not the body itself. Hair cannot be a chatziza. That said, chassidim view hair differently than other groups of Jews do.

cnc

Thu, Jun 09 2016, 10:05 pm

amother wrote:

A chatziza is something external to the body, not the body itself. Hair cannot be a chatziza. That said, chassidim view hair differently than other groups of Jews do.

This is not accurate.
If someone always removes hair in a specific place and wouldn't go out in public with the hair there it can be a chatzitza.

cnc

Thu, Jun 09 2016, 10:06 pm

amother wrote:

imamothers paskening away ..... there are rabbanim out there, you know.

Yes.
And the OP got a psak and wanted to know if anyone heard of it...

amother

Turquoise

Thu, Jun 09 2016, 10:07 pm

cnc wrote:

This is not accurate.
If someone always removes hair in a specific place and wouldn't go out in public with the hair there it can be a chatzitza.

But if you're removing it because you think it's a chatziza in the first place... circular logic.