Help 14 year old in relationship

Fox

Thu, Oct 06 2016, 12:46 pm

amother wrote:

Is this child abuse seeing add she's a child? Will she need therapy to get over this? I'm doing my best to help her but have to tread carefully.

We obviously don't know all the details and personalities involved, but a 14-year-old engaging in what she sees as a consensual relationship is much different than, say, a 6-year-old.

Yes, she needs therapy. However, not because she's been abused by this young man (though, of course, a previous history of abuse could play a role), but because she's seeking self-worth and validation by engaging in a relationship with what sounds like a pretty unsavory guy.

Sadly, even if this guy disappears, there are plenty of unsavory guys out there of all ages and backgrounds.

I would probably try to get her into therapy without making it about this particular boyfriend. The problem is that even if she starts therapy today, it's not a quick process, and there are plenty of ways to make big mistakes in life despite participating in therapy.

So that's where the low-key coaching has to come in: rather than criticizing the current boyfriend, find ways to demonstrate and comment on characteristics of healthy relationships and men who respect their girlfriends/wives. All while making sure not to sound preachy, of course! Smile

Unfortunately, there are probably no quick answers, but at least you can set in motion the forces that can prevent her from developing a long-term pattern of self-destructive or unhealthy relationships.

sourstix

Thu, Oct 06 2016, 12:59 pm

Is she open to hearing you telling her anything? If that's the case then I would speak with a professional how to move forward. All of us here are well meaning. But a professional can better guide you. Don't take what we say as fact a professional will have better answers. It's tricky so be careful, you can help her if you do it correctly.
Maybe someone here can direct you to people who live in your country for help. Hatzlacha.
And fox you said real good points. She needs to understand what she's doing it and why. Hopefully she will get the help she so sorely needs. I feel sorry for this poor little girl.

(Doesn't Zechariah wallerstein deal with this stuff? ) he lives in Flatbush though. I know he has great success with this.

sourstix

Thu, Oct 06 2016, 1:05 pm

No he will not marry her, he's a loser. He's not mature and is engaging in promiscuity behavior. He needs help too. He's not stable. I wonder if he's using drugs too. And perhaps encouraging her too. Watch out for that too cause that brings more issues to the table. At any rate it's good for you to meet him and have a feel for him so you know who she's with. So you can forward this to the professionals. I hope you take this seriously because this can get dangerous. If she's on drugs. Which she might very well be. And try to hide it from you. Please don't wait for more answers from us unless someone can guide you to some help. This is a bad situation.

amother

Linen

Thu, Oct 06 2016, 1:17 pm

I read this and my heart breaks..not just because I have daughters but because I can still remember as a teen how badly I just wanted to feel wanted and attractive, and how I made choices to feel that way that I later regretted.

It's pretty textbook that a girl with an absent father is going to be vulnerable to an older guy giving her attention. This doesn't even sound like a boyfriend, its more of a hookup or friends with benefits situation.

I know that everyone here is talking about the legal stuff but I just want to say that it's really important to remain as someone in her life she can talk to without worrying you are going to repeat things. If this guy is bad news, you have to look out for her safety if you do anything like calling his parents or the police. I'm sure he has a whole crew, not to mention that the rumors and gossip he can circulate about her.

Ask her what she likes about him. What he likes about her. how does she feel when she's not with him? When she leaves his place?

These questions aren't to encourage the relationship, but to give her tools to look at her feelings and emotions and start getting in touch with her gut, which isn't easy as a teen.

Miri7

Thu, Oct 06 2016, 1:23 pm

I would seek out a licensed therapist who specializes in teens. You can talk with them about the situation and they can give advice on how to proceed. This is a tricky situation that a professional can help you navigate. It's great that she's being open and honest with you, as many teens would hide this from all responsible adults.

I would also talk with her about birth control as others have suggested, and help her get on the pill or something to prevent an unwanted pregnancy.

Blessing1

Thu, Oct 06 2016, 1:35 pm

Op, meeting up just too have s-x & him not being involved in her life simply means that he's using her for his pleasures. He might have done the same to other girls till they caught onto what's going on & then he goes on to the next target.
14 is extremely young even in the secular world.
You sound like such a caring relative, good luck!

sweetpotato

Thu, Oct 06 2016, 1:49 pm

OP, as to the legality, if s-x between an 18 year old and 14 year old is illegal or possibly illegal in your country, you should inform both the girl about the guy about this. Not as a threat that you will report them, but to make it clear about the seriousness about what is going on and about the potential for punishment in hopes it will make them reconsider. As for therapy, whether he is abusing her, etc... it's hard to say. You know your relative and the best you can do is offer her options. 14 is extremely young and most parents (secular or not) would not allow a 14 year old girl to date or spend time with an 18 year old man, even if they are in the same high school. Most parents would also seek to prevent a 14 year old from having a s-xual relationship, even with a peer. I don't think it would strike most people as "normal," even in the best circumstances, for an 18 year old to have a s-xual relationship with a 14 year old. And in the worst circumstances, yes, it would qualify as a crime or abuse. Unfortunately, in the US the laws are extremely black and white and there's a huge amount of corruption in the system and reporting statutory rape can have consequences beyond what most people would deem appropriate. This sounds like a tough situation and it's good you are helping her.

sourstix

Thu, Oct 06 2016, 7:56 pm

Sweet potato are you for real?! You know this boy doesn't care about the law, otherwise he wouldn't be doing this! These kids are in risky behavior this is how children who are troubled and rebellious behave. Please don't give advice if you know nothing about these issues. Educate yourself first. There are unfortunately many such kids today. And it's very tricky to treat them. Once they are on drugs it's downhill from there until they snap and a moment of realization hits them. This is very complicated. I was dealing with this at a certain point. It's much more complicated then you and I can deal with. And I said this needs professionals. Like now! Before it's too late. Leave the boy alone. We need to focus on getting this girl to a proper place that handles this.

amother

Peach

Thu, Oct 06 2016, 8:55 pm

amother wrote:

And this is a girl who is saying yes.

Would I approve if it were my kid? No. But do I think that a boy should be in prison because he had a girlfriend? No.

Finally, some non-alarmist common sense on here, thank you.

OP, I feel quite awkward that you posted this on imamother, it's none of our business. You claim that you are a relative of this girl and that she trusts you. If she knew you had posted this like this she would (a) be mortified and (b) not trust you any more.

amother

Peach

Thu, Oct 06 2016, 8:59 pm

sourstix wrote:

Precocious s*xual behavior and drugs do not necessarily go hand-in-hand. There's no evidence that either of them are on drugs in this scenario.

This is not going to be a popular statement but sometimes, teenage girls consent to s*x because they want to, even if you think they are too young, even if you think they are doing it for the wrong reasons and even if the law says they can't legally consent. Be careful assuming the worst about the girl. At that age, it is quite possible that she is more emotionally mature than the guy in question.

sourstix

Thu, Oct 06 2016, 8:59 pm

She came here to get advice and that's what everyone is doing. I do think she did right ,but I also think she should call a professional and do it now! Nothing anyone is gonna say more here is gonna change but she needs resources to go for help. And she didn't get it. So I hope she gets it so she can actually help.
Anyone know where she can turn to?

amother

Peach

Thu, Oct 06 2016, 9:01 pm

amother wrote:

Please don't call the police. He's an 18 year old boy who had consensual relations with his girlfriend. Yes, she's 14. But she knows what she's doing, and its not a huge gap. Certainly not huge enough that he should go to prison (up to 7 years in NY), and then have to spend the next however long -- or forever -- as a registered sx offender.

First things first. Get her to a gyn, immediately. Have her tested for STDs, and then get her on effective birth control. She doesn't need a baby.

Talk to her about responsibility. About pregnancy. About being in a loving relationship.

If she's troubled then, yes, it would be a good idea for her to go to therapy, if she's willing.

Great advice.

Also, I like that you say the conditional "if" she is troubled vs assuming that she is. It's quite possible she just wants to have sx.

amother

Peach

Thu, Oct 06 2016, 9:05 pm

sourstix wrote:

I disagree. I know of a teen who was in a similar situation, doing things with a wise head on her shoulders, on her terms because she wanted to. However, others didn't see it that way and people started meddling. It was not helpful at all and it meant the teen was left without the people she thought she formally could trust. OP, please don't involve professionals for no reason. If she currently trusts you, keep it that way. If you go to professionals you may damage your relationship with her permanently.

sourstix

Thu, Oct 06 2016, 9:14 pm

Ok I am just giving my personal opinion here. I don't see how a frum girl from a frum background would want to behave this way. And then call this ok. I see this as a red flag. So op you do what you think is right. I'm not gonna comment anymore. I'm not here to make a problem if there isn't but I sincerely hope she is not in big trouble because if she is then I feel sorry that no ones helping her.
Peach a,other just cause you know one person doesn't make this situation normal. This is not the norm in a frum girls life. I hope you understand what I mean. Anyone here that grew up in a frum invoironment knows what I mean.

amother

Peach

Fri, Oct 07 2016, 5:05 am

sourstix wrote:

I may only know of one person in a similar situation to what OP describes (and I am from the same location as OP), but when I was growing up I knew lots of frum girls and boys from frum backgrounds engaging in this sort of behaviour because they wanted to. Two of them were the children of Rabbonim. Even if the behaviour described by OP is not typical, it doesn't mean the girl deserves her trust to be violated by a family member. OP, if you can keep her trust, you might be able to stop her from wanting out of the religion.

amother

Pink

Fri, Oct 07 2016, 5:59 am

I know a frum girl who had a relationship at 14 or so with an older man. (I think he was well over 25).

Many years later she came out and accused him of raping her and he spent time in prison.

This is a well known case that occurred in the UK. The girl now runs an organisation helping victims of abuse.

My point it, right now this girl might say it is consensual, in 5 or 10 years time she might not and this guy could end up in deep trouble.

I think it is an excellent idea to warn them both of the legalities of the case.

amother

Fuchsia

Fri, Oct 07 2016, 5:59 am

amother wrote:

I am also from the same location and no, this situation is definitely not regular at all in the frum community. (At least not in RW circles.)

I second the call to speak with professionals and find out how you or someone else can help her.

dimyona

Fri, Oct 07 2016, 7:26 am

amother wrote:

Oh, please.

If a 14 year old girl is in 8th grade, then an 18 year old is in 12th. But more likely, the 14 year old is in at least 9th grade, maybe even 10th. I was in 10th at age 14.

Far from a baby.

You're trying to make it sound like she's as young as possible, and he's as old as possible, to meet your agenda. When the most likely scenario is that they go to school together.

The girl who was raped by the pig at Stanford was unconscious. She didn't say yes. Anything other than YES means h3ll no.

And this is a girl who is saying yes.

Would I approve if it were my kid? No. But do I think that a boy should be in prison because he had a girlfriend? No.

Agreed. No good will come by calling the police on this guy. This girl is clearly craving either the s-x or the validation, which is very common, and by meeting her needs he is not inherently a rapist or abuser. If there were *any* hint of coersion involved, or other complicating factors like mental illness, perhaps I'd think differently, but a four year age gap alone should not involve jail time and a s-x offense record.

It would also show a huge betrayal of trust, which as other posters have indicated, could be far worse in the long term if this teenager ever needs help from adults.

Good luck. It's a tough situation