Mitzvah tantz | Imamother

moonstone

Sun, May 27 2018, 5:54 am

amother wrote:

Yes and it is utterly sickening how these "bummy" couples make a mockery out of the holy mitzvah tantz and use it as an opportunity for a romantic engagement and public display of affection.

Yeah, why would you want any romance or affection from a couple on their wedding day? The very idea! Rolling Eyes

amother

Maroon

Sun, May 27 2018, 7:50 am

amother wrote:

In my circles (MO/DL) there is absolutely no such thing like the chassidic mitzvah tantz.
So I'm looking at it as a total outsider.
But the idea of it being not tzanua of all things, makes my chin drop.
The few clips of such dances that I've seen didn't show anything un-tzniusdig to me.
I mean, the kallah is wrapped up in a massive, thick , cover-everything white wedding gown with a veil. It's impossible to see the shape of her body or her face. I don't want to be mean, but she looks like a huge white triangle, kind of a floating iceberg.
Even if you have a few hundred men watching her, they can't really see her.
She doesn't touch anyone directly. So what's not tzanua in that?
Btw, the wedding guests also see her in the same outfit when she's standing under the chuppah, right?
What would you suggest? Holding weddings without the kallah being present at all? Would that be sufficiently tzanua?

edited to delete part of what I wrote

Only in the very ultra-chassidish circles will you see the kallah wearing a veil. It isn't the norm at all.

amother

Lemon

Sun, May 27 2018, 7:55 am

DrMom wrote:

What does "bummy" mean in this context?

I don't know how to put this down nicely, but In this context we mean those who are not quality chassidish people[I]

If anyone can describe it better, then please come on board.

asmileaday

Sun, May 27 2018, 11:08 am

amother wrote:

I don't know how to put this down nicely, but In this context we mean those who are not quality chassidish people[I]

If anyone can describe it better, then please come on board.

I believe bummy in this context means a chassidish upbringing, usually the guy still dresses the part somewhat (bekeshe, shtreimel) but they have no interest in a chassidish lifestyle and all the restrictions that come with it.

I say who cares, don't let it irk you that much. B"h they're marrying Jews and they have a kosher wedding. They're having the equivalent of "the first dance".
Is it in line with the traditional chassidish minhag? Definitely not. But enjoy the show LOL

.

On the other hand, mitzva tantz when done by a regular chassidish wedding is a very emotional, happy and uplifting time. I loved every minute of my mitzvah tantz. I sat next to dh we shmoozed and had a very pleasant time. It's a great way to end the night.

Most mt I've been to in the last couple of years cut down dramatically on all the hespedim. Anyone that's not a parent or grandparent gets their name called and that's it. No praises.

imasoftov

Sun, May 27 2018, 11:23 am

amother wrote:

I don't know how to put this down nicely, but In this context we mean those who are not quality chassidish people[I]

If anyone can describe it better, then please come on board.

Would a "quality" person refer to someone else as "bummy? Just wondering.

InnerMe

Sun, May 27 2018, 11:05 pm

I'm finding this thread interesting but a little sad.

I wouldn't give up my mitzvah tantz for anything in the world. It would be difficult for me to put the emotions properly in writing.

What makes me sad is other posters mocking this minhag. For many chassidic people this is an intense, and spiritual time. And it's OK if you don't relate or don't understand, but don't ridicule an entire sect's sacred and treasured minhag.

Have more to say but gotta go now...

asmileaday

Sun, May 27 2018, 11:39 pm

timana wrote:

Maybe this question doesn't belong in this thread, but I was just wondering how the couple has energy to be together wedding night if they get home at like 5 am?

From my experience it's more like 2 not 5. As a guest I can sometimes get home at 5 if the wedding was in another city.
And not everyone does it the night of. Some will wait till the next night.

timana

Sun, May 27 2018, 11:42 pm

asmileaday wrote:

From my experience it's more like 2 not 5. As a guest I can sometimes get home at 5 if the wedding was in another city.
And not everyone does it the night of. Some will wait till the next night.

There's no halachic issue of delaying a mitzvah?

thunderstorm

Sun, May 27 2018, 11:44 pm

timana wrote:

Maybe this question doesn't belong in this thread, but I was just wondering how the couple has energy to be together wedding night if they get home at like 5 am?

Only rebbish weddings end at five. Regular Chasidish chasunas are over by 2-2:30. My DH just got home from a wedding in Monroe. The hall had takanos that the entire wedding including Mitzvah tantz needs to be over by 1:00 am.

noosheen

Wed, Jun 20 2018, 5:23 am

amother wrote:

I don't know what clip you are watching - this is recent https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KvvJsHpHzhE and I like how everyone is gathered close and the bride is danced before, and not with (she hold the gartel, but doesn't move at all). (also the mixed group is just awesome).

I thought this was beautiful!
Thx for posting.

shabbatiscoming

Wed, Jun 20 2018, 5:56 am

timana wrote:

There's no halachic issue of delaying a mitzvah?

There is NO mitzvah to be intimate the first night you are married. Many couples really want (and need) to first get to know one another, in the physical way, before actually becoming nidda and not being able to touch for a while.

amother

Azure

Wed, Jun 20 2018, 7:19 am

This whole conversation indicates to me more than anything that any particular sect will defend to great lengths their customs while often bashing others that are just as random.
Groups that say that driving is immodest, calling attention to oneself is immodest, touching your husband in public is immodest yet standing in the middle of a swarm of men dancing with men (through ropes) and holding your new husband's hand at your wedding is totally modest and is davka a wonderful, positive exception.
Great, then don't judge other's equally random customs.
Can't you all see that these are all various religious routines that become accepted and then rejected and come and go as waves in the ocean over time.
Everyone live and let live in all directions. Don't take yourselves and your current customs too seriously. They'll be gone soon and new ones will replace them in the blink of an eye.

PinkFridge

Wed, Jun 20 2018, 7:46 am

amother wrote:

I think this is an interesting and valid point: when we view other communities' minhagim, we can feel like the proverbial stranger in a strange land/anthropologist on Mars. And we need to remember that others might see us the same way.

But re your last paragraph: There is a concept of minhag Yisrael k'din. Are there times that minhagim are authoritatively revisited? Sure. But they should be taken seriously. And - re the bolded - taken on seriously as well.