Logical Fallacies | Imamother

Trademark

Mon, Jan 02 2023, 8:53 pm

Not sure under which forum this belongs so I'm putting it here.

In the light of the other thread, let's review the art of having a debate.

I'll start with a two logical fallacies that I see come up often here.

- Ad Hominem - attacks the person instead of using logic to disprove a point.

Example: Voters for Party A are idiots.

Rather than explaining why voting for Party A is wrong, you attack the voter. You didn't bring and logical point.

- credentials fallacy - questioning the expertise/ authority of the person bringing up the point, instead of disproving the point.

Example: You are not a Rabbi, you can't give your opinion on this matter.

BrisketBoss

Mon, Jan 02 2023, 9:20 pm

Oooo. My favorite, anecdotal evidence--using a personal experience to dismiss statistics.

Do NOT take a shot every time you see that on this website because you might not survive.

ImmaBubby

Mon, Jan 02 2023, 9:35 pm

How about picking on a minor point and having the discussion take a major turn away from what the poster originally asked/vented?

Trademark

Mon, Jan 02 2023, 11:08 pm

ImmaBubby wrote:

How about picking on a minor point and having the discussion take a major turn away from what the poster originally asked/vented?

Great point.

I see this happen so often here, a poster replying to one point only - often a minor one, detracting from the main point.

To add to that, part of being able to make a great point / debate is being succinct, without adding distracting details.

Trademark

Mon, Jan 02 2023, 11:11 pm

Another mistake I see sometimes is when people bring statistics. Statistics are very tricky and can be easily manipulated to support an agenda. Make sure you understand it well before bringing it to a debate.

BrisketBoss

Mon, Jan 02 2023, 11:20 pm

Trademark wrote:

There are three kinds of lies: lies, damned lies, and statistics. -Mark Twain

Trademark

Mon, Jan 02 2023, 11:40 pm

Another fallacy Straw Man: Distorts and exaggerates the original point to an extreme position, then attacks that extreme point, when the original poster never said that.

Example:

OP: I wouldn't buy my daughter a designer coat.

reply: So you deprive your children, do you know what long term affects that can have?

BrisketBoss

Mon, Jan 02 2023, 11:43 pm

Trademark wrote:

Ooooo oooo pick me

(I don't really feel bad about directly calling out an anonymous poster as an example. If they weren't anon then I might.)

Trademark

Mon, Jan 02 2023, 11:51 pm

BrisketBoss wrote:

Ooooo oooo pick me

(I don't really feel bad about directly calling out an anonymous poster as an example. If they weren't anon then I might.)

I can't see the picture, can you copy/paste?

BrisketBoss

Mon, Jan 02 2023, 11:52 pm

Trademark wrote:

I can't see the picture, can you copy/paste?

BrisketBoss wrote:
You think people attracted to children who don't act on it, CHOSE to be attracted to children? They didn't and it's a real thing.

amother Stonewash responded:
So then supposedly according to your logic we should also have rachmanus on child molesters because “Nebach they were born that way and couldn’t help it?” How’s this different than expecting little kids who think they want to be a different gender to be told it’s forbidden and not possible, rather than indulging them?

Trademark

Mon, Jan 02 2023, 11:54 pm

BrisketBoss wrote:

BrisketBoss wrote:
You think people attracted to children who don't act on it, CHOSE to be attracted to children? They didn't and it's a real thing.

amother responded:
So then supposedly according to your logic we should also have rachmanus on child molesters because “Nebach they were born that way and couldn’t help it?” How’s this different than expecting little kids who think they want to be a different gender to be told it’s forbidden and not possible, rather than indulging them?

You can edit out the name, which I did when quoting you.

But great point, yes.

Crookshanks

Tue, Jan 03 2023, 2:53 am

BrisketBoss wrote:

Oooo. My favorite, anecdotal evidence--using a personal experience to dismiss statistics.

Do NOT take a shot every time you see that on this website because you might not survive.

Imamother drinking game 😂😂😂

Trademark

Tue, Jan 03 2023, 9:50 am

Slippery Slope: Assuming a relatively small action / step will lead to a chain of events resulting in significant effects / outcomes.

Example: You shouldn't give children a cookie before dinner, otherwise your children will end up eating junk food for all three meals.

zaq

Tue, Jan 03 2023, 1:57 pm

#BestBubby wrote:

I think trying to shut a poster up is a sign of losing the argument.

No, sometimes it's a sign that the poster is being offensive, not following the rules of polite debate, running off at the mouth or repeating the same canards over and over and contributing nothing new to the discussion.

Trademark

Tue, Jan 03 2023, 2:13 pm

zaq wrote:

That would be a fallacy of the single cause (also has other names) where a result is assumed to have a simple, single cause, when in reality there might be other causes.

But please let's not derail this thread.

Roseflower

Tue, Jan 03 2023, 2:19 pm

When two Imas from different sects of Judaism think that the other is committing a grave sin...

Trademark

Tue, Jan 03 2023, 2:26 pm

Quoting out of context fallacy: Pretty much self-understood. I see it happening often when posters bring a gemara or other Torah texts. Context is very important in these cases.