New [non jew] nanny - non-kosher food in the house

nachlaot

Sun, Feb 19 2023, 2:49 pm

we have a [non jew] nanny starting tomorrow for our baby & toddler; we've previously only had jewish nannies. trying to figure out the "rules" for her eating non-kosher food in our house. (it's full time so we cant tell her she cant eat in our house.) what should I tell her?

obviously she needs to know she cant use our microwave and oven, and she needs to know she can only use disposable cups/cutlery/plates.

I assume it's ok for her she can bring anything eaten room temperature or cold and that she can use the fridge if her stuff is double wrapped.

I'm worried about her eating at the table, leaving treyf crumbs where we eat... how do we handle that?

thanks for any ideas...

tichellady

Sun, Feb 19 2023, 2:57 pm

she doesn't need to double wrap her food for your fridge. I would ask her to put in a bag so it's clearly differentiated. you will need a different plan for pesach. you may want to buy her a microwave. most people like to have a hot lunch but you can see if that's important to her. most people I know provide lunch if they are worried about non kosher food in their house. you can ask her to use a placemat and then just take it off after she eats . crumbs are not an actual halachic issue during the year but ask a rabbi if you are concerned

mfb

Sun, Feb 19 2023, 3:01 pm

Just be aware that there are plenty of workers that don’t listen to the rules and warm up their food anyway. No way you would know unless you have nanny cams focused on those areas.
My relative works in the construction industry and says anyone that has their appliances connected before they move in probably has to kasher them cuz there are always workers that don’t listen

Blessing1

Sun, Feb 19 2023, 3:05 pm

You need to discuss it with your Rav.
I think you must have a camera's installed in the kitchen. Leaving a non jew alone in your house, may automatically render your kitchen treif. Ask a sheila.
Maybe you can get her a separate microwave for her food. You can also prepare all meals for her so she shouldn't have to bring her own food.

nachlaot

Sun, Feb 19 2023, 3:11 pm

1) we both work from home and at least one of us is home except on rare occasions. we'd know if she were microwaving things, unless she secretly does it the rare time we both leave the house together.

2) she said she's ok with not having hot food

3) pesach is only 2 working days of kol hamoed. we could just tell her she cant bring in outside food for 2 days and I dont think it will be a big deal. in the days before pesach, she can just eat her treyf food in the garage like we will be doing.

4) "you can ask her to use a placemat and then just take it off after she eats . crumbs are not an actual halachic issue during the year but ask a rabbi if you are concerned" -- maybe I will ask a rav about this

5) she's of an ethnicity where she's gonna want to eat her own food and not what we eat.

ChutzPAh

Sun, Feb 19 2023, 5:12 pm

I’ve had plenty of non Jewish nannies over the years. I never ever let them bring any food into my house. I provided all food for them. I asked what kind of food they liked to have and bought it. I would not allow anyone to bring food into the house. None of them ever had an issue with this. In fact, they were happy about it.

SingALong

Sun, Feb 19 2023, 6:47 pm

Same as above. Ive had household help/Nannie’s for years. One of the first instructions was that they can never bring their own food. I provide meals. The end. They are usually happy about it. I’ve never had anyone insist they must bring their own food. I also give them a choice, tuna sandwich? Salad? Depending on what I have in the fridge

Frumme

Sun, Feb 19 2023, 6:48 pm

nachlaot wrote:

5) she's of an ethnicity where she's gonna want to eat her own food and not what we eat.

I don't understand this. Most people eat different cuisines all of the time. Why don't you ask her what types of food she eats and provide it? Like if she likes yogurt, have it readily available, if she likes tuna, have some made in the fridge so she can make a sandwich etc etc.

All I'm saying is, you might be making an assumption here. Ask her what she thinks about you providing food, and if so what kinds of things she eats, and from there decide if it's practical or not.

Sun, Feb 19 2023, 6:50 pm

ChutzPAh wrote:

Same. I also think it’s common practice to provide food to a full time nanny. You can offer to buy some things she may like and make a list of food options (ie sandwiches, tuna,frozen pizza, leftovers, other frozen meals, fruit, granola, yogurt, cereal, oatmeal) . I’ve had requests for hot sauce and different breads but nothing much more wild than that.

chanar

Sun, Feb 19 2023, 6:54 pm

Anyone who works in my house is told right away, you may not bring any of your own food in.. I provide meals.. I ask what they like, I try to accommodate. Lunch, for example, they make themselves a sandwhich, have a yoghurt, or I warm up pizza or leftovers for them. Dinner, they eat what we eat..

Ruchi

Sun, Feb 19 2023, 8:20 pm

Blessing1 wrote:

My LOR told me that a one may never leave a non jew or for that matter, anyone who doesn't observe kashrus laws, alone in the kitchen without being supervised. He said not even just to wash dishes.

Blessing1

Sun, Feb 19 2023, 8:46 pm

Ruchi wrote:

My LOR told me that a one may never leave a non jew or for that matter, anyone who doesn't observe kashrus laws, alone in the kitchen without being supervised. He said not even just to wash dishes.

We were told the same. And that the kitchen is automatically treif, even if they didn't do anything in the kitchen.

Chickensoupprof

Sun, Feb 19 2023, 8:49 pm

I think it’s the best to provide her meals. I must say though my non Jewish dad is more careful then my Jewish mother in my kitchen. My mum never will check eggs she find that the most silly thing ever. As in sometimes the non Jew is more respectful and cautions with kashrus than a secular Jew

Blessing1

Sun, Feb 19 2023, 9:05 pm

Chickensoupprof wrote:

But halacha is halacha. Halacha isn't based on if they're cautious or not. It doesn't change.

tichellady

Sun, Feb 19 2023, 9:32 pm

Blessing1 wrote:

But halacha is halacha. Halacha isn't based on if they're cautious or not. It doesn't change.

halacha is reasonable and logical so the circumstances definitely matter. it's a prohibition of bishul akum not standing in a kitchen akum

tichellady

Sun, Feb 19 2023, 9:33 pm

Blessing1 wrote:

We were told the same. And that the kitchen is automatically treif, even if they didn't do anything in the kitchen.

that's definitely not mainstream halacha.

ohmygosh

Sun, Feb 19 2023, 10:07 pm

She needs to know she cannot turn on the oven or stovetop to warm up or make food for the kids.
We have a non Jewish babysitter for after school hours until we come home and she knows that she has to wait until DC gets off the bus to turn on the oven to warm up dinner.

Chickensoupprof

Sun, Feb 19 2023, 11:48 pm

Blessing1 wrote:

But halacha is halacha. Halacha isn't based on if they're cautious or not. It doesn't change.

Sight im in the kitchen with him… right? I just hate the fact that by some people non Jews are discredited and treated as unworthy tramps