Do you think cleaning help is a luxury? Poll

amother

Bone

Fri, Jul 28 2023, 1:13 pm

I am SEVERELY dysfunctional with executive functioning and mental health issues AND cleaning help is a luxury because I'm POOR. So cleaning help doesn't come before eating and buying underwear for my kids. Any yes, my house is an absolute disastrous wreck and I work very hard to push myself so we can walk without tripping. I wish I could have cleaning help but I literally have no money. So it is a luxury in the sense that we can't starve but can live in a messy house, even though that's not good for many reasons, we aren't actually dying like we would if we starved.

amother

Mintgreen

Fri, Jul 28 2023, 1:15 pm

Yes its a luxury. The problem is that frum sociery today seems to think it’s a requirement to have a spotless house. You don’t need that. Obviously it needs to be livable but barring extreme circumstances you shouldn’t need a cleaning lady for your house to be livable. I only have cleaning help once a month because my mortgage is high. And every night me or my husband take a half hour to wipe counters and do dishes. In the mornings I spend a few minutes to pick up toys and throw stuff away or in the sink. My house is not perfect but it’s livable and I’m saving hundreds of dollars per month. You do not need to spend tons of money so your house looks like a catalogue.

If between you and your husband and your older children you don’t have 30-60 minutes per day for bare minimum maintenance, then there must be some sort of extreme circumstances.

amother

Lightgreen

Fri, Jul 28 2023, 1:28 pm

Yes and no. It depends on your income and your situation.
And what else you spend on.
I never ever buy takeout but I do have a cleaning lady once a week.

I have a playgroup in my house and it's not an option for my house to be dirty.

Now in the summer I have a daycamp with 25 kids. I took 3 hours of extra cleaning help. I look at it as a business expense. I'm working super hard. It doesn't mean we don't need the money I'm earning. It means I choose to spend an extra $70/week on a cleaning lady. The same way I'm "spending" money on paying my assistants.
Priorities.
(My girls didn't go to camp or daycamp because I can't afford it but I'm still having my cleaning lady!)
I didn't answer the poll cause I dk which to check off!

amother

Khaki

Fri, Jul 28 2023, 1:29 pm

Do we all agree on the operative definition of”luxury”?
Technically anything but bread and water and a roof over yiur head is luxury.
I have a feeling people define luxury differently. And then we’re all talking over each other’s heads.

Ema of 5

Fri, Jul 28 2023, 1:40 pm

amother Mintgreen wrote:

Or life is just hectic. Or some or all of the above mentioned people are not home until 8:00 or 9:00 at night. Or who knows what else. No one needs to defend their need for a cleaning lady, if they determine it is a need.

amother

Mintgreen

Fri, Jul 28 2023, 2:07 pm

Ema of 5 wrote:

If you can afford it, that’s great. But that doesn’t mean it’s not a luxury. Somehow people with less income get by with messier houses because they simply don’t have the choice. Having a clean house typically means one spouse works less or you have extra disposable income - both of which are luxuries. Having the choice to work less or spend hundreds of dollars of month on cleaning help is totally a luxury that most of the world does not enjoy.

The problem is we’ve accustomed ourselves to such high standards of living that we’ve don’t even know what basic needs are anymore.

amother

Mistyrose

Fri, Jul 28 2023, 2:13 pm

It definitely is a luxury my opinion But it could also be necessary. I have cleaning up on and off over the years depending on our financial situation. I do have a playgroup in my home and I use our living space I don’t have a separate space. I also work long hours and don’t really have much time between my kids and My work. Getting a lot of chores done I just don’t have the time for considering once my kids come home I need to do dinner and homework and clean up just from the day . I do have someone who comes twice a week she is a lifesaver I Know if I get my laundry washed It will get folded. They’re having times she wasn’t able to come for a week or 2 and I Managed without getting a fill in But it’s really hard. I wish I didn’t rely on it as much as I do There was a point where I was really considering cutting back on hours due to financial constraints but it Worked out that I didn’t have to and it was really hard for me to do it . This definitely a luxury that I Prioritize I don’t really do takeout

Ema of 5

Fri, Jul 28 2023, 2:42 pm

amother Mintgreen wrote:

It’s not about messier or not messier. Again, I don’t understand why others get to decide what is a luxury for others. It is a luxury for you. That doesn’t mean it is a luxury for everyone else. Why is that so hard to understand? One doesn’t need to have extenuating circumstances in order for it to be a need. If someone says it is a need for them, that should be taken at face value. Only I can determine what is a need for me.

zaq

Fri, Jul 28 2023, 2:47 pm

amother Mintgreen wrote:

Somehow people with less income get by with messier houses because they simply don’t have the choice.

Or they have less stuff to get messy. My parents never had much money but they were crazy clean. My bff whose mom was a hoarder and whose dad always bought things in wholesale quantities (why buy one of something when you can buy two dozen?) was always amazed at how little stuff my parents had.

I find that the less stuff I have the easier it is to keep what I do have clean and tidy.

amother

DarkCyan

Fri, Jul 28 2023, 2:49 pm

amother OP wrote:

Very interesting poll results so far. Can anyone help me interpret them?

No, this site is skewed in favor of thinking that cleaning help is the norm. The same poll in the general population would likely yield very different results.

amother

Apple

Fri, Jul 28 2023, 2:51 pm

amother Mintgreen wrote:

If between you and your husband and your older children you don’t have 30-60 minutes per day for bare minimum maintenance, then there must be some sort of extreme circumstances.

What if your "older" children are three and four years old? And one of them has special needs and you take him to therapy four times a week? And you work fulltime and commute an hour each way and your dh is starting a business and working 18 hours a day 6 days a week? Are these "extreme" circumstances in your book?

amother

Starflower

Fri, Jul 28 2023, 2:52 pm

It is definitely not a necessity. And most people don't WANT to clean but part of being an adult is sometimes doing things you don't enjoy. In a typical family there is no reason why everyone can't pitch in a bit to keep the house clean.

amother

Oxfordblue

Fri, Jul 28 2023, 2:56 pm

amother Mintgreen wrote:

What you're saying is, and this is not easy for many to swallow, is that
A CLEAN HOME IS A LUXURY.

(not talking about livable, talking about clean)

Of course some are able to prioritize luxuries and get them economically, like the woman who only eats luxury artisinal sourdough bread, because she makes it herself. (Although we can argue that maybe she should sell her bread and buy cheap white bread for her family instead of using that time for her own luxuries and getting tuition discounts.)

But either you're using a lot of your time that maybe should be going to necessities, or you're spending money for someone else to do it. Either way, you're saying it's a luxury.

I wonder how many agree.

amother

Magenta

Fri, Jul 28 2023, 3:03 pm

amother OP wrote:

S/o of all the other cleaning lady and luxury threads. I really think those who are saying that cleaning help is a luxury, don't understand what it's like to live with mental health and executive function issues. (As an aside I have both and don't have a cleaning lady because it would take up too much of my mental capacity to get one, be on top of my mess enough... please don't judge. But it would make such a huge difference in my life.)

Please answer the poll. I'm curious what the results are.

I don't understand this thread.
Does it really make a difference to anyone on here what I think?? Does it make a difference to me if someone thinks my help is a luxury?
There are so so so many factors - how many kids, what ages, are you working or not, how big the house is...and then of course what type of kids, special needs etc. What type DH is, what type you are and on and on

amother

Silver

Fri, Jul 28 2023, 3:04 pm

Seems like the underlying assumption on cleaning help not being a luxury is that having a clean home is a necessity.

IMO if I’m pregnant and sick or postpartum and sick, the house will be a mess and that’s ok.

smss

Fri, Jul 28 2023, 3:06 pm

Mental health and executive dysfunction are two reasons why cleaning help may be a necessity for some.

Here are some others I can think of:
Chronic pain
Chronic low energy/fatigue
Genuine lack of time due to a busy life

And I'm sure there are more.

Unless someone's expecting me to pay for their cleaning help, I'm never gonna question them if they say they need it.

happy chick

Fri, Jul 28 2023, 3:06 pm

This very much depends on circumstances.

For a woman who works, has a bunch of littles ones, has any type on mental/physical health issues, it can be a necessity.

For the woman who doesn't work and doesn't have a bunch of kids at home and is perfectly healthy in every way, shape and form but prefers to keepy busy running around to the salons and shopping at every new boutique, it is a luxury.

However, this is a personal choice for each individual how to spend their money. No judgment necessary.

Ema of 5

Fri, Jul 28 2023, 3:10 pm

amother Silver wrote:

The underlying assumption is that anyone who thinks cleaning help is a necessity is wrong. We must all agree that it is a luxury.
I still haven’t gotten an answer as to why how I view cleaning help in my life affects you.

amother

Sage

Fri, Jul 28 2023, 5:16 pm

amother Red wrote:

I think having cleaning help for a few hours once a week is not a luxury. But every day or a few times a week is, and I would love that if I could afford it. I work though if that makes a difference.

Yes
It’s not a luxury 1-2 times a week
Every day, or a live in is