How to navigate sudden poverty

theoneandonly

Wed, Oct 25 2023, 11:49 am

amother Dodgerblue wrote:

Ummmm if he lost his job because he stole money, sorry I don’t feel bad for you.

What a horrible thing to say!
A. You don't know if he stole, she listed a bunch of options it may have been
B. Even if he did steal, she may not have known, or she may have known and been begging him to stop but he refused... Why should she be punished for his actions?
And if you are going to insult someone at least have the b@lls to do it under your own screenname...

amother

Aquamarine

Wed, Oct 25 2023, 12:20 pm

amother Olive wrote:

I think there is a huge difference between losing a job for social skills reasons and losing a job for stealing company assets. Am I wrong here? In terms of how you relate to your husband. Many husbands have poor social skills. Not many steal company assets. So that’s a factor too.

And, how is your husband reacting? Is he confident about the future or is he freaking out and facing a trial or jail time or loss of his license? I have had acquaintances that have gone through that. Some came out okay and some didn’t. The one that came out the best used Ben Brafman.

Would a company really give 4 weeks’ notice for something drastic like that?? Not from what I’ve seen.

amother

Watermelon

Wed, Oct 25 2023, 12:24 pm

I am sorry you are in this position. My thoughts are:

If you have a low interest rate on your mortgage, don't sell. With today's interest rates, you'll end up in a much smaller home for the same money, or more. If you can rent out your house, it might be worth doing that and moving to a smaller place that you rent.

Talk to the kids' schools.

I am assuming you've given tzedaka in the past, and not thought poorly of those who needed help. We all need help at times, that's what our communities are for. Look into what resources are available to you.

Do you have any expensive jewelry or furniture you can imagine living without? Designer shoes and clothing? Maybe you can sell a few things to boost your cash reserve and help get you through at least in the short term.

If you own your cars, and they're high end cars, you might be able to to sell them and buy something smaller or less expensive.

Call your utility companies--water, power, cell phone, etc--and see if they have programs for lower income customers. You might be able to get those bills cut drastically.

There are huge penalties on early cash out off retirement accounts. However, you might be able to take a loan from a 401K with no penalty, as long as you back in back in time. Also, if you have IRAs, you can withdraw the amount of your contribution without penalties at any time. You would have to pay penalties/taxes on any growth, so make sure you know how much you originally contributed and try to limit your withdrawals to that amount.

For "small stuff" changes--switch from brand names to generics for groceries, start to do laundry in cold water (except for the dirtiest of clothes, this is fine!), conslidate your errands to save on gas, switch one or two meat meals each week to something grain or egg based, try to do your own cleaning and lawn work, sell your kids old things at Once Upon a Child.

Sewsew_mom

Wed, Oct 25 2023, 1:06 pm

amother Dodgerblue wrote:

Ummmm if he lost his job because he stole money, sorry I don’t feel bad for you.

Yikes. I don't recall OP saying please feel bad for me.
But I also wonder why her husbands actions would define her and the struggles she has.
Probably wise to reevaluate the judgmental part of this comment..
Sorry OP.
And there are organizations out there that would tell you to please accept before selling a house. It entails alot to move. It's expensive and there are long term effects on children.
Yes it may seem so terrifying to be on the receiving end.. And also it's actually truly amazing to understand how there are people who are so happy to give.
Hashem took care of you until today, please believe he will continue to take care of you as long as you let him into your life.

amother

Daisy

Wed, Oct 25 2023, 1:24 pm

amother Aquamarine wrote:

Would a company really give 4 weeks’ notice for something drastic like that?? Not from what I’ve seen.

I've only worked once at a company where an employee was caught embezzling. They were walked out of the office by the police in handcuffs.

I don't understand the juxtaposition of "stealing" with understandable issues like job performance or not being a good social fit with the company is odd.

Many people like the kind of social skills that make them good at office politics or sales but they thrive in jobs which require different skills - I.e. the skill of a CPA or tax lawyer is different than a litigator.

Tzutzie

Wed, Oct 25 2023, 2:03 pm

amother OP wrote:

DH was just told he’s losing his job. He was earning around $600k/year (before taxes) which I know sounds like a ton but we are a family of 8 living in the tri state area and have very little savings. I earn $70k/year (before taxes) and we spend over $100k/year on tuition and mortgage alone.

He was given 4 weeks notice. For various reasons, the chance of him finding a job that pays that amount (or ANY job at all) within the next 4-8 weeks is slim to none. I honestly doubt he’ll find another job paying anywhere near this amount EVER.

I’m trying to take a deep breathe and figure out how to make this work but am seriously at a loss.

Some questions I have are:
1) How do I get health insurance for my family (we currently are on insurance through his employer but obviously that will end and there’s no way we can afford the cobra rates)?
2) What, if any, programs will we be eligible for (to help pay for groceries) and how do we get them? We’ve never been on public assistance but I don’t see how we’ll pay for even groceries after the first month (we have enough savings to get us through a month or two)?
3) I know we have to call the schools to ask for tuition breaks (currently paying around $15k/child/year) but we’re still going to have to pay SOMETHING. How are we going to find the $ for this?
4) Are we supposed to be emptying out our retirement account (would buy us another couple of years)? Sell our house? Both?

I am having such anxiety over this please give me any suggestions and resources you have on how to navigate this.

Thank you!

No advice but major hugs.

amother

Maize

Wed, Oct 25 2023, 2:05 pm

amother Dodgerblue wrote:

Ummmm if he lost his job because he stole money, sorry I don’t feel bad for you.

Really? U don’t feel bad for his wife who supported him through school and starting his career and her whole life is changing because of whatever mistake he made? Seriously?

My hashem never test you with being let down by a spouse.

amother

Maize

Wed, Oct 25 2023, 2:09 pm

amother Electricblue wrote:

If you were living on that amount of money then there's obviously a place to cut. I would look very carefully through your monthly expenses and see what can be cut. Most people live in a lot less of a salary than that and are fine.

Really don’t get why this line of commentary is needed- obviously ppl live in less but they didn’t live on much less because they (I assume) have tzeddaka, took a mortgage, made tuition commitments, took out loans for schooling- all based on this expected income. So they can’t just cut down to 70k overnight.

Doesn’t mean it’s impossible but it has to be done smartly.

amother

Wed, Oct 25 2023, 2:20 pm

amother Maize wrote:

Are there really people in the tri state area with six school age children living on $70k? How?
Mortgage is around $40k/year and even if we beg and cry and plead I can't imagine the schools letting us pay less than $5k/child (we currently pay about triple that) which would be $30k leaving NOTHING left of the $70k salary. If you know of people who live on $70k/year (or do yourself), please give me tips on how

amother

Electricblue

Wed, Oct 25 2023, 2:25 pm

amother Maize wrote:

That's not what I said. Op was living on 670k. That's A LOT of money! She should see where she can cut as much as she can. And there will be place to cut. She is going to need to find more income somehow. She is going to need more than 70k even though ppl live on that also.

amother

Maize

Wed, Oct 25 2023, 2:34 pm

amother Electricblue wrote:

She wasn’t living on that though. That’s what people don’t get.

After taxes they probably had 400 ish.

Insurance + out of pocket/ deductibles for their size family is probably easily 80k.

Tuition around the same?

Loan repayments - we have a lower income but pay 60k a year in loan payment.

Maser either before or after insurance around 40/50k.

So you’re at 200k before mortgage, camp and life.

It a wonderful salary and I’m sure they were living comfortably before, but it makes sense that they may not have accumulated assets, and cutting down the big stuff doesn’t happen overnight and they’ll still probably need minimum 200k to be human depending on his loans.

Some loans (federal I think) u don’t have to pay if you’re low income so that’s something to check.

amother

Blueberry

Wed, Oct 25 2023, 2:35 pm

amother OP wrote:

People living on 70k with 6 kids in school are on programs, tzedaka, are dirt poor and dont own houses. Maybe they get vouchers for school or headstart.
It seems that the next step would be to increase your hours if possible and for your husband to look for ANY job. If he's not working you don't need to pay for childcare and can get rid of one of your cars if you have two.

Highstrung

Wed, Oct 25 2023, 2:46 pm

amother OP wrote:

Your DH will need to find another job . So it will be his income plus the 70k you earn. I’m so sorry you are going through this . HaShem should give you the yishuv hadaas to go about this huge life change easily and seamlessly.

amother

Cornsilk

Wed, Oct 25 2023, 2:50 pm

There are companies in Manhattan that assist in writing resumes and answering interview questions on why he lost his job, etc. I think it may be worthwhile to spend the money on this now and then quickly work w headhunters to search for a new job. He has student loans so I am assuming he is a lawyer or something, I would think he can find a job even if it’s not 600k it will help!

amother

Quince

Wed, Oct 25 2023, 3:59 pm

amother Maize wrote:

I can't imagine niether is getting insurance from work, and it's impossible to spend that much. There are out of pocket maximums.

amother

Electricblue

Wed, Oct 25 2023, 4:08 pm

amother Maize wrote:

Your insurance costs are really high. At this point she can get on child health plus or wtvr the equivalent is in her state for the kids and adults can get a cheap marketplace plan or a healthshare for cheap.

She never said her dh has loans so how do you know he does?

She should ask about maaser

Is there any place in your home you can rent out? That's makes a nice amount.

Can you in raise your hours?