There are no normal jobs for men

amother

Almond

Wed, Mar 13 2024, 7:08 am

I work in secular companies and have worked in many companies of different sizes.

The reality is that $60,000 is actually a fairly decent salary for someone with only a high school diploma and essentially no experience and what appears to be fairly minimal skills - I.e. nothing that a reasonably hard working person couldn't do.

He needs to have marketable skills that are worth a higher salary if that is his goal.

He doesn't have skills that provide a higher level of pay like IT, electrical or even plumbing.

He doesn't have a college degree and the reality is that most corporations require a college degree to hire people for positions in which they are on a career path.

He doesn't have accounting skills or a degree in business administration

It is difficult but the best thing he can do at this point is work with an actual career counselor and then work towards acquiring the certificates or degrees that would enable him to actually have a more well paying job with growth potential - or at least a job with a higher salary that brings good benefits. For example, health insurance for a family could be worth $20,000 in actual income since it isn't taxes.

It might be hard to take the necessary courses while working but people do this and often there are less expensive ways to get there like community colleges or grants.

ETA - There is a lot of anti-college bias on imamother but the reality is that college graduates do earn more than high school graduates in general. While they might start at $60,000 this is for positions in corporations which are viewed as promotable. All of the "assistants" at companies I worked for had degrees. Those without degrees stall at the bottom rung because they aren't viewed as promotable to higher levels.

mha3484

Wed, Mar 13 2024, 7:46 am

Most men who are not a licensed professional of some sort or in a trade find jobs by networking in shul and at events. He should tell every friend he has that he is looking. Go out of your comfort zone and introduce yourself to new people. Ask his friends to introduce him to people. Its hard but I feel like that really is how a lot of people get jobs.

I don't think college overall is a scam. A lot of good professions require it but private college is 1000% not worth it. Use your local community college or state school and find a really practical degree that will give him job security.

amother

Glitter

Wed, Mar 13 2024, 7:48 am

mha3484 wrote:

Agreed. Such as accounting, nursing- np, pa, etc.

amother

Apricot

Wed, Mar 13 2024, 7:49 am

I work in the finance/accounting field. If he interested in that, I think it's a great career path for men if he can get an accounting degree. There are lots of jobs in the frum world and many of the higher paying/upper management jobs may be more suited for men because they require longer hours.
He should also try to get certified in whatever he can at his job now to prove his skills to a future employers. Like if he works with a specific e-commerce platform, he should check if that platform offers certification.

amother

White

Wed, Mar 13 2024, 7:56 am

I don't know all your details, but the market isn't amazing yet.

My husband lost his job about a year ago due to the company not doing so great. He has a degree and years of experience. He sent out 100s of resumes, took online courses to up his game to more "modern technologies", reached out to recruiters, etc. He barely got interviews and it took months before he BH found a job.

It is not the first time he was laid off due to company finances and in the past he had tons of interest in his resume. Multiple interviews in the a week, etc. This time he was lucky to get 3 interviews a month!

I am not talking about the frum world jobs. Jobs for regular companies.

amother

Daylily

Wed, Mar 13 2024, 7:58 am

My husb started off 5 years ago at 52k, working full full time, crazy hours. This is while he was in college. After graduation, he got offered 65k, grew up to 70k. Bh he left that job after a few years and is growing. Lots of work and years making a lower salary. Ppl think that it’s so easy to get raises and to get offered higher, it’s not! No one pays for nothing. We also have high student loans…. Iyh we hope in the future he’ll be making much better to compensate the years and student loans. Growth doesn’t happen overnight, even with degrees.

amother

Lightyellow

Wed, Mar 13 2024, 7:59 am

This is why yeshivas should have vocational programs.
Of course nobody wants to pay more than $60,000 to someone with no degrees and no advanced experience and specialized skills.
I don't mean to be insensitive to your situation. This is a very hard number to raise a family on. But business owners aren't going to pay more than a job is worth just to be nice.

amother

Almond

Wed, Mar 13 2024, 7:59 am

amother Glitter wrote:

Agreed. Such as accounting, nursing- np, pa, etc.

But all of those career paths require a degree or certification of some kind.

Meaning no disrespect to OP, I am not sure what OP means by a "normal job" since OP has what would be considered a fairly well paying job for someone with only a high school education and no really marketable skills.

People seem to be suggesting career paths that require degrees or certifications that might make one more employable than a college degree with a major in History. But the reality is that a History Major with a college degree will have a better career path than a high school graduate with no "blue collar" certificates or skills like IT or electrical proficiency.

It is not "normal" for a high school graduate to earn $100,000 or $150,000 absent very unusual circumstances and statistically it doesn't happen for most people which is exactly why a college degree is generally viewed as very important as it opens doors even for people without specific STEM or business degrees.

mha3484

Wed, Mar 13 2024, 8:08 am

I agree and disagree. I think there is a set of professions that really do need a degree and if OPs husband wants to go into that he should do that with as little debt as possible.

But there are a lot of fields in the current world we live in that care more about what you can do vs your degree. Anything in programming, art, graphics, video editing, photography. My company is doing a new website and the prices quoted made me fall over. I can believe these web designers/digital marketers can make 100k without college.

I work with a lot of healthcare companies and plenty of the more administrative jobs they send me dont require college and pay very decently. So I think there is a lot of complexity in the do I need a degree question.

amother

Razzmatazz

Wed, Mar 13 2024, 8:13 am

mha3484 wrote:

You said your not in Lakewood. If you are in the Midwest, I am a healthcare recruiter for many years and may have some suggestions. Feel free to PM me.

Do you do law? We are willing to relocate to some places and DH is a lawyer and having no luck finding a job. He can often also do work telecommuting and did in the past so that is also an option...

amother

Almond

Wed, Mar 13 2024, 8:21 am

mha3484 wrote:

These professions actually require specific knowledge to do and/or require talent. Not everyone has the ability to be a good photographer or graphic designer anymore than anyone has the ability to do other jobs that require specific skills or talent.

In terms of web designers and digital marketers, it requires technical expertise, knowledge of marketing, talent in terms of having some kind of creative prowess Los business acumen if they are running their own business.

How do you know they are actually netting $100,000

mha3484

Wed, Mar 13 2024, 8:25 am

I said I can believe it. The cheapest quote we got was around 6800 and the others were way over 10k up to 30k for a pretty uncomplicated company page.

I think to do anything well with a decent parnossah you need training. The question is do you need a degree or can you do a coding boot camp or online courses in design etc. Its complicated. I used to be very pro college then I went the other way now I have settled into the middle.

amother

Almond

Wed, Mar 13 2024, 8:32 am

mha3484 wrote:

No one is saying a college degree is the inky way but you do need training of some kind. For most people a college degree is a more certain way to open up doors especially since it doesn’t limit one to a specific set of skills and in general a lot of very good jobs for ordinary people like nursing or accounting are only available with a college degree as a minimum.

But I think most people are responding to OP who appears shocked thst someone with only a high school degree and no specific certificates, training and skills is *only* making $60,000 per year when the realty is thst is a relatively high income for that person - mewnjng no disrespect to her husband.

amother

Wed, Mar 13 2024, 8:55 am

amother Almond wrote:

He actually has a bachelors degree but not in a a specific field. I forgot to mention that. I’m not even sure what it is to be honest
Also I have mentioned before that he’s not applying to jobs that require any exceptional skill or degree. Obviously I wouldn’t be surprised he’s having a hard time then lol.
He’s applying to regular jobs not much more than what he’s doing now but happen to be paying more and still doesn’t have luck. That’s why I’m shocked

amother

Wed, Mar 13 2024, 9:01 am

amother Almond wrote:

By a normal job I mean something that has more potential for growth than what he has now and somewhere that he can actually learn skills even while doing an entry level job that he can take with him in the future
He’s not learning anything now that can take him further. 60k is good but it’s not good if it’s going to stay like that. That’s why he’s looking for something new. Either to grow in a company with time, or learn skills so that he can broaden his skillset, or to get a degree