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-> Simcha Section
smilingmom
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 Fri, Jul 31 2009, 6:55 pm
I am sorry if I didn't make myself clear, but I said
| smilingmom wrote: | We are not complaining, and we are happy to do so.
They are not high maintenance and my son and his kallah are worth more than we can ever spend. |
When I got married, DH & I set up our own household. We were both working (he was my boss) and had a joint bank account for a year and a half before we got married.
My son chose a different path My son is learning and his wife is supporting them. They are mature young adults and are ready to commit to marriage, but need financial help to set up, which I repeat I gladly give.
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freidasima
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Sat, Aug 01 2009, 2:56 pm
We married off both a son and a daughter and we paid half the wedding and shabbat chatan-sheva brochos expenses for both.
Dd had been living in a rented apartment for work in a different city before she got married and so was son in law so they had linens and basic kitchen stuff. But they both worked. Same for ds although he just like son in law is still in school in addition to working.
In MO there is no sheitl/kapote business. I would love my girls to wear a sheitl but the younger generation either wears hats (dd) or fancy tied kerchiefs (daughter in law). Maybe I will have luck with the two younger ones.
Here in EY it is normal for parents of the chossen and kallah to split costs of the chasuneh down the middle. Apartments are usually also split down the middle but often parents of a girl get her an apartment because it's a good selling factor in looking for a chossen. Of course that depends if they can afford it but if they can it helps. Or for a family to have a second apartment if they can afford it so that one of the kids in turn can use it for the first year or so after marriage, I have several friends who did this.
As the other two girls and our chayal live at home (although I don't know how long after the army our chayal will stay here, depends on where he decides to go to school) and don't have linens etc. Whenever I go shopping for myself I buy double or triple. So the kids have pots and pans put away for them and each one has a magimix put away and that's about it. Linens and the like we will buy for them when they get married, even if they are working, they should save their money for life afterwards and their wedding present money should be used for the future.
This is of course if we can afford it. If both girls still at home get married the same time (I hope the chayal doesn't plan to do so in the near future, he's only 19!) it will be tight but we have budgeted for it.
Do you give girls more than you give boys? I don't know. We gave son in law a shas when they got engaged, he didn't want new tfilin as he just had gotten, and of course for the wedding dd (with our money) got him a tallis. We gave ds a new shas for an engagement present as we saw that his in laws were rather clueless about these kind of niceties, but we also gave our future daughter in law big money to buy silver lachter. He bought her the engagement ring out of his savings and did son in law for our oldest dd. Daughter in law had lived away from home during college so she had linens and some household things and our other kids bought them some furniture for a weddding present.
What would we do if none of them would have had anything and they would have been students? Well we sure couldn't afford to set anyone up completely, maybe I would have told them to move in here for a while with us to save money ( and have them blanch and make other plans)...
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Ruchel
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Sat, Aug 01 2009, 5:02 pm
By here, there are definitely strict MO and JPF of all origins/minhagim in sheitels (every day, for shabbes, for simches, etc). For the look more than because they believe it's better than a scarf or hat.
(Ironically it's one of the things that makes alia more difficult for these women. They say it's easier to find a DL accepting of partial or not covering than of sheitels...)
Definitely though the parents don't buy an apartment! Very often frum parents don't own their apartment themselves, never mind the kids!! Who can afford to buy an apartment for every child realy?? millionaires??
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manhattanmom
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Sat, Aug 01 2009, 10:58 pm
| mommy#1 wrote: | | manhattanmom wrote: | | mommy#1 wrote: | | DefyGravity wrote: | | Oftentimes, FLOP can end up coming out to around half the wedding costs. |
yeah, 1/2 the WEDDING costs, but the kallah has to buy furniture, sheitels, apartment... and the list goes on. the chosson, at least in my circles, only brings his clothes to the house. oh, & a car |
Since when does the kallah's family have to buy an apartment and fully furnish it before the wedding?
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I wrote "IN MY CIRCLES"! that is whats done in my circles, whether its right or not |
I understood you loud and clear the first time, I still don't think it's necessary. What happens "IN YOUR CIRCLES" if the parents just can't afford to buy fine furniture for their adult children? I just don't get it, sorry.
Your parents should keep some savings for themselves to live and retire comfortably after spending nearly 20 years paying multiple tuitions, healthcare, a mortgage/rent and whatever else comes with life.
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alpidarkomama
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Sun, Aug 02 2009, 4:43 am
| DefyGravity wrote: | | smilingmom wrote: | Thanks everyone for your responses.
Defy, you sound very angry in your posts.
Paying for a wedding and setting up their household, is a mitzvah I gladly do.
I wonder, if a couple is in medical school, living in the dorm and decide to get married, should they wait until they are both finished with the residency so that they are "capable of buying basic adult items", because until "then maybe they're not ready for marriage."? |
If they can't support themselves, then they should wait to get married. If they have parents that can help them, fine. I feel the same way about the young couples that get married and can't support themselves. If the parents can afford it, fine. However, It's sad that people are expected to take care of their adult children, especially if they can't afford to do so.
It doesn't make me angry, but I think it's a bad system that just breeds a society of people that are constantly going to be dependent on other people. |
Defy, I didn't think you sounded angry at all! Practical, funny, and RIGHT ON! If parents can afford to do such things, I only hope it doesn't detract from the couple's ability to make their own way and pay for their own life (in cash!).
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shabbatiscoming
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Sun, Aug 02 2009, 5:03 am
| freidasima wrote: | | Here in EY it is normal for parents of the chossen and kallah to split costs of the chasuneh down the middle. Apartments are usually also split down the middle but often parents of a girl get her an apartment because it's a good selling factor in looking for a chossen. Of course that depends if they can afford it but if they can it helps. | freidasima I know that I have butted heads with you on this before, but I truely do not know any MO people in israel who have bought apartments for their children. ive only heard of it in the charedi world and even there not everyone does it.
its just interesting that ive never heard of it and youve only heard of it. who knows.
I also agree with defy, that it should not be something that is a must in any community, even if it is "what is done" to buy an apartment for a couple. why cant a couple start off renting a place and going from there? with their own money? or with a little bit of help from their parents? I dont understand why parents have to take, lets just say, 100,000 dollars of their money to buy their children a home? when the coupe is just starting out.....I dont get it.
for our wedding, I think that my in laws paid for only part of some of the things, but it was a very fair exchange. my in laws came from south africa to america. they did not know anyone at their own son's wedding, so I think they paid for the band and maybe flowers and my parents paid for everything else. but I thin kthat usually it is 50/50.
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creativemommyto3
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Sun, Aug 02 2009, 5:26 am
| shabbatiscoming wrote: | | freidasima wrote: | | Here in EY it is normal for parents of the chossen and kallah to split costs of the chasuneh down the middle. Apartments are usually also split down the middle but often parents of a girl get her an apartment because it's a good selling factor in looking for a chossen. Of course that depends if they can afford it but if they can it helps. | freidasima I know that I have butted heads with you on this before, but I truely do not know any MO people in israel who have bought apartments for their children. ive only heard of it in the charedi world and even there not everyone does it.
its just interesting that ive never heard of it and youve only heard of it. who knows.
I also agree with defy, that it should not be something that is a must in any community, even if it is "what is done" to buy an apartment for a couple. why cant a couple start off renting a place and going from there? with their own money? or with a little bit of help from their parents? I dont understand why parents have to take, lets just say, 100,000 dollars of their money to buy their children a home? when the coupe is just starting out.....I dont get it.
for our wedding, I think that my in laws paid for only part of some of the things, but it was a very fair exchange. my in laws came from south africa to america. they did not know anyone at their own son's wedding, so I think they paid for the band and maybe flowers and my parents paid for everything else. but I thin kthat usually it is 50/50. |
If parents could afford it , paying for the down payment for a couple 's home is the best start they could give them. I would make a cheap wedding and give the couple a good start.. Why throw out all that money for rent?
Everybody goes bananas over this but it's a much better system than spending around 10,000 dollars a year per child on tuition.. The down payment on a home is a one time deal.. and a huge investment for the future. While Torah education is the same, the money for tuition is not just for the education.
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shabbatiscoming
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Sun, Aug 02 2009, 5:29 am
| creativemommyto3 wrote: | | shabbatiscoming wrote: | | freidasima wrote: | | Here in EY it is normal for parents of the chossen and kallah to split costs of the chasuneh down the middle. Apartments are usually also split down the middle but often parents of a girl get her an apartment because it's a good selling factor in looking for a chossen. Of course that depends if they can afford it but if they can it helps. | freidasima I know that I have butted heads with you on this before, but I truely do not know any MO people in israel who have bought apartments for their children. ive only heard of it in the charedi world and even there not everyone does it.
its just interesting that ive never heard of it and youve only heard of it. who knows.
I also agree with defy, that it should not be something that is a must in any community, even if it is "what is done" to buy an apartment for a couple. why cant a couple start off renting a place and going from there? with their own money? or with a little bit of help from their parents? I dont understand why parents have to take, lets just say, 100,000 dollars of their money to buy their children a home? when the coupe is just starting out.....I dont get it.
for our wedding, I think that my in laws paid for only part of some of the things, but it was a very fair exchange. my in laws came from south africa to america. they did not know anyone at their own son's wedding, so I think they paid for the band and maybe flowers and my parents paid for everything else. but I thin kthat usually it is 50/50. |
If parents could afford it , paying for the down payment for a couple 's home is the best start they could give them. I would make a cheap wedding and give the couple a good start.. Why throw out all that money for rent?
Everybody goes bananas over this but it's a much better system than spending around 10,000 dollars a year per child on tuition.. The down payment on a home is a one time deal.. and a huge investment for the future. While Torah education is the same, the money for tuition is not just for the education. | if they can afford it then thats wonderful and kol hakavod to the parents and thats wonderful. what I was saying was that in some communities it is expected that the apartment will be paid for even if the parents can not afford it. why should it be that way? and also, not everyone stays where they start out. meaning, if I would have had my first apartment paid for where I lived when I first got married, I would be highly peeved because my husband and I did not end up staying there for more than two years. then what?
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creativemommyto3
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Sun, Aug 02 2009, 5:36 am
| shabbatiscoming wrote: | | creativemommyto3 wrote: | | shabbatiscoming wrote: | | freidasima wrote: | | Here in EY it is normal for parents of the chossen and kallah to split costs of the chasuneh down the middle. Apartments are usually also split down the middle but often parents of a girl get her an apartment because it's a good selling factor in looking for a chossen. Of course that depends if they can afford it but if they can it helps. | freidasima I know that I have butted heads with you on this before, but I truely do not know any MO people in israel who have bought apartments for their children. ive only heard of it in the charedi world and even there not everyone does it.
its just interesting that ive never heard of it and youve only heard of it. who knows.
I also agree with defy, that it should not be something that is a must in any community, even if it is "what is done" to buy an apartment for a couple. why cant a couple start off renting a place and going from there? with their own money? or with a little bit of help from their parents? I dont understand why parents have to take, lets just say, 100,000 dollars of their money to buy their children a home? when the coupe is just starting out.....I dont get it.
for our wedding, I think that my in laws paid for only part of some of the things, but it was a very fair exchange. my in laws came from south africa to america. they did not know anyone at their own son's wedding, so I think they paid for the band and maybe flowers and my parents paid for everything else. but I thin kthat usually it is 50/50. |
If parents could afford it , paying for the down payment for a couple 's home is the best start they could give them. I would make a cheap wedding and give the couple a good start.. Why throw out all that money for rent?
Everybody goes bananas over this but it's a much better system than spending around 10,000 dollars a year per child on tuition.. The down payment on a home is a one time deal.. and a huge investment for the future. While Torah education is the same, the money for tuition is not just for the education. | if they can afford it then thats wonderful and kol hakavod to the parents and thats wonderful. what I was saying was that in some communities it is expected that the apartment will be paid for even if the parents can not afford it. why should it be that way? and also, not everyone stays where they start out. meaning, if I would have had my first apartment paid for where I lived when I first got married, I would be highly peeved because my husband and I did not end up staying there for more than two years. then what? |
You are right. So put the money in a trust for the couple IF you have it. But in no way should it be a condition for a shidduch.
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shabbatiscoming
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Sun, Aug 02 2009, 5:38 am
| creativemommyto3 wrote: | | shabbatiscoming wrote: | | creativemommyto3 wrote: | | shabbatiscoming wrote: | | freidasima wrote: | | Here in EY it is normal for parents of the chossen and kallah to split costs of the chasuneh down the middle. Apartments are usually also split down the middle but often parents of a girl get her an apartment because it's a good selling factor in looking for a chossen. Of course that depends if they can afford it but if they can it helps. | freidasima I know that I have butted heads with you on this before, but I truely do not know any MO people in israel who have bought apartments for their children. ive only heard of it in the charedi world and even there not everyone does it.
its just interesting that ive never heard of it and youve only heard of it. who knows.
I also agree with defy, that it should not be something that is a must in any community, even if it is "what is done" to buy an apartment for a couple. why cant a couple start off renting a place and going from there? with their own money? or with a little bit of help from their parents? I dont understand why parents have to take, lets just say, 100,000 dollars of their money to buy their children a home? when the coupe is just starting out.....I dont get it.
for our wedding, I think that my in laws paid for only part of some of the things, but it was a very fair exchange. my in laws came from south africa to america. they did not know anyone at their own son's wedding, so I think they paid for the band and maybe flowers and my parents paid for everything else. but I thin kthat usually it is 50/50. |
If parents could afford it , paying for the down payment for a couple 's home is the best start they could give them. I would make a cheap wedding and give the couple a good start.. Why throw out all that money for rent?
Everybody goes bananas over this but it's a much better system than spending around 10,000 dollars a year per child on tuition.. The down payment on a home is a one time deal.. and a huge investment for the future. While Torah education is the same, the money for tuition is not just for the education. | if they can afford it then thats wonderful and kol hakavod to the parents and thats wonderful. what I was saying was that in some communities it is expected that the apartment will be paid for even if the parents can not afford it. why should it be that way? and also, not everyone stays where they start out. meaning, if I would have had my first apartment paid for where I lived when I first got married, I would be highly peeved because my husband and I did not end up staying there for more than two years. then what? |
You are right. So put the money in a trust for the couple IF you have it. But in no way should it be a condition for a shidduch. | right, that is exactly what I meant by what I said 
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smilingmom
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Sun, Aug 02 2009, 7:34 am
As I stated when I started this post, I felt my DS wedding is costing more than I thought a grooms famliy would normally pay.
I based it on my previous experience and those of my friends (not from our community). So I checked Modern Bride and found this breakdown.
They give 2 breakdowns, one for Traditional Modern style and one for what looks like our FLOP(S) version.
In the traditional Modern style, the brides family pays for the bulk of everything. Are we to assume that the average "Modern Bride" is not capable of getting married?
| Quote: | Tradition, Modern Style
Bride
• Gifts for bridesmaids
• Lodging for bridesmaids
• Couple's personal stationery and thank-you notes
• Wedding programs/guestbook
Groom
• Bride's engagement ring
• Marriage license
• Officiant's fee
• Rental or purchase of his formalwear
• Lodging for groomsmen
• Gifts for the groom's attendants
• Boutonnieres for self and groomsmen, as well as flowers for both mothers and grandmothers (it's much more common today for flowers to be paid in one lump sum, usually by the bride's family)
• Bride's bouquet (see above)
Bride and Groom
• The wedding bands
• The honeymoon (in very traditional families, this is still considered the groom's expense)
Bride's Family
• Engagement and wedding pictures
• Wedding invitations
• Wedding consultant, if applicable
• Bridal ensemble
• Ceremony fees: rental of synagogue or chapel, chuppah, aisle carpets, or other decorating items
• Flowers: reception, ceremony, bridesmaids' bouquets and fathers' boutonnieres (see Groom for more on wedding flowers)
• Reception: site fees, caterer, food, bar, gratuities, decorations
• Music: ceremony, cocktail hour, and reception
• Bridesmaids' luncheon (a traditional gesture of thanks)
• Transportation for bridal party to ceremony and reception
Groom's Family
• Rehearsal dinner (optional) or any other expense they elect
Bridesmaids
• Bridal shower
• Bridesmaid dress and shoes (flower girl/ringbearer attire is paid for by the child's parents)
• Any traveling expenses
• Bachelorette party (optional)
Ushers
• Rental of formalwear
• Bachelor party (optional)
Guests
Traveling and lodging expenses (even if you're having a destination wedding, guests pay their own way) |
| Quote: | Bucking the Trends
These are the most common ways that the old guidelines of who-pays-for-what are being adapted to reflect the multi-host wedding that is so popular today.
Groom's Family
• All beverage and liquor service
• Limousines
• Music for the reception
• Photography and/or videography
Bride and/or Groom
• Bride's ensemble
• Wedding flowers
• All wedding stationery, including invitations, announcements, and thank-you notes[ |
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