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Tuition is killing us
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amother









  
Post Posted: Wed, Jun 20 2012, 8:02 pm       Post subject: re: Tuition is killing us
In Cincinnati we get government vouchers of $4,250 per kid, so that about halves our tuition bill. And according to the state law, if a family is a certain percentage below the poverty line, the school cannot charge the difference between tuition and the voucher (and the school has to agree to this in order to participate in the voucher program).
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amother









  
Post Posted: Wed, Jun 20 2012, 8:44 pm       Post subject: Re: re: Tuition is killing us
amother wrote:
I just wish the frum world would not be so opposed to public schools, particularly in the earlier grades, when negative influences are fewer and Hebrew/Jewish stuff can be done in a fewer number of hours.


ahhh....if you would only know what goes on in the public schools, even in the earlier grades. I teach an early grade in public school and trust me, you don't want your frum kid there. The language coming out of their mouths, the things they discuss, you wouldn't believe it....
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cm









  
Post Posted: Wed, Jun 20 2012, 8:48 pm       Post subject: Re: re: Tuition is killing us
amother wrote:
amother wrote:
I just wish the frum world would not be so opposed to public schools, particularly in the earlier grades, when negative influences are fewer and Hebrew/Jewish stuff can be done in a fewer number of hours.


ahhh....if you would only know what goes on in the public schools, even in the earlier grades. I teach an early grade in public school and trust me, you don't want your frum kid there. The language coming out of their mouths, the things they discuss, you wouldn't believe it....


It really depends where you are, at least in the US - it has more to do with local culture than public/private education.
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observer









  
Post Posted: Wed, Jun 20 2012, 8:50 pm       Post subject: Re: Tuition is killing us
amother wrote:
Hi all I have a big problem and I need some help. My child is in a modern orthodox school in brooklyn going into pre 1 a
Kindergarden tution was $7,500 no they have icreased our tuition for next year to $9,750
My husband has been unemployed for neraly seven month he just started working again (bh) the yeshiva does not know that he found a new job, that means that the tution was increae by nearly $2500 while knowing that he was not working.
I have a few questions
1) is such a high increase year overyear normal?

In most schools, the kindergarten tuition is less than pre-1-a and other grades. I would guess that the big jump in tuition was due to going from kindergarten to pre-1-a and not due so much to the yearly increase. I'm surprised nobody has mentioned that yet.

That being said, yes, tuition is a huge huge problem.... I just don't have the solution...
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amother









  
Post Posted: Wed, Jun 20 2012, 8:56 pm       Post subject: Re: re: Tuition is killing us
amother wrote:
amother wrote:
I just wish the frum world would not be so opposed to public schools, particularly in the earlier grades, when negative influences are fewer and Hebrew/Jewish stuff can be done in a fewer number of hours.


ahhh....if you would only know what goes on in the public schools, even in the earlier grades. I teach an early grade in public school and trust me, you don't want your frum kid there. The language coming out of their mouths, the things they discuss, you wouldn't believe it....



I used to sub in early grades in public school. By third grade, they talk about gay people and lap dances, never mind the foul language. I was shocked myelf.

What really bothered me was the way the black students would refer to white students as "milk". There is a lot of racial tension that I would not want my kid exposed to.
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MaBelleVie









  
Post Posted: Wed, Jun 20 2012, 8:58 pm       Post subject: Re: re: Tuition is killing us
Barbara wrote:

But as a reality check, Horace Mann's kindergarten tuition is $39,100. At Spence, its $37,500. I don't know of any day schools at that level. Yet.


Holy cow. I know someone whose kids are in HM- 3 of them. Wow.
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amother









  
Post Posted: Wed, Jun 20 2012, 9:24 pm       Post subject: Re: re: Tuition is killing us
amother wrote:
amother wrote:
amother wrote:
I just wish the frum world would not be so opposed to public schools, particularly in the earlier grades, when negative influences are fewer and Hebrew/Jewish stuff can be done in a fewer number of hours.


ahhh....if you would only know what goes on in the public schools, even in the earlier grades. I teach an early grade in public school and trust me, you don't want your frum kid there. The language coming out of their mouths, the things they discuss, you wouldn't believe it....



I used to sub in early grades in public school. By third grade, they talk about gay people and lap dances, never mind the foul language. I was shocked myelf.

What really bothered me was the way the black students would refer to white students as "milk". There is a lot of racial tension that I would not want my kid exposed to.


I went to public school for high school, and the girls from the private schools were worse off than most of the girls in my school. Hardly anyone in my school touched drugs, while the frum kids were doing heavy drugs and getting drunk every friday night. Not all situations are alike. Even now, I'll be sending my child to public school this school year. For the cost of the private school, it's just not worth it for us.
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imeinu









  
Post Posted: Thu, Jun 21 2012, 12:46 am       Post subject: Re: Tuition is killing us
observer wrote:
amother wrote:
Hi all I have a big problem and I need some help. My child is in a modern orthodox school in brooklyn going into pre 1 a
Kindergarden tution was $7,500 no they have icreased our tuition for next year to $9,750
My husband has been unemployed for neraly seven month he just started working again (bh) the yeshiva does not know that he found a new job, that means that the tution was increae by nearly $2500 while knowing that he was not working.
I have a few questions
1) is such a high increase year overyear normal?

In most schools, the kindergarten tuition is less than pre-1-a and other grades. I would guess that the big jump in tuition was due to going from kindergarten to pre-1-a and not due so much to the yearly increase. I'm surprised nobody has mentioned that yet.

That being said, yes, tuition is a huge huge problem.... I just don't have the solution...

yes, thats what I was thinking. I think it's cause the kindergartens usually get UPK $$ so tuition is cheaper.
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amother









  
Post Posted: Thu, Jun 21 2012, 12:51 am       Post subject: re: Tuition is killing us
HM and Spence tuition? They have nothing over RAMAZ.
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amother









  
Post Posted: Thu, Jun 21 2012, 9:15 am       Post subject: re: Tuition is killing us
in regarding to the mother who says she can barely feed her family after tuition.
Does nobody see how crazy it is when our school tuition is more important themn paying bills ?????
Our next generation will be knee deep in debt.
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Barbara









  
Post Posted: Thu, Jun 21 2012, 9:23 am       Post subject: Re: re: Tuition is killing us
amother wrote:
HM and Spence tuition? They have nothing over RAMAZ.


AFAIK, Ramaz is at about $23,000 for elementary school. They have a lot of aid for people who can't afford it since, bluntly, most Ramaz families can.
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Ruchel









  
Post Posted: Thu, Jun 21 2012, 9:33 am       Post subject: Re: re: Tuition is killing us
amother wrote:
amother wrote:
I just wish the frum world would not be so opposed to public schools, particularly in the earlier grades, when negative influences are fewer and Hebrew/Jewish stuff can be done in a fewer number of hours.


ahhh....if you would only know what goes on in the public schools, even in the earlier grades. I teach an early grade in public school and trust me, you don't want your frum kid there. The language coming out of their mouths, the things they discuss, you wouldn't believe it....


I would say the same about some Orthodox schools Sad
While some public schools have mostly good kids.
(I still am 100% pro Jewish school, but not at the cost of sanity)
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amother









  
Post Posted: Thu, Jun 21 2012, 9:33 am       Post subject: Re: re: Tuition is killing us
amother wrote:
HM and Spence tuition? They have nothing over RAMAZ.


Not true. I teach at Ramaz, the HS is 32, elementary is less. Not cheap, but nothing like the elite NYC private schools. Barbara- you'd be surprised how many Ramaz kids are on scholarship, especially in the Upper School, where not everyone is from the UES. The reason they have so much available for aid is because they have a nice endowment, not because so many families are paying full tuition.
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amother









  
Post Posted: Thu, Jun 21 2012, 9:34 am       Post subject: re: Tuition is killing us
Homeschool.

If all parents were to protest and remove their children, schools would be forced to start over, and be more reasonable. Or parents can get together and form coop schools or think of other ideas.
There is no reason why administrators should be lining their pockets with millions while teachers don't get paid enough and parents cannot afford to have many children because of outrageous tuition costs.
Also most schools are shortchanging our children anyway, and most kids hate school, even the best school.
The system needs massive change.
2012!
It's about time!
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amother









  
Post Posted: Thu, Jun 21 2012, 9:35 am       Post subject: re: Tuition is killing us
I dont believe being able to "afford" tution is what matters.
Most families can scratch together the money, that doesnt mean we could afford it.
My school tution should not be 45% of my total annual ernings, tution is going up much faster then my pay is.
Why should we never be able to own a home or take a vacation because if we do the school will want more tution.
My school actually clearly asks prents were we went to for yom tov, when we took our last vacation, how much it costed etc.
Seriously, if I took a vacation for a few days that means I cant get a break on tution? so now we are not allowed to take break from life withought worrying what the school will think of us? will they increase our tution? will they approve a scholarship?
This system has to change and fast, because I doubt I am the only one fed up pwith this attitude, that we have to give so much for yeshivas and school,
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amother









  
Post Posted: Thu, Jun 21 2012, 9:38 am       Post subject: Re: re: Tuition is killing us
amother wrote:
Homeschool.

If all parents were to protest and remove their children, schools would be forced to start over, and be more reasonable. Or parents can get together and form coop schools or think of other ideas.
There is no reason why administrators should be lining their pockets with millions while teachers don't get paid enough and parents cannot afford to have many children because of outrageous tuition costs.
Also most schools are shortchanging our children anyway, and most kids hate school, even the best school.
The system needs massive change.
2012!
It's about time!


I agree great idea!!
Lets get our children together a few parents and hire teachers for their jeiwsh studies.
Secular studies can either be done at home in groups or we can all push the kids into public school.
Paying this much at sucha young age is not the answer
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JAWSCIENCE









  
Post Posted: Thu, Jun 21 2012, 11:09 am       Post subject: Re: re: Tuition is killing us
amother wrote:
amother wrote:
HM and Spence tuition? They have nothing over RAMAZ.


Not true. I teach at Ramaz, the HS is 32, elementary is less. Not cheap, but nothing like the elite NYC private schools. Barbara- you'd be surprised how many Ramaz kids are on scholarship, especially in the Upper School, where not everyone is from the UES. The reason they have so much available for aid is because they have a nice endowment, not because so many families are paying full tuition.


Interesting. I live on the upper east side and never thought about sending to Ramaz because for the first few years while I am still in grad school/residency the tuition would be way beyond my reach while in the high school years I might actually be able to afford it if I choose a lucrative specialty and join the right practice. Maybe it should be put back on the list of options. Although paying the tuition in high school would mean I would not be able to afford many/all of the luxuries that the rest of my child's classmates could afford. I'd be just squeaking by and would still have to limit my family size to 2 or maybe 3 kids.
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amother









  
Post Posted: Thu, Jun 21 2012, 11:17 am       Post subject: Re: re: Tuition is killing us
JAWSCIENCE wrote:
amother wrote:
amother wrote:
HM and Spence tuition? They have nothing over RAMAZ.


Not true. I teach at Ramaz, the HS is 32, elementary is less. Not cheap, but nothing like the elite NYC private schools. Barbara- you'd be surprised how many Ramaz kids are on scholarship, especially in the Upper School, where not everyone is from the UES. The reason they have so much available for aid is because they have a nice endowment, not because so many families are paying full tuition.


Interesting. I live on the upper east side and never thought about sending to Ramaz because for the first few years while I am still in grad school/residency the tuition would be way beyond my reach while in the high school years I might actually be able to afford it if I choose a lucrative specialty and join the right practice. Maybe it should be put back on the list of options. Although paying the tuition in high school would mean I would not be able to afford many/all of the luxuries that the rest of my child's classmates could afford. I'd be just squeaking by and would still have to limit my family size to 2 or maybe 3 kids.


Definitely consider it. The people in charge are flexible and willing to help, especially young families that are going places (not only do I teach at Ramaz, I went there from nursery through 12th grade. My father was a resident when I started and was on scholarship for years, but was eventually able to pay full fare). Also, they do encourage more children. Your third child in the school gets a nice discount most of the time. There were a bunch of 4-kid families in my class, and almost none of them were paying full tuition for all 4. Are you looking at schools now? I can PM you the names of the people to talk to.
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black sheep









  
Post Posted: Thu, Jun 21 2012, 11:27 am       Post subject: Re: re: Tuition is killing us
amother wrote:
I dont believe being able to "afford" tution is what matters.
Most families can scratch together the money, that doesnt mean we could afford it.
My school tution should not be 45% of my total annual ernings, tution is going up much faster then my pay is.
Why should we never be able to own a home or take a vacation because if we do the school will want more tution.
My school actually clearly asks prents were we went to for yom tov, when we took our last vacation, how much it costed etc.
Seriously, if I took a vacation for a few days that means I cant get a break on tution? so now we are not allowed to take break from life withought worrying what the school will think of us? will they increase our tution? will they approve a scholarship?
This system has to change and fast, because I doubt I am the only one fed up pwith this attitude, that we have to give so much for yeshivas and school,


you have a good point. I also think it is way beyond reasonable that most families with two working parents have no hope of ever buying a house because all their "extra" earnings is going towards tuition. and it does seem greedy on the schools part to look at everything you do and think "hey, they should have given that money to me!"

but one thing I disagree with you is that "most parents can scrape together the money." this isn't true. many parents cannot. I am in the same boat as you where tuition is every extra last penny, but I have friends who cannot even "scrape together" what it takes to pay the tuition. so they either pay it, and build up debt on their credit cards for such frivolities as groceries and clothing, or they put off paying and are constantly harassed by the school and have to go around asking their friends for "loans" (which they can never pay back.)
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JAWSCIENCE









  
Post Posted: Thu, Jun 21 2012, 11:35 am       Post subject: Re: re: Tuition is killing us
amother wrote:
JAWSCIENCE wrote:
amother wrote:
amother wrote:
HM and Spence tuition? They have nothing over RAMAZ.


Not true. I teach at Ramaz, the HS is 32, elementary is less. Not cheap, but nothing like the elite NYC private schools. Barbara- you'd be surprised how many Ramaz kids are on scholarship, especially in the Upper School, where not everyone is from the UES. The reason they have so much available for aid is because they have a nice endowment, not because so many families are paying full tuition.


Interesting. I live on the upper east side and never thought about sending to Ramaz because for the first few years while I am still in grad school/residency the tuition would be way beyond my reach while in the high school years I might actually be able to afford it if I choose a lucrative specialty and join the right practice. Maybe it should be put back on the list of options. Although paying the tuition in high school would mean I would not be able to afford many/all of the luxuries that the rest of my child's classmates could afford. I'd be just squeaking by and would still have to limit my family size to 2 or maybe 3 kids.


Definitely consider it. The people in charge are flexible and willing to help, especially young families that are going places (not only do I teach at Ramaz, I went there from nursery through 12th grade. My father was a resident when I started and was on scholarship for years, but was eventually able to pay full fare). Also, they do encourage more children. Your third child in the school gets a nice discount most of the time. There were a bunch of 4-kid families in my class, and almost none of them were paying full tuition for all 4. Are you looking at schools now? I can PM you the names of the people to talk to.


We've got a couple more years, but thanks for the information!
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