My neighbour's son asked my son to kill him

amother

Tue, Mar 13 2012, 5:13 pm

Please talk to the boy. Tell him you heard that he told your son xyz. Then ask him if he thinks about killing himself. If he answers yes, ask him if he has a plan.
Then, gently and kindly, put him in your car, and take him to a hospital. He needs to be admitted until he is no longer a risk to himself or others.

ora_43

Tue, Mar 13 2012, 5:25 pm

amother wrote:

Even if this were a good approach, it's not possible. OP isn't his parent or legal guardian, she can't hospitalize him.

NewYorkgal31

Tue, Mar 13 2012, 5:31 pm

I Didn't read all the comments but as a soon to be professional (social worker) working in this field YES you should call the social worker and tell her what he said and you should do it ASAP. Who knows what this mother will do or for that matter what this boy will do to himself. For an 8 year old to say that he wants to kill himself is very extreme and should not be taken lightly especially considering his situation at home.

I hope you won't take to much time contacting the social worker or the authorities to help this boy and his mother.

Good Luck!!!!

Yulka

Tue, Mar 13 2012, 5:55 pm

I would talk to the mother. You said that it looks like she's trying. I'm sure she loves her child and would not want him to get hurt. If you could tell her what your son told you, she would more likely to take it seriously than if it came from her son.
She deserves to know to what extent her son is troubled, before you call anybody else.
I don't know how it is in Israel, but in here in America, I had some experience with social services, and I didn't feel as they had the child's or the parents' interests in mind. Only their policies, and money.

amother

Tue, Mar 13 2012, 6:07 pm

Quote:

It sounds like it's not just the family that needs help, but also the school. Do you think that his teachers/rebbes would take the bullying any more seriously if they were aware how badly it's affecting him?

OP here.

Thank you for pointing this out - about the school. I will try and talk to the Minahel about it. He is being tortured there! And I don't understand the cheder's reaction. They keep blaming the boy.

amother

Tue, Mar 13 2012, 8:52 pm

amother wrote:

Quote:

They always blame the victim.

I was bitten by my mother several times as a kid and my teachers and neighbors knew about it. They pat themselves on the back that they "helped" me by reporting it but nothing was ever done.

I wouldn't be surprised if the same happens here. It's all about bureaucracy.

Stayci

Tue, Mar 13 2012, 10:04 pm

OP, Please speak to the principal in the school ASAP. Being abused at home, and being bullied in school is a disastrous situation. Individually, both scenarios bring about suicidal thoughts/actions. I cannot fathom the pain of an 8 year old that has nowhere to turn to.

marina

Tue, Mar 13 2012, 10:14 pm

I don't understand how a parent bites a child.

I also don't understand how anyone is suggesting speaking to a rav. What's a rav going to do?

Yes, keeping families together is a priority but not families where adults bite children.

Kids have killed themselves over much less than what this boy is going through. Just the bullying alone does it sometimes.

m in Israel

Wed, Mar 14 2012, 6:16 am

The suggestion to speak to a Rav is not that the Rav should get involved but rather the Rav can guide you as to who is the appropriate person to report this to, both Halachicly and practically. As many people have posted, depending on the location CPS or the Israeli equivalent may or may not be effective in helping this family. Often private agencies can be more on top of the situation, as well as more sensitive to the child's specific cultural/ religious needs (I.e. frum foster care, etc.) A Rav who is familiar with the community and with the Halachos of LH Ltoeles is generally a good place to start.

Personally I don't think that another neighbor in the building has the right to decide that "it's actually best for the kids to be raised by their own parents". This is a decision that should be made by experienced professionals who have been given all the objective information. PLEASE speak to someone in that category -- the social worker or a community agency, or CPS.

ally

Wed, Mar 14 2012, 7:27 am

m in Israel wrote:

This contradicts your first paragraph. The problem with running to Rabbanim with questions about reporting abuse is that it has been proven time and time again that many Rabbanim are not qualified to answer these questions, deal with these problems and have given answers that were harmful but which the asker then feels obligated to hold by.

amother

Wed, Mar 14 2012, 12:49 pm

This is the OP.

Thank you EVERYONE for your responses!!!

I spoke to the child today. He told me that the situation in his home is a lot better. His mom doesn't shout so much, or hit, and that there's more food.

He said that the situation in cheder is really hard. But, we bought him a ball, and my sons told the kids that ONLY if they don't hurt our neighbour, can they play with him. He told me that they seemed to have stopped the bullying.

I asked him how often he feels that he doesn't want to live. He said, "not so often - about once a week, or once every two weeks". (!!!!!)

My son also told me that he does go to a lady once a week, to discuss the situation in the cheder. I told him that he should tell this lady what he feels. He said he feels embarressed. I told him that he should tell her anyway, because maybe she could help him feel better. So he said that he would.

I also saw that a frum lady came to their house this morning. So, it seems that they are getting help.

amother

Black

Fri, Mar 25 2016, 5:03 pm

Lashon Hara L'toeles is for a constructive purpose. In the case of a situation such as this, Pikuach nefesh overrides any and all of hilchos shmiras halashon and any competent rav would tell you that you can inform on someone who is deliberately putting their kids in danger and has social services.

If you really feel the need to ask a shailah, you need to make sure to give the rav as much clear details as possible.

oliveoil

Fri, Mar 25 2016, 5:07 pm

amother wrote:

this thread is from 4 years ago