"Mommy did you know that women have kids..."

Raisin

Thu, Oct 18 2007, 2:52 pm

Tamiri wrote:

There are plenty of frum ladies out there who have not found a bashert but with the biological clock ticking, decided to have a baby/ies on their own.
This practice is actually not discouraged by certain rabbis, if certain guidelines are met (yes, hard to believe).
In any event, I do tell my children that although they may see things which might seem odd, people do make choices in life which don't always reflect what we think is right.

People who make that decision usually do not have children already. I doubt that Mitzvamom would want to go that route, just to fulfill a whim of her daughters! She already has 3 beautiful children. She already IS a single mother.

iy'h you should find your bashert very soon, MM. Flower

Clarissa

Thu, Oct 18 2007, 2:54 pm

Crayon210 wrote:

I think that yes, the unselfish thing to do would be to forgo the opportunity to bring a child into this world who will necessarily not have one parent.

Well, then I guess we disagree. Strongly.

On the other hand, we are in agreement over on the libido thread, so I guess that's something! Smile

Ruchel

Thu, Oct 18 2007, 3:00 pm

Clarissa wrote:

Crayon210 wrote:

I think that yes, the unselfish thing to do would be to forgo the opportunity to bring a child into this world who will necessarily not have one parent.

Well, then I guess we disagree. Strongly.

On the other hand, we are in agreement over on the libido thread, so I guess that's something! Smile

LOOOOL

I think there is only one way to know: ask a child born that way if he prefers living like that, despite of course missing a dad/mom, or not being born.

greenfire

Thu, Oct 18 2007, 3:06 pm

Clarissa wrote:

So a person, whether single, widowed or divorced, who has not met the right person and is of the age when it's "now or never," should forgo parenthood altogether? That's the unselfish thing to do?

I'm always surprised when people who were blessed with husbands and children say this. So easy when one hasn't walked a mile in other people's shoes. Having been in a very difficult situation where I faced that possibility, I can tell you that it is not so simple.

I'm in agreement with Clarissa ... and would have certainly gone that route if I needed to !!!

amother

Thu, Oct 18 2007, 3:41 pm

Crayon210 wrote:

I think that yes, the unselfish thing to do would be to forgo the opportunity to bring a child into this world who will necessarily not have one parent.

How do you *know* that the child will not have a father? A woman who elects to have a child without marriage -- most likely because her biological clock is *ticking* - could later meet someone who would love and raise the child as his own.

And, of course, sadly, parents of young children do occasionally pass away. Is it selfish of the surviving parent to retain custody of these young children, who will *necessarily not have one parent*?

No one is suggesting that this is optimal. But a man who marries late can still have a family if he wants. Why should a woman who may have *wanted* to marry, but not been able to find someone, be deprived of that?

Crayon210

Thu, Oct 18 2007, 3:51 pm

amother wrote:

Crayon210 wrote:

I think that yes, the unselfish thing to do would be to forgo the opportunity to bring a child into this world who will necessarily not have one parent.

It's selfish to do that in anticipation of finding someone.

Quote:

And, of course, sadly, parents of young children do occasionally pass away. Is it selfish of the surviving parent to retain custody of these young children, who will *necessarily not have one parent*?

It goes without saying (though I guess it doesn't Confused

) that if someone CHV passes away, raising a child with only one parent is the only way-but it's sitll b'dieved. Not that the person should l'chatchila give the child away shock

, but that the whole situation is different since the parent didn't bring the child into the world assuming that there would only be one parent.

Quote:

No one is suggesting that this is optimal. But a man who marries late can still have a family if he wants. Why should a woman who may have *wanted* to marry, but not been able to find someone, be deprived of that?

This is silly. There are plenty of discrepancies between the options available to men and women.

Lechatchila Ariber

Thu, Oct 18 2007, 3:57 pm

Quote:

So a person, whether single, widowed or divorced, who has not met the right person and is of the age when it's "now or never," should forgo parenthood altogether?

yes, untill they find the right person.

Quote:

That's the unselfish thing to do?

yes

bashinda

Thu, Oct 18 2007, 8:55 pm

First of all this is nothing against divorced mothers but I grew up without a father for most of my life and yes we were lacking and I would say that although I cannot judge, there's nothing like having two parents who can balance each other out. It was very difficult and stressful for everyone involved. (I'm not an orphan but my father pretty much was not there)

Although I also know a person who's the first married woman I've known who for most practical day to day purposes is a single parent. That's not so good either. [/url]

grin

Fri, Oct 19 2007, 1:57 am

It's a fact that life in this world is never perfect - it may be a dysfunctional home, a missing parent, an illness, a ill sibling, or serious financial probelms - ch'v 100 times but that's the way it is. (The children came too fast, too slow, too many, none at all...)

We have to each of us learn to live as best as we can with whatever Hashem chose to dish out to us and try to focus on what's good.

Imaonwheels

Mon, Oct 22 2007, 2:43 am

My guess is that most women who suggest deliberate single parenting have never been the child of a single parent. Never been a boy with no one to sit with him in shul (or is your whim going to obligate the gf, a neighbor or local guy as well?) or a girl who has no mother to share her bas mitzva, only one parent to take her to the chuppa. Of course if, c"v, something happens to that parent the child would have a father somewhere but be truly alone.

My niece has no idea who her father was, she died telling noone. One day when she was 8 she said to me that if her gps (whom she lives with) didn't want them any more her brother would go to his father and "Where would I go, to the garbage can?"

That wondering who is my father is going to hit your kid even if you don't care.

Imaonwheels

Mon, Oct 22 2007, 2:45 am

When my daughter was 5 she asked why everyone was having babies and we aren't. I told her that HaShem was real smart.He knows that its better to have both an Abba and an Ima so He only sends babies to houses where there are both. She totally understood.

How old is your dd? I would speak to the mother of the other girl.