Names on wedding invitations

essie14

Wed, Jun 02 2021, 1:15 am

amother [ Salmon ] wrote:

Yes I would think that's funny and also that the families don't align hashkafically.

I know hundreds of happily married couples whose parents are drastically different from each other. Even non jewish parents whose convert child is married to ultra orthodox.
That's a very narrow minded comment.

salt

Wed, Jun 02 2021, 1:30 am

amother [ Salmon ] wrote:

Yes I would think that's funny and also that the families don't align hashkafically.

It's gonna be hard to find 2 families that align hashkafically with EVERYTHING! Marriage involves compromise and it's starts with things like wedding invitations.

What if one side wants a purple font and one wants blue? Come to an agreement and zehu.
People look at the invitation, write down the date and throw it in the garbage.

Bnei Berak 10

Wed, Jun 02 2021, 4:21 am

amother [ Mustard ] wrote:

I am not a feminist at all. I know this isn't what you're asking but I find it so hurtful not to have the woman's name on the invitation. And more than that I have gotten quite a few invitations where I have no idea who it is for! I'm not kidding. I live in Israel and I don't always know the husband's first name. And it's very hard to figure it out I have to go through a lot of work to figure out which Cohen It is. Sometimes it's just for my husband someone that he knows and it's quite frustrating. I do not understand why it is not modest to put on the husband's name at all. And when I see this for a dinner or something I say I will never donate to a cause that won't put a woman's name in print.

Maybe the woman doesn't want her 1st name to be on the invitation?
Even etiquette rules for non- jews used to be Mr and Mrs Chaim Cohen if I remember correctly.

amother

Apricot

Wed, Jun 02 2021, 4:39 am

amother [ OP ] wrote:

OP here.

For everyone who says to put wife's name also why not on the English side also?
I have never seen it say on the english side Moshe and Leah Katz, always Mr and Mrs Katz unless it is very MO.
So why on the hebrew side?

No one I know skips the wife's name anymore. But yes, I lean more to MO than yeshivish.
It's very old fashioned to say Mr. and Mrs. Yossi Cohen. Personally I have never received such an invite, thankfully. I am not my husband's appendage. (I actually didn't change my last name either, but that's another story).

amother

Apricot

Wed, Jun 02 2021, 4:43 am

salt wrote:

That's how I remember the British Telecom telephone directory being set out.
Mr and Mrs D Smith
etc..

It must have been many years ago though.
I don't know many women today who would be happy with that, unless they get a kick out of retro-traditional for its own sake.

Plus many, many women don't even legally change their last name upon marriage these days.

amother

Apricot

Wed, Jun 02 2021, 4:47 am

amother [ Burlywood ] wrote:

My parents wanted wives names. My in laws did not.
In the end my parents did not include my mothers name.
Exclusion seemed easier then inclusion - going stricter.
For ppl my mother wasn’t sure they’d know who invitation was from she wrote a short note and signed her name.

It's lucky that you guys figured it out.
Personally, in this situation I would be very upset if someone asked me to remove my name from my child's wedding invite.
Going stricter is not always easier, because it can impact ben adam lechavero.

miami85

Wed, Jun 02 2021, 4:54 am

I was just talking to someone about this and it bothers me that the wife's name doesn't appear anywhere on the invitation in some circles, I mean maybe it's fine if your name is "Grodzinsky" or "Kalmanowitz" but what if it's "Fried" or "Katz" or "Deutsch" or "Cohen"--Rabbi and Mrs. Cohen--well that's nice, mazal tov--or let's say I know one side and I wonder if I know the other side, would be nice to know if it was Sarah Cohen or Raizy Cohen. I'd like to know the wife's name if it's a common last name because you get to a point in life where you don't always remember all of your friends' married names.

amother

Burlywood

Wed, Jun 02 2021, 7:25 am

amother [ Apricot ] wrote:

My parents thought that being mevater is the ultimate bein adam l’chavero.

amother

Apricot

Wed, Jun 02 2021, 7:59 am

amother [ Burlywood ] wrote:

My parents thought that being mevater is the ultimate bein adam l’chavero.

Of course. But if they had done it with a heavy heart and resentment, then the inlaws' machmir stance would have caused them (the inlaws) to be meikel on adam le'chavero.

Being machmir on one thing often automatically makes you makel on another.

amother

Burlywood

Wed, Jun 02 2021, 8:19 am

amother [ Apricot ] wrote:

Of course not.
Unless you marry someone exactly like you there will be compromises. You have to know how to be flexible.
In our case there were a few and they went both ways. (Wedding Location, Sheitel, chuppah, seating, expenses, kibbudim)

amother

Teal

Wed, Jun 02 2021, 8:24 am

We were just dealing with that.
My husband said we should just honor what the other side wants and not make a big deal. We never did it this way before but my husband is very into keeping things peaceful.
There’s technically nothing really wrong with it and probably most people don’t pay much attention.

watergirl

Wed, Jun 02 2021, 8:54 am

Chayalle wrote:

Can you just imagine if the parsha was called "Chayei Eishes Avraham", if the megillos were called "Megillas Boaz" and "Megillas Mordechai", etc? I am scratching my head trying to understand at what point a women's name became not tzanuah. This is really a slippery slope and it scares me.

amother

Crimson

Wed, Jun 02 2021, 9:10 am

amother [ Seashell ] wrote:

I respect your tznius concern and guidance you've received. At the same time, I think it would look odd to have the 2 sets of parents' names written differently. Not sure how to reconcile. If it was me, I would probably mention what your Rav told you and what you've done in the past and see if the other side is amenable. If not, in the interest of shalom, I would just write our names the same as them.

Respectfully, there is no tznius concern about a name. Even the Torah referred to our Avos' wives with their names. They weren't called aishes Avraham or Aishes Yitzchak, they were referred to as Sarah & Rivka.

amother

Crimson

Wed, Jun 02 2021, 9:11 am

amother [ OP ] wrote:

My son b'h is engaged.
We are doing invitations and dont know what to do about parents names in hebrew.
We never put my name as per my rav. We put (sorry dont know how to get hebrew text) Moshe Katz and wife in hebrew.
The girls side puts the wifes name.
I know it is a minor detail but I like the way we do it. Unfortunately my rav is no longer alive so I cant ask him.
Would it look funny if we each have different on the invitation?
Anyone else have this problem?

It's nothing but a personal like or a community construct. Just ask them if they mind doing it your way, if not, this is a very small thing to make an issue of.

amother

Crimson

Wed, Jun 02 2021, 9:16 am

amother [ Forestgreen ] wrote:

wadr to your rav z"l....if your name isn't on the invite, and I assume it's also not going to be on the return address on the envelope...what happens if you invite a friend of yours who knows you mainly as "Shoshana" and doesn't have any idea who Rabbi Moshe Segal is?

FTR that's why I like having the grandparents' names included. When I see that the bride's grandparents are Millie and Chezki Minchkin, or even Mr. and Mrs. Chezki Minchkin, I know that she's my cousin's granddaughter. I have no idea who Rabbi and Mrs. Yoseph Grunwald are, Rebbetzin Grunwald being one of my cousin's eleventeen children and I barely knew her given name, let alone her married name.

What happens if there are no living grandparents or if her surname was Klein or Schwartz. Do I have to start going through my life history to figure out which klein or schwartz this can possibly be?

For those who do choose to not to post the wife's name, they should all just use the word 'mishpachas'. Mishpachas Klein, mishpachas Schwartz, etc. - and leave the husbands name out too. Let the men get a taste of their own medicine to understand this problem.

amother

Burlywood

Wed, Jun 02 2021, 9:32 am

Chayalle wrote:

I have received invitations in the past where it took me time to figure out who it's from. I don't always remember old acquaintences' married names. It's so helpful if they put the mother's name. I don't see why it is a lack of tznius - even the Torah has girls' names. When my kids get married, my name is going on there somewhere.

Cute story - my DH learns in BMG. Sometimes yeshiva boys will approach a married person with questions. There was this sweet guy who sat behind DH, who would come and discuss the sugyah a bit here and there..... One day he told DH he became a Chassan. Then he gave DH an invitation to the wedding, and we realized that a) he married a really nice girl who was in high school with my girls and b) I went to school with his mother (and she's a great girl too!) I realized it cuz her name was on the Hebrew side, and her parents name as the grandparents. Nice feeling when you realize you know someone.

When my parents were looking into not including my mothers name and they did research and found out reb Yaakov kamenetsky advised to do it that way. So it isn’t some new fangled tzinius idea.
(When my in laws got married he personally told them not to include mothers names that is why it was important to them).

[I find it funny I’m defending an idea that dh and I don’t even do...]

To those saying how should ppl know you by dh’s name - my mother felt this a lot bec she is a professional and was inviting many who have no clue who my father is or elderly family whom without her name wouldn’t figure out the connection. In the end she wrote many ppl personal notes and signed her name. It was more work - but it was so appreciated she thought she may do in future even if her name is on the invitation

Chayalle

Wed, Jun 02 2021, 9:39 am

amother [ Burlywood ] wrote:

Interesting. My family was close to R' Yaakov. I'm going to ask my father about this, and if he heard this. Thank you for the update.

I definitely know that R' Yaakov often deferred to what the other side wanted in Shidduchim.

I happen to have a not-so-common maiden name (no Klein or Schwartz) but even so, someone who sees my father's name on the invitation might not know it's me. I'm one of seven sisters B"AH. Not everyone remembers everyone's married name.

Bnei Berak 10

Wed, Jun 02 2021, 9:53 am

amother [ Crimson ] wrote:

No need to go through Klein or Schwartz mispochologia.
Grand mothers who are widowed: you add under her family name
)לבית פלוני)
So you know her maiden name was Ploni before marriage.
Sometimes I have seen in addition:
רעייתו של הרב משה כהן ז"ל
Wife of Rabbi moshe cohen ז"ל