Were You Not a Smiley Child?

amother

Magnolia

Thu, Mar 09 2023, 11:37 pm

amother Steel wrote:

I don’t think I’ve ever met anyone who bothered to go through the process of joining. What’s the purpose? It seems like one of those things where the sole purpose is to be able to say that you are in it.

Listen, I'm not Feverfew. But your question sounds a little like you're trying to take her down a peg, and I'm just wondering why you would feel the need to do that.

amother

Leaf

Fri, Mar 10 2023, 5:06 am

First of all, separate out what are acceptable behaviors when running into soemone, and what aren't.

Teach that staring isn't polite (neither is pointing or whispering about someone when they can see you, don't just talk about her staring behavior). But don't worry, my dd age 10 who is plenty smiley also stares (and so do many other kids in her school, so it doesn't seem abnormal at this age). They will grow out of it. Tell her it is ok to look, but if it is more than a few seconds it is considered impolite and so she should look at something else instead if she catches herself staring. But keep this separate from anything you want her to do (like smiling). I also specifically use the phrase ''not polite", instead of "rude" to keep dd from feeling bad or self conscious. More like, here are rules of society and we can practice. You can even make a signal with her if she wants so you can alert her when her staring is too long, but if she doesn't want that then don't push it.

Then present polite ways to greet people as a separate matter. If she isn't smiley, that's totally fine (I wasn't either. I learned to do it socially, it still feels fake. I am normal and successful in life anyway). Explain different things to do - smile, wave (if she knows them), give a head nod, say a quick hi (no need for conversation if she doesn't want). This way, she will feel like she has options which is less pressuring than feeling forced to smile. You should also ask her first for ideas about what she thinks is a good way to greet or acknowledge people she knows in public - she may have good ideas you hadn't thought of, but either way if she comes up with the ideas first, then she may be more inclined to use them. Again, I use the term polite to explain what the rules of society are, but leave flexibility for how she wants to approach them.

But really, I am still not so smiley, but I do it as needed, and I am just fine in life, so don't pressure her, just brainstorm together and keep teaching of social norms light.

amother

Hyacinth

Fri, Mar 10 2023, 5:21 am

I didn't read what everyone wrote but a few thoughts:

Why is it important to smile at people? Why is that a skill that you feel she must learn?

Try getting to the root of why she's not smiling. I wasn't a smiley child and it hid a deep depression that has plagued me my entire life. No one bothered to see when I was a kid what was bothering me and why I wasn't smiling.

Chayalle

Fri, Mar 10 2023, 9:07 am

BrisketBoss wrote:

It is our job to teach our children, but teaching doesn't always look the way people think it should. A lot of it is just modeling and exposure. Telling children the same thing again and again is not really educational. If they were ever going to get it, then they will when they're ready--even if you didn't try so hard. And it may happen sooner if you don't. Remember, they are individuals, eager to assert themselves and not be controlled by someone else's preferences.

Trying to get somebody to be a certain way, is not teaching.

This exactly. OP, feel free to go around smiling at everyone and being friendly. Model the social behavior you want her to learn, and remember she's still a kid.

Trademark

Fri, Mar 10 2023, 10:12 am

amother Tuberose wrote:

please don't make her be smiley!! It'll only teach her that her real emotions don't matter, just that she presents a nice image! Much, much more important for her to know she can be authentic, then to have that fake smile.

It doesn't teach that only a nice image is important. There is a time and place for everything.

When meeting others it's mentchlich to have a pleasant and smiling face. Hevei mekabel es kol ha’adam b’seiver panim yafos.

(not saying how to go about with a 10 year old)

amother

Mustard

Fri, Mar 10 2023, 10:16 am

amother Buttercup wrote:

I don’t smile at random People and I’m 45! I think smiley people are either dumb or disingenuous. Let her be who she is!

As a naturally smiley person, this is so mean. No, I'm not dumb, nor am I disingenuous. I feel the sunshine in the morning and I love being around people and I can't help but smile. It's just natural to me.

amother

Begonia

Fri, Mar 10 2023, 1:59 pm

OP, I was painfully shy and very self conscious. I remember my mother lecturing me about being friendlier to people. For years I felt not only shy, but deep shame because of those lectures. I felt something was wrong with me because I wasn't naturally friendly and confident in social situations, and acting friendlier felt impossibly difficult. Like trying to be someone else, which, at that age, I would have gladly done if I could.

As an adult I have worked on self-acceptance.

I now have a dd like this. Sometimes I almost feel bad when she doesn't reciprocate friendliness to her friends, but I see that they accept her, that they know this is just the way she is. And that should be your main focus. By all means, talk to her about not staring, but try to empathize with how against her nature it feels for her to act friendly, and communicate that she's fine regardless.

amother

Royalblue

Fri, Mar 10 2023, 4:03 pm

Another perspective:
I was not a smiley child. Introverted and extremely serious. No sense of humor. I am still like that.
However, my experience of going from a small school to a big one and feeling so lost and lonely and then gratefully appreciating the warm smiles and friendliness of older students - from then on I made it a point to be like them. Now , despite my serious nature I am smiley and friendly. It takes conscious effort. But I remember the feelings of being ignored. I remember the pain in many moves later as an older single.
So I am great at smiles and 5 min of chit chat. ( I cant do more -as an introvert) my self perception is not as a smiley person. But apparently I am and it’s appreciated.
My point is that my change came from a very internal place. It would not have been achieved by being told to - smile… be friendly etc.

On the other hand - I am shocked at the lack of education in some parts of the frum world of basic mentchlichkeit and polite friendliness and welcomingness. So I also see room for education.
I was so saddened when an acquaintance told me her neighborhood aren’t welcoming to her children. Bc theyre “…x…”. With it supposed to be obvious that x people are not friendly and accepting. She herself identifies as x.
To me x is a level of frumkeit that should be practicing Veahavta lereivha kemocha. Not be know as the opposite.

So this is probably off topic and my apologies.
I dont believe in preaching…
But if theres room for education in a subtle way definitely use teachable moments.
This child probably appreciates being reached out to when not knowing anyone else. She can be that person too. And it doesnt take more than eye contact and a smile.

I guess This ramble is also directed at those comments about smiley people being shallow. I’m the opposite of the rah rah type. I honestly cant handle socializing- but I try to smile both when I do attend and when I’m in the street / stores.