Source for tzniut=mitzvah

phillymom

Fri, Dec 06 2013, 12:08 am

First Lady wrote:

To me Tznius is kinda like a Lo Essah than a Mitzah Essah.
Like you shouldn't cause a man to look at you. or Chukas Hagoy. Kol Isha, or other commandments that you shouldn't do in your manner of dress or action that will be attractive to men.
I do not have any sources and got a very twisted education on Tznius. Exploding anger

I'm sorry you had such a negative education on it Crying

But there are loads of shiurim and articles with which you can attempt to gain a newer and deeper understanding.
I've always looked at it as an essah and a lo essah.
Meaning, the essah is: I WANT people to look at me as a soul and not be distracted by my body. I HAVE self respect for myself as a tzelem elokim and that I am more than my body alone.
The lo essah is like you've mentioned: l'fnie iver, lo seten michshol-do not put a stumbling block before the blind.
A wonderful mashal I heard on that point is: my father has diabetes and cannot have chocolate cake anymore. But he LOVES chocolate cake, it's his absolute weakness. So when he comes for shabbos, I'll just make sure there's no chocolate cake around.
Now you can ask: what?! he's such a baby?! no self control?! he's a big boy...let him deal with his own limitations!
anyone with a half a brain (and a semi healthy relationship with their father Wink

) would be horrified at such a line of thinking. Of course my father can control himself...of course he's a big boy.
Rather, it is I that wants to help him. I want to make it easier for him. Why would I knowingly shove something in his face that makes it hard for him.
The nimshal is pretty self explanatory. If we really view ourselves and "kol yisrael arievim ze l'ze" that we are all responsible for each other.....well then we just want to help out our fellow men whom we know were created with an incredible desire that is aroused via visual stimulation.
That's all!

phillymom

Fri, Dec 06 2013, 12:27 am

The way I am learning it is: "V'haya machanacha kodosh." (not sure the exact source. I just started listening to the shiurim and haven't had a chance to source everything).
It refers to a man going to war and the commandant to take a spade/shovel with him to the battlefield, in addition to his sword/shield.
This is to cover up his feces if he uses the bathroom on the battle field.
Now the premise in the Torah is that when the Torah uses a specific example when bringing down a mitzvah; it's meant to be an out there situation to bring a kal v'chomer to everyday life.
So the idea that a man, who on the battle field really has only one concern; that of survival, has to be concerned about covering up his bowl movements, is about the concept of dignity and self respect.
The smag (sefer mitzvahs gedolos) brings down this passuk and THE source for the mitzvah and tznius.
Ok...that's as far as I got in the shiur. I'll try and report back as I learn through it.

pause

Fri, Dec 06 2013, 10:46 am

phillymom wrote:

This is the beginning of the passuk that many previous posters have already mentioned "V'haya machanecha kadosh, v'lo yayru'e becha ervas davar"