If you know hilchos yichud please help me out

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Forum -> Judaism -> Halachic Questions and Discussions

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amother

Wed, Feb 19 2014, 9:42 pm

I am working with a music teacher who is nonjewish. I will tell you the details of his studio and you can please tell me if this situation is ok.
1. The outside entrance from the building is locked you have to buzz in to open. The room of the studio is not locked but closed because of the high sound played from music.
2. His wife and five month old daughter are in the area and may sometimes stop by.
3.people are working in and out of the building, there are tenants,freelance workers and the super doing work in and out of the building.
4. the whole wall beside us is a glass window and people can see in.

vintagebknyc

Wed, Feb 19 2014, 10:15 pm

what's the problem?

MaBelleVie

Wed, Feb 19 2014, 10:19 pm

The rules are different when the man is a non Jew. Consult your rav.

amother

Wed, Feb 19 2014, 10:22 pm

vintagebknyc wrote:

what's the problem?

Thats what I want to know. If it is a problem.

vintagebknyc

Wed, Feb 19 2014, 10:38 pm

I don't see any problems for *me*, but you're obviously asking because you think there's something there. I'm very LWMO, btw, if that matters.

MaBelleVie

Wed, Feb 19 2014, 11:06 pm

vintagebknyc wrote:

I don't see any problems for *me*, but you're obviously asking because you think there's something there. I'm very LWMO, btw, if that matters.

Do you mean that you learned that the above scenario is not problematic according to hilchos yichud?

vintagebknyc

Wed, Feb 19 2014, 11:47 pm

I learned about about r. feinstien's rulings, yes, and that we don't hold that way.

but using those rulings, the closed room is on "clear view" with a wall of windows. the door is closed but not locked.

MaBelleVie

Wed, Feb 19 2014, 11:57 pm

I'm not sure where R Feinstein (ztl) comes in? But my point is that the usual leniencies do not always apply when the man is a non Jew. Therefore, the scenario should be presented to a halachic authority.

vintagebknyc

Thu, Feb 20 2014, 12:02 am

MaBelleVie wrote:

I learned r feinstein because I learned many things, and you asked me what I learned.

freidasima

Thu, Feb 20 2014, 12:03 am

What I learned was that once there was a clear view and anyone can see in at any times there is technically no yihud with anyone. And as for Yihud, I learned that there are no issues with non Jews just as there are no issues not covering one's hair in front of a non Jew as they are not considered "men" in the usual sense and therefore those halochos don't apply at all. I always found that strange, what? They aren't men? With the usual men's drives? But no, actually halochically there is a svoro coming from somewhere that I won't go into here, that non Jewish men are not to be treated halochiclaly as men and therefore there is no real issues of yihud with them at all. Isn't that strange? But that is the law, as it is held in many places and many cases...

MaBelleVie

Thu, Feb 20 2014, 12:15 am

vintagebknyc wrote:

I learned r feinstein because I learned many things, and you asked me what I learned.

Sorry if I wasn't clear, I was asking specifically regarding the case presented by op.

FS, the SA prohibits yichud with a non Jewish man. I'm not sure what later source you're referring to, but AFAIK, the majority opinion holds that's hilchos yichud apply (and with less leniencies than we allow with a Jewish man).

amother

Thu, Feb 20 2014, 12:27 am

freidasima wrote:

so are you allowed to have relations with them?

imeinu

Thu, Feb 20 2014, 12:38 am

My DH wrote on HY so I ran this by him.

This is his reply.

Basically the clear window, the fact that there are many people coming in and out, and the presence of a daughter, all combine to mean that there is probably enough room to allow the situation however the OP should definetly ask a Rav who is knowledgeable about HY.

And one of the maion reason's to ask is because in Halacha Yichud with a non-jew is much more severe for various reasons and a number of leniencies don't usually apply, one of them being that his wife is not considered a "Shomer".

Another reason to ask is because in a case of "consistent" yichud where a relationship is formed with the male (or female in the case of a man) Yichud also becomes more severe because of the principle of "Liboh Gas Bo".

Again asking a knowledgeable Rov is the best way to go and the Rov will respect you more for asking.

BTW the poster saying that yichud with a non-jew is allowed is probably confusing Yichud with other laws however regarding Yichud the Law is quite clear in Gemorah, Shulchan Aruch and all Poskim Yichud with a non-jew is more stringent then Yichud with a jew.

goodmorning

Thu, Feb 20 2014, 12:46 am

imeinu wrote:

The daughter is 5 months old. Her presence does not help in the slightest.

OP, is the glass wall an internal window or an external one? (Does it face the street or the inside of the building?) And these other people who go in and out of the building -- are they Jewish or non-Jewish?

Lady Bug

Thu, Feb 20 2014, 1:25 am

FS - I think that the situation you are referring to only applies to a girl over 3 but under 12 - yixhud is not allowed with a Jewish male over 13 however is allowed with a non Jewish male.

freidasima

Thu, Feb 20 2014, 1:45 am

1) of course one is not permitted to have relations with a non Jewish man. Why? Because of the results, not actually because of the act. Strange halochic reasoning isn't it. But that's the reasoning behind the law.
2) Yichud. Actually there is no yichud with a non Jewish man per se because he isn't a "man", however one should not be in yichud with them halochically because of the physical danger, not the s-xual danger. So yes, no yichud with a non Jew but for different reasons, because "he isn't a man".

I always found that reasoning strange but the bottom line is the halocho and not the reasoning. So yes, no yichud, period, it's ossur but the reason is danger. Hence if there is no danger involved, glass window that anyone can see into, there should be no problem of yichud with a non Jew. Ask a knowledgeable Rov of course (!) but emphasize that this is a non Jew, there are glass windows that anyone can see in, and there is no problem of physical danger and see what he says.

MaBelleVie

Thu, Feb 20 2014, 7:49 am

FS, maybe you should edit your previous post. It seems to imply that there is no prohibition on being in yichud with a non Jew.

Besiyata Dishmaya

Thu, Feb 20 2014, 8:47 am

FS posts are correct and OP should ask a Rov exactly how she specified.

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