Unprecedented look behind the scenes at Lev Tahor in canada

DrMom

Mon, Mar 03 2014, 1:14 am

imochka wrote:

Quote:

Vintagebknyc

putting aside all of your other beliefs--other people can deal with them--this is so deeply offensive. first: how do you know every person involved on that show was a gentile? second: why would only a gentile report on this story? third: your choice in words is unrefined and disgusting, perhaps this is one of the
"many" things you can learn.

I did not check their DNA or do research on their anscestry, but they appear to be goim, or at least, if they are Jewish are not people that are shomer Shabbos. "Goim" are people from other nations, like we are G o y ehad. Assimilated Jews that are sometimes deeply anti-semitic, and always defend the GOIM in all their wicked actions get upset at hearing the word "GOIM". You should be zoiche to love Yidden more than goim and to acquire daat. Shalom.

You cannot tell just by looking at someone that s/he is non-Jewish. Nor can you assume that any given Jew walking down the street is/is not shomer shabbat. That is flat-out absurd and xenophobic.

Dolly1

Mon, Mar 03 2014, 2:38 am

http://www.vosizneias.com/1569.....-not/

oliveoil

Mon, Mar 03 2014, 9:17 am

Another documentary: http://www.cbc.ca/fifth/episod.....tahor

Mama Bear

Mon, Mar 03 2014, 2:36 pm

The documentry that was referred to in that 'open letter' is here. http://www.cbc.ca/player/Shows/ID/2439826542/ I will post it as a new thread.

mfb

Mon, Mar 03 2014, 3:25 pm

For some reason I can't view the last 2 clips the first of the 2 tells me that I can't view it in my region? Question

RachelB

Wed, Mar 05 2014, 4:58 am

Every time I see the way the dress I remember a Russian Orthodox neighbor in chul.
That's what they dress like

Russian and Greek Orthodox nuns dress very similar.
Find the differences!

Culturedpearls

Wed, Mar 05 2014, 6:39 am

Cookie Monster wrote:

I dunno why but it rubs me the wrong way that you keep on saying the word "gentile." Especially considering you are using it derogatorily.

Yes, besides her original post which I really thought was sarcasm. The use of "non jews" is grating in my nerves.

Culturedpearls

Wed, Mar 05 2014, 6:41 am

RachelB wrote:

Every time I see the way the dress I remember a Russian Orthodox neighbor in chul.
That's what they dress like

Russian and Greek Orthodox nuns dress very similar.
Find the differences!

I see some hair, defiantly not tzanua!

Culturedpearls

Wed, Mar 05 2014, 7:36 am

imochka wrote:

Just for the record... I am not defending Lev Tahor per say, but any Jewish community from this ridiculous attacks and scrutiny from people that are hardly ones to protest. And, simply asking... why, why, why?? is there no outcry when Yidden become SO completely assimilated, yet "frum" when they are more goish than the goim?? Why are there no threads about that?? I have yet to see anyone saying anything about the fact that in major Jewish communities and places of Torah... yeshivas, etc. the skirts of wives are shrinking and going up and the sheitals are going down! If helbrans is beating people mamash then he should go to prison, ......................BUT why is everyone so quick to attack them? Lets attack those that constantly shop and talk about shopping, for example... competing with the goim (and winning!)
I ended up in the most goish place in NJ, a mall with such tumah I could hardly breathe. I had never heard about it before and whatever... we were looking for a place for the kids to run around because we got lost, etc. and stopped there for a little bit... and there I saw to my great surprise... this seminary teacher... shopping there, which was fine... BUT how she was talking about the place, how wonderful it is... how she LOVES to come there... so the music, the lack of tznius, the materialism, etc etc... was fine... and she was sooo happy! Look, this is all I am going to say on this matter. Attack me all you want. I honestly dont really have time and overdoing the posts as it is. It just bothers me, this idle chatter based on what...? the videos I saw are all irreligious people, one Israeli program... what does it prove? the medina in Eretz hates us... ok what's the news story?

You know you're really missing simcha in your life. Ivdu es Hashem B'simcha.
You view everything through a skewed perspective. Life isn't black & white. That's just juvenile.
Grow up.

welcome home

Tue, Mar 11 2014, 8:43 pm

Maya wrote:

Oh, please. Rolling Eyes

Satmar people are angels compared to these guys.

When are we going to start listening to the innocent Satmar victims and do something about that community?

Quote:

When Hasidic Boys Grow Up Without Real School

My 9-year-old son hates school. I explain to him that “hate” is a strong word used only in rare instances, and that school — as awful as it may seem to him — is essential to pursuing a career as an adult. I explain to him that education is power, that I would have given the world to be a child again and experience the joys of a “real” education. He loves to take me on a guilt-trip several mornings a week — a trip that begins with him saying “I hate school” and ends with me saying, “You’re going anyway,” and then follows with a post-school, “You know, mom, I don’t learn anything in school because I already know everything.”
The other night, while chowing down on leftovers from previous night’s dinner and scrolling through my Facebook feed, I came upon this video of young boys in the ultra-Hasidic (there is a new pejorative for you, Rabbi Shafran) sect, Lev Tahor, who can barely answer even the most basic English questions about where they live or what they study. I watched it with amusement, spitting bits of breaded chicken breast while letting out huge roaring laughs. My husband, who was sitting on the other computer going through his Facebook feed (we’re that kind of couple), scooted up to have a peek at the comedy on my screen. We both agreed that the video was a tragicomedy and that my laughter was not inhumane; we also agreed that, at the age of 13, my husband would have needed assistance answering similar questions. Educational neglect is just as rampant in Kiryas Joel, the insular epicenter for Satmar Hasidim where we grew up.

Lev Tahor is a small fundamentalist Hasidic sect that has made its home in an isolated area in Chatham, Ontario, in rows of identical houses. The community of roughly 40 families, led by their Jim Jones-like leader, Shlomo Helbrans, made the headlines recently as children were removed from their parents care by Canadian child protection services, citing neglect and physical abuse. The jury is still out on what exactly is happening inside the homes of members of this tight-knit cult, and I suspect we will never truly know.
Once again, they are fleeing to avoid the justice system. In the face of child neglect and physical abuse charges, the issue of educational neglect seems insignificant. But as the video indicates, it isn’t. These boys are lacking the basic language tools to take one step out of the community, to communicate with anyone outside their community. But this is not unusual for insular Hasidic communities. They’re an easy target, given their radical history, but how many states can a boy of the same age in Kiryas Joel name? Can they name their body parts? Do they know what science is? Can they answer if they enjoy studying math?
The answer is no, no and no. Young boys in Kiryas Joel and, to some degree, in Satmar Williamsburg, are about as illiterate as these boys. They may have a slightly better understanding of the vernacular language, but they certainly cannot answer questions of the sort the reporter was throwing at Lev Tahor boys.
Last summer, when I interviewed Hasidic men and women who grew up with little to no secular education, I remember feeling angry at this system that churns out, intentionally, boys who cannot speak or read English — the first step in acquiring basic skills to function as an adult in the 21st century. The words one brilliant man used to refer to educational neglect in Satmar is still ringing in my ears: “This is criminal.”
Indeed, it is. Educational neglect of this magnitude should be considered criminal. No community in America should be allowed to perpetuate such inattention to the wellbeing of children.
Watching this video made me think of the countless times my husband and I explained to our children why we don’t know certain basic concepts or historical facts, why my husband never learned how to punctuate a sentence. We talk freely about our childhoods and our desire to see them, our children, receive a solid education. We explain that education is power, and that it is the single driving force for human progression. We speak of our pride in their academic achievements and demonstrate its importance by asking questions about subjects we don’t know.
The next time my son says he hates school, I will play him this video. Hopefully he will get the message.

Read more: http://blogs.forward.com/siste.....XUJ00

Mama Bear

Tue, Mar 11 2014, 10:24 pm

My 8 yr old son is in 'first grade' in Satmar. He has plenty of general world knowledge and has a pretty good english for a first grader. And he will know how to learn, and read, and write. especially in this texting age, he's getting plenty of spelling practice texting random words on my phone . VERY far cry from the Lev Tahor bochurim. He knew who the president of the United States was when he was five years old, years before they started English studies. C'mon.

welcome home

Tue, Mar 11 2014, 10:34 pm

Mama Bear wrote:

The average first grader is 6 years old. Why was your son held back for two years?

naturalmom5

Tue, Mar 11 2014, 10:38 pm

I think she once said he is special needs

Deep

Tue, Mar 11 2014, 10:48 pm

The use of the term "illiterate" is blatantly misleading. Most chassidic men are proficient in at least 3 languages (Hebrew, Aramaic and Yiddish). That is way more than the vast majority of "literate" Westerners.

welcome home

Tue, Mar 11 2014, 10:52 pm

Deep wrote:

So are the Lev Tahor children but that doesnt excuse anyone from not knowing/learning english.

Last edited by welcome home on Tue, Mar 11 2014, 11:57 pm; edited 2 times in total

welcome home

Tue, Mar 11 2014, 10:55 pm

naturalmom5 wrote:

I think she once said he is special needs

There are plenty of special needs kids that still start first grade at 6. They get additional help ie resource room, para, etc so Mama Bear's son should not have had a problem starting first grade at 6 either.

kiwi strawberry

Tue, Mar 11 2014, 11:20 pm

welcome home wrote:

Welcome home, I have to say I am shocked by your insensitivity. Do you know the nature of Mama Bear's son's special needs? How can you say he should not have a problem starting first grade at 6? Who are you to determine that?? And what does that have to do with anything anyway? Her point still stands, even if her son "should have" started first grade at 6. I haven't been following every detail of this thread though, so maybe I'm missing something, and if so then I apologize.

the world's best mom

Tue, Mar 11 2014, 11:31 pm

welcome home wrote:

Chassidish Yeshivas begin teaching secular studies at 8 years old.

Just because some kids can do well in regular ed with support doesn't mean all children with special needs can be mainstreamed.

ra_mom

Tue, Mar 11 2014, 11:36 pm

welcome home wrote:

Excuse you?
You might want to take that back and apologize to Mama Bear.

gold21

Tue, Mar 11 2014, 11:46 pm

I don't think her 8 year old is the one with special needs, not that it matters. Weird thing to discuss..... What