Do you use separate stovetops for milichig and fleishig?

amother

Thu, Jun 19 2014, 7:38 pm

amother wrote:

Some ravs don't allow one you to have one. Mine doesn't.

כל המוסיף גורע
If you're gonna say he doesn't recommend it because many ppl unknowingly treif up their kitchens: ok. I hear it. But to not allow it? You must have misunderstood- I hope?

mille

Thu, Jun 19 2014, 8:01 pm

Sherri wrote:

What is the protocol for using one sink for both dairy and meat?

What does one do about the hot water, the dishes on the floor of the sink...?

Get a sink rack (well, two, one for meat and one for dairy): http://www.housewaresandbeyond.....k.jpg

MaBelleVie

Thu, Jun 19 2014, 8:15 pm

amother wrote:

כל המוסיף גורע
If you're gonna say he doesn't recommend it because many ppl unknowingly treif up their kitchens: ok. I hear it. But to not allow it? You must have misunderstood- I hope?

I was wondering maybe amother has a weird setup that would somehow maybe it impossible to share a stovetop. Outside of that, it isn't possible to say it's flat out not allowed.

Sherri

Thu, Jun 19 2014, 8:28 pm

mille wrote:

Get a sink rack (well, two, one for meat and one for dairy): http://www.housewaresandbeyond.....k.jpg

I think it is much more inconvenient/challenging to keep a kosher kitchen with one sink than to keep a kosher kitchen with one stove top.

amother

Thu, Jun 19 2014, 8:41 pm

My4Jewels wrote:

to the amother who's rav doesnt allow just one..is your rav financing your kitchen remodel? not sure how any rabbi can dictate that you have 2 ovens, and separate counter tops seeing as many small kitchens only have one counter.

He dictated that I must have THREE ovens and 2 microwaves. DH said the rav said it doesn't look nice not to do it this way.

MaBelleVie

Thu, Jun 19 2014, 8:43 pm

amother wrote:

He dictated that I must have THREE ovens and 2 microwaves. DH said the rav said it doesn't look nice not to do it this way.

It doesn't look nice? Someone sounds like he has ocd.

amother

Thu, Jun 19 2014, 9:07 pm

MaBelleVie wrote:

It doesn't look nice? Someone sounds like he has ocd.

I hope this is a joke because it is disrespectful.

Where do you get my rav had OCD from the fact I need to have 2 stove tops and 3 ovens? That my rav doesn't hold with burning out ovens doesn't give him a diagnosis of OCD.

My kitchen looks like a commercial kitchen with all the appliances. My rav is correct that it doesn't look nice in my community.

Rutabaga

Thu, Jun 19 2014, 9:11 pm

amother wrote:

What do you do for Pesach?

sky

Thu, Jun 19 2014, 9:17 pm

Regarding the burning out ovens - in America many do burn out of ovens - but there are communities I think specifically in eretz yisroel that do not burn out ovens. I think burning out the oven itself is a leniency as we really aren't supposed to kasher back and forth between milk and meat. In America an oven was exempted from this, but I still know people (older generation) who do not cook meat in their oven but only on the stove top for this reason.
I have a convection oven microwave and our rav said that I should really try not to kasher it back and forth between milk and meat because you aren't really supposed to go back and forth, but it was allowed for ovens because they are larger, but for a convection oven that is the size of a microwave I should not do it regularly but only under pressing circumstances.

someone mentioned Rebbetzen Kanievsky, we don't know where she cooked things and how. I have a sister in law who was one of 18 children and her mother never cooked meat in the oven because she didn't hold in switching back and forth. She also didn't have two ovens or any microwave. And they survived.

MaBelleVie

Thu, Jun 19 2014, 9:32 pm

amother wrote:

Not looking nice has no halachic implications under these circumstances. It is not appropriate to give a psak halacha based on that.

Many people don't burn out their ovens. They just don't cook food that is considered pareve only. Or they use a countertop convection oven. No one "needs" two microwaves, or even one. Etc.

And all of this has nothing to do with a stovetop, for which there is no basis in halacha for requiring more than one.

amother

Thu, Jun 19 2014, 9:48 pm

MaBelleVie wrote:

Who are you to say what and when it is appropriate for for my rav to pasken? What gives you the right to jump to diagnosis someone's rav with OCD?

I will spell it out for you. It doesn't look nice because I have a luxury house. I am sure my rav has halachic reasons why he said it doesn't look nice for someone who can readily afford to build out the kitchen to accommodate every kosher rule and doesn't.

If my rav feels we need 2 microwaves then I will follow my rav thankyouverymuch.

MaBelleVie

Thu, Jun 19 2014, 9:56 pm

There is no kosher rule that someone needs anything in their kitchen. The only kosher rule is to keep what you have kosher. I really don't care what goes on in the luxury kitchen of your luxury home (I'm wondering what his halachic psak is on that). But saying that something is a requirement is also saying that anyone who doesn't do it that way is not following halacha.

JoyInTheMorning

Thu, Jun 19 2014, 10:00 pm

Raisin wrote:

a lot of people I know have two. anyone with a decent sized kitchen (ie a house) My sister has a 2 burner built in stove for milchig and a much bigger stove for meat.

Really? I know many people who have tiny kitchens in their houses. That's in the U.S., where houses are big. I was under the impression that kitchens in Europe are generally smaller; is this contrary to your experience?

Anyway, even if you have the room, kitchen renovations can be very expensive. In my area, it can cost 70K or more even for seemingly simple renovations. If a couple is struggling to pay the mortgage --- and, of course, Yeshiva tuition --- how can they afford that kind of renovation for what is essentially a chumrah?

And what about all those people who live in apartments all their lives? What are they supposed to do?

vintagebknyc

Thu, Jun 19 2014, 10:09 pm

JoyInTheMorning wrote:

I suppose those of us in apartments, who cannot have two sinks/ovens/microwaves/etc, are just going to have to be less frum.

amother

Thu, Jun 19 2014, 10:30 pm

MaBelleVie wrote:

You are out of line second guessing any rav. You are out of line diagnosing my rav based on a pasak you don't like. If my rav says it is halacha, then it is halacha.

amother

Thu, Jun 19 2014, 10:54 pm

amother wrote:

You are out of line second guessing any rav. You are out of line diagnosing my rav based on a pasak you don't like. If my rav says it is halacha, then it is halacha.

I know this is off topic. But it really rubs me the wrong way. Ladies, how many of you agree with this view of all rabbanim as infallible? I find it very odd. Growing up, we were taught that a Talmid Chacham- and indeed, to a degree, any person- deserved our respect. There is no concept of papal infallibility in torAh. Not even for the gedolei hador. And semicha / the title of rav / some followers certainly does not confer upon someone the status of gadol hador.
Anon bc this newfangled adulation of anything rabbinic is a pet peeve of mine and people know it.

mummiedearest

Thu, Jun 19 2014, 10:54 pm

amother wrote:

You are out of line second guessing any rav. You are out of line diagnosing my rav based on a pasak you don't like. If my rav says it is halacha, then it is halacha.

op, did your rav say it's necessary for kashrus reasons? no. even by your argument, it is not halacha in terms of kashrus. you said he said it wouldn't look good in your community not to have these things. I assume this is more in line with the idea that rich people should live in a manner that respects their financial status. not sure it's halacha, though. and it's not a kashrus issue.