sharing your schar with the KitchenAid

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Sharing your schar with the KitchenAid

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Tefila

Wed, Oct 18 2006, 4:26 pm

Micki

micki

Wed, Oct 18 2006, 7:28 pm

just thought of this too- even if you mix the challa by hand, you are still using a bowl. and a spoon and measuring cups too.
so sorry to all who thought they get more schar that way, half went to your spoon LOL

gryp

Wed, Oct 18 2006, 7:30 pm

shalhevet

Wed, Oct 18 2006, 7:32 pm

And what, if by using your KitchenAid to help you, you were left with more time and/or energy to do yet more mitzvos?

shoy18

Wed, Oct 18 2006, 7:32 pm

micki wrote:

LOL

chen

Thu, Oct 19 2006, 9:21 am

We should consider it an honor to elevate our humble household belongings in this way. Did we not read in the haftoroh last week that all the pots in yerusholayim will be drafted for use in avodas hashem, becuase there will be so many people coming and bringing korbonos?

(Guess I'd better get out the Bon Ami and the steel wool and shine up that cookware. No way mine will pass muster for the shul kiddush, let alone the Bais hamikdosh!)

mummy-bh

Thu, Oct 19 2006, 9:25 am

queen wrote:

... and if that machine helps you make your challah- you've elvated it's being to a higher level Smile

Yup, I go for that one as well!

Crayon210

Thu, Oct 19 2006, 9:57 am

I'm doomed...I use a bread machine. Sad

Crayon210

Thu, Oct 19 2006, 10:05 am

Or maybe that'll be the newest thing in the BHM"K--twelve bread machines on the shulchan to bake the lechem hapanim (oops, those were matzos, weren't they? Maybe they'll have a "matzah" setting...)

613

Thu, Oct 19 2006, 10:53 am

However, there is a concept of L'fom Tzaara Agraa= According to the "pain" (ie. effort) is the reward.

TzenaRena

Thu, Oct 19 2006, 11:04 am

shoy18 wrote:

micki wrote:

LOL

Question: Is there more 'value" to a mitzvah when more of yourself is invested into it? As the verse "kol atmosai toimarna...( all my limbs shall say) implies. For example, Torah Study should involve not only the thought of the person, or even his dibbur, but also some physical exertion, which is why learning is so animated, accompanied by gestures and "shukeling", and the familiar sing-song tune be it of the of the Gemara, or a maamar Chassidus, or children learning Chumash e.g. it's a whole body experience!

And we know the principal of "schar halicha" which is in addition to "schar maaseh".

So yes, there does seem to be value in doing a mitzvah with one's 248 limbs, and physical exertion. However, then there's the story of the Tzemach Tzedek, when the Alter Rebbe wanted to give him a bracha for success in Torah learning he thought: How then will he accomplish the edict that one must learn Torah with yegiah (effort and toil)?

Later, the Tzemach Tzedek regretted not having accepted the bracha, because he said there could always have been yegiah on top of beyond the learning that came effortlessly.

so if you "share" the mitzvah with your mixer, then you could still make sure that you ARE investing physical koichos into mitzvos on top of that one!

aussiegal

Thu, Oct 19 2006, 11:22 am

613 wrote:

However, there is a concept of L'fom Tzaara Agraa= According to the "pain" (ie. effort) is the reward.

washing a dirty machine/pot etc. is quite a PAIN!! esp. in my small sink! Smile

ceo

Thu, Oct 19 2006, 12:04 pm

I do want to mention that it says in Sefer Ohel Rachel that the time when kneading challah is one of the most opportune times for a woman to daven. It does NOT say "when you press the 'on button on your bosch, the gates of shamayim open." LOL

So while we still get schar for the mitzva, I do think that we lose out on that es ratzon to daven.

okay, that being said....I also use a bread machine! When we get an extra freezer, I am also getting a Bosch!!! Tongue Out

happymom

Thu, Oct 19 2006, 12:31 pm

I am sure u get just as much schar no matter what u use.

chen

Thu, Oct 19 2006, 12:59 pm

[/quote="613"]However, there is a concept of L'fom Tzaara Agraa= According to the "pain" (ie. effort) is the reward.[/quote]

then why bother with a shabbos elevator or those handy-dandy prefab sukkohs? or driving the 1-1/2 miles to shul erev shabbos? etc. etc. etc.

shalhevet

Thu, Oct 19 2006, 1:01 pm

chen wrote:

[/quote="613"]However, there is a concept of L'fom Tzaara Agraa= According to the "pain" (ie. effort) is the reward.

then why bother with a shabbos elevator [/quote]

A lot of rabbonim hold you can't use them, especially for healthy people.

Crayon210

Thu, Oct 19 2006, 1:03 pm

I think there are two ways of looking at our avodah today in this regard:

A) Use the technology and tools we have been blessed with to elevate them by using them for mitzvos, and also get the added benefit of having extra time to do even more mitzvos, or

B) Do things with the extra effort to really appreciate the work you need to put into the mitzvah, and also get the added benefit of developing the middah of patience and its derivatives.

I guess it's quality v. quantity. I don't know which is "right".

DefyGravity

Thu, Oct 19 2006, 1:05 pm

Motek wrote:

I read the following and wonder what you think about it:

"Although a food processor can knead your challa dough do you really want the "KitchenAid" to get part of the schar (reward) for your mitzva?"

That would be a step up for me. Right now, all the schar goes to the bakery.

Motek

Thu, Oct 19 2006, 1:39 pm

micki wrote:

do we share the schar of davening with a siddur? of taharas hamishpacha with bedika cloths and shampoo?
tzedaka with a wooden or metal can?
covering hair with a piece of fabric?
lighting candles with sticks of wax?

we use keilim to do mitzvos and we elevate the tools we use. not share the schar with them.

Your examples made me smile but they really aren't comparable to kneading by hand vs. using a machine. With the dough, the question is how will it be kneaded, with my physical effort or via a machine.

How does that relate to davening with a siddur or using bedika cloths or a metal can for a pushka etc. etc.?

If you want to compare it you would have to say, would you give a robot a coin and send it off to drop it in a pushka or put it in the pushka yourself!

ceo

Thu, Oct 19 2006, 3:15 pm

DefyGravity wrote:

Motek wrote:

That would be a step up for me. Right now, all the schar goes to the bakery.

DEfy-

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