I can't take this anymore

acccdac

Tue, May 12 2015, 7:30 pm

there are a whole bunch of things running around in my head hopefully this will make sense

your DH grew up in a poor home, and he is doing all that is possible to prevent his kids from growing up in the same type of lifestyle. If you were to stop working then he is afraid that your kids' lives will be like his. Firstly, I dont know what his childhood was like. in his mind he feels its the worst thing probably above abuse he could do to his children (based on how YOU worded it). Lets call his childhood a 10 (where 1-10 and 10 is the worst possible). In his mind if you stop working his kids will grow up calling their childhood a 10. Although in reality if you stopped working it could be more like a 5. I understand he wants to provide a 1 but having a depressed/worn out mother takes that 1 a to a 3 or maybe even a 5. The two of you need to sit down with someone and discuss his fear and let him realize that there are many numbers between 1 and 10.

Divorce doesnt help things. Who says the court will say he is responsible to pay tuition, they may decide its 50/50 because your parents can pay. (I'll bring up your parents in a minute). The idea of jewish school will be brought up in court proceedings and you may not have the ability to pull them out without his consent.

I understand what sequoia is saying that no everyone is built to work but if that means divorce then NO kids are built for that, why should HER needs trump her KIDS needs.

I do believe you are not built to work because you say your parents are willing to take you in over this. I believe your parents raised you a certain way and they are willing to take care of you which has provided a disservice to you. I know someone whose parents were rich, doing fine until their son in law used their money incorrectly (yes they are at fault for giving him the money) and they are now housing her and her kids. They hardly see their other grandchildren because they are coparenting these kids, they have no money to their name because whatever is not covered by the ex is covered by them. They are in their 60s and will never get to retire. They will never live out their dreams. I commend them for taking care of their daughter but I dont feel it was right of HER to have her parents to do that for her.

I work, I've taken off 1 year with 2 of my kids and did not take off with 2 of my kids. I am a teacher. Each year I go through the same thing, the week before school starts I have nightmares, I dread boing to work. I have these feelings after succos and pesach. But I know I have to, and I go. The first day is hard and by the end of the week I am fine. I know that not working isnt an option. There is only 1 other "profession" I would like better than this (its not really a job, but something that would bring in money). I also know that in 3 years from now I will have to leave teaching at my kids school and while kicking and screaming I will move to teach in public school. I dont want to leave my bubble of the jewish world. I dont want to teach in public school. I will not be making more money because the extra pay will go towards the tuition discount I am currently getting. I do however want an extra $10,000 (we would get that because I would cover health insurance and my dh will get that paid out to him.) I would also be working at the age of 35-65 for my life 65-120. I iwll get to retire and visit my grandchildren when I want. I will get to travel with my dh. I will NOT have to work. I am not working in PS because I want to do that now, I'm working towards a goal/future. I dont know if you have a goal/future in mind so going to work everyday is hard without having that.

OneSource

Tue, May 12 2015, 7:55 pm

OP, I'm sorry you are going through this. Its never an easy call whether to work or raise your children. Believe me, I know! BUT - that being said, as mothers and wives, we all make sacrifices for the benefit of our family. For example, to pay my mortgage, I couldn't take a maternity leave at all. My job doesn't offer a paid leave and our savings went into buying and renovating our first home this past fall and to cover my husband's medical expenses when he (suddenly) became ill (disease that just became symptomatic.) As a result, I got one week off (cashed out my remaining vacay days) and one week unpaid. At two weeks, I started working from home part-time (actually harder than it sounds when you are dealing with temperamental clients and a screaming newborn) just for a half-paycheck which covers the bills so we can avoid taking on debt. We all make sacrifices. No, I absolutely did NOT want to work with my sleep-deprived brain and cranky disposition. In fact, work was the LAST THING on earth (short of a proctologist appointment!) that I wanted to take on but the needs of the family won out. My job, unlike yours, doesn't let me take a year off and if I did, I would be in debt and that's just a hard hole to climb out of.

I wish this was easier for you. Maybe try thinking of all the good your salary does for your children. Or that you might win the lottery and not have to worry about tuition anymore. Or try treating yourself to something special or even taking time out to pamper yourself for all your hard work. Anything but resorting to divorce and dividing up your family over something like a job and working.

Butterfly

Wed, May 13 2015, 12:40 am

OP, since your parents are willing to support you by taking you in with the kids and providing you with food and clothing, plus extra electricity, water, and heating bills that the basement you will live in will run them, why not have them help support you in your own home instead of using their help to break up your well functioning family??

Unless you are not telling us all there is to your story, this divorce idea is totally out of range here.
You yourself said that you love your husband and he is a loving father to your kids.

Do you really have that kinda heart to deliberately destroy yours, your husband's, and your children's lives by separating their father from them? The hurt, the embarrassment and the shame their innocent hearts will feel? A Shabbas and Yom Tov table without their beloved father? and much more? Do you comprehend the consequences your kids will endure by this? surely not!

If you go through with the divorce prepare yourself to earn another income for therapy bills. Or perhaps your parents might gladly pay for that too.
Most kids of divorced parents need professional therapy to help them cope with the trauma that divorce brings on for them.

I sincerely believe that you need a break from work at this point. You seem totally burnt out (emotionally).
Everyone needs recharging at certain times in their lives. You are no exception!

Take a nice vacation with or without your husband. Borrow the money if you need to. (from your parents perhaps??)

Visit a Psychiatrist or psychotherapist for evaluation of your depression. You might need some meds (temporarily) to help alleviate it.

It's most important that you both find a competent third party to discuss your issues together with. "Professional only"!
Hopefully he can guide you guys with a logical solution bezr'H.

Last edited by Butterfly on Wed, May 13 2015, 12:49 am; edited 2 times in total

shabbatiscoming

Wed, May 13 2015, 12:42 am

amother wrote:

Jobs that offer a year's maternity leave are usually INSANELY stressful when you're actually working. Full time really means full time and a half and balancing motherhood is not nearly as easy as advertised. I work for a place like that...

Add to it the fact that you're not getting much support from your DH and it's no wonder you're falling apart.

Is it an option for you to change jobs? Even if the pay is significantly reduced, less hours and less stress can make a huge difference. Also, the reduction would be offset by a reduction in expenses so you won't feel it as much. Or how about less hours at your current workplace- is that an option?

The OP never said where she is. I know some countries that automatically give a year's maternity leave, no matter the job. Just opinting that out.
I have a friend in montreal, works in fashion, got a whole year. And I know other places like that too.

moonbeam

Wed, May 13 2015, 1:34 am

sequoia wrote:

Why does she "need therapy"? If they were wealthy and she could easily be a stay at home mom, would you still tell her to get therapy?

Not everyone can do everything. It is a hurtful, damaging, destructive, disgusting myth of capitalism that everyone is capable of spending most of their waking hours working. And her husband is being an immature jerk if he's willing to lose his wife over this.

YES, he is the man and he should provide BECAUSE HE IS THE MAN. She has been working, she can't anymore, he shouldn't force her.

I am disgusted by the responses on this thread. A woman with several children wants to be a stay at home mom, and you all are yelling at her!

No Jewish education is worth this!!! What if she has a nervous breakdown heaven forbid?

The suggestion to move into her parents' basement is a last-ditch cry for help. Her husband won't let her quit her job. She's desperate.

Again, not everyone can do everything!!! The hurtful, invalidating statements like "I do it, therefore you can too" need to stop.

This, exactly!! I'm reading this thread and getting more and more annoyed. What a bunch of unsensitive people! Unbelievable. and yes, disgusting.

How many freaking threads have there been on Imamother about sahm's who hate being SAHM's and feel depressed and hate life and they just want a job-and everyone comes on and posts support and tells her to get a job and get a nanny for the baby and take care of her needs because she is important too and shouldn't be forced to do what makes her so unhappy....? TONS! And no one ever, EVER suggests therapy. If OP's DH refused to "let" her work and made her stay at home and was unwilling to discuss options and said he'd divorce her if she got a job you all would be falling all over yourselves to tell op what a terrible dh he is.

Some. People. Hate. Working. Outside. The. Home. Deal with it. And no, they're not more "weak" or whatever you want to say than the woman who has kids but puts them in school and has a full time job because she can't stand dealing with her kids 24/7. And yes, there are women out there like that.

Where's your respect? Where's your caring and understanding for your fellow Jew??

I can relate, OP. I hate, hate, HATE working outside my home. I loathe it. It sucks. Makes me depressed and miserable, life has little meaning and I feel completely unfulfilled. Even when I had the best job ever.
So I'm a sahm now. And I homeschool. And I LOVE EVERY SINGLE SECOND. It's wonderful, my life has meaning, I feel fulfilled, happy, content. My children are thriving, our house is happy.

Apparently I must be some kind of bizarre weirdo. But guess what, people? This is how Hashem made me. And I'm not the only one. Deal with it.

Op, feel free to PM me if you ever want to. I'm here for you.

Last edited by moonbeam on Wed, May 13 2015, 2:03 am; edited 1 time in total

imaima

Wed, May 13 2015, 3:14 am

I wonder why no one is getting that OP has probably much bigger marital problems than just tuition.

They seem to run their home like a business and where are feelings? How come they are so ready to jump to divorce as long as one needs to work and the other one needs to be a sole breadwinner? What would be if she lost her job for a reason out of her control, would he just throw her out??

And what if he lost his job, would OP do? If he got ill and op would have to work even more to just pay the bills? Would she bury her head in the sand and move in with her parents so she doesn't have to deal with this loser of a husband?

Nowhere in this story have I seen two people who sat down to find a solution together.

There is no need to berate OP for being ready to divorce, her dh is just as guilty. If you agree that marriage is tit for tat, then this structure is very fragile. Not always are both spouses able bodied and ready to contribute equally.

That being said, Op needs a reality check. Do you think a private tutor for kodesh will be much cheaper for your kids? Or that being burnt out as you are, you will be able to successfully homeschool them on the same level they are in a proper school? Doesn't sound like it is the case.

Butterfly

Wed, May 13 2015, 3:31 am

amother wrote:

With what money?

Even with all that, that doesn't solve the problem. I just cannot work anymore.

He would divorce me for abandoning the family and its needs. He grew up poor because his father chased a ridiculous dream and his mother didn't work. He doesn't want to raise his kids in poverty and views me quitting my job as a family betrayal. He doesn't want to stay with someone who is willing to throw away financial stability because they hate working.

Did he actually 'verbally' threaten you with the word 'divorce' if you decide to quit working or is he just humiliating you by making you believe that he would leave/divorce you?

If he truly loves you it would seem highly unlikely that he would seriously imply actions for divorce because of your financial disagreements no matter how serious those are. in the long run neither of you would benefit from divorce financially anyway. It would probably be more costly than you can imagine, as I have already stated in my previous post. I think you both know it...
Granted, if you quit working perhaps you might experience frequent arguments and /or other sorts of unpleasant SB incidents ch'v, until you both figure out how to resolve your issues peacefully and sensibly.

You guys need professional counseling so so desperately!!

P.S. AFAIK most Rabbanim and askanim would not allow divorce over some financial crisis, especially when the marriage is otherwise stable.
Hatzlacha rabbah in working out your differences beshalom bezr'H!

ora_43

Wed, May 13 2015, 3:35 am

eemachana wrote:

How many freaking threads have there been on Imamother about sahm's who hate being SAHM's and feel depressed and hate life and they just want a job-and everyone comes on and posts support and tells her to get a job and get a nanny for the baby and take care of her needs because she is important too and shouldn't be forced to do what makes her so unhappy....? TONS! And no one ever, EVER suggests therapy. If OP's DH refused to "let" her work and made her stay at home and was unwilling to discuss options and said he'd divorce her if she got a job you all would be falling all over yourselves to tell op what a terrible dh he is.

Because in that case, there's a reasonable alternative that doesn't hurt the children. "I go work and pay for a nanny" - solution. "I quit work and other people pay for everything" - not a solution. See the difference?

Quote:

Some. People. Hate. Working. Outside. The. Home. Deal with it.

It's fine to hate working outside the home. It's fine to be incapable of working outside the home. It's bad, but sometimes not avoidable, to have a bunch of kids whose needs can only be provided for with two incomes, and then to realize that you're not capable of working outside the home.

It's not fine to have a bunch of kids whose needs can only be provided for with two incomes, and then to decide you're not cut out for work and that the solution is for your spouse to lose his family but keep paying for everything.

ora_43

Wed, May 13 2015, 3:42 am

That said I do think some responses have been a bit harsh, because I don't get the sense OP is saying that she's unwilling to work at all, just that she can't cut back on hours and her current hours are driving her nuts. I think that's very reasonable. Most people work, but most people couldn't handle working more than a certain number of hours a week.

But OP, please please listen to all the warnings about what life would really be like without a salary. Maternity leave is great because you're living the life of someone with a full salary, without working. Just plain not working - and being dirt poor - is way way way harder. You can't cook healthy food when all you can afford is pasta. You can't keep the house clean when you have however-many people living in a teeny tiny space. And quality time with kids might be less fun (albeit more necessary) if the kids are struggling to deal with the effects of divorce, poverty, and/or adjusting to a totally new school system.

I hope you can find a solution. I like what a previous poster said about seeing if your parents could help you finance a career switch. Clearly your parents are very willing to be there for you, if they'd take in you and all your kids and not expect you to work! So maybe they'd be willing to support with a loan, instead.

ora_43

Wed, May 13 2015, 4:05 am

imaima wrote:

I think because for a lot of people, divorce if one spouse absolutely refuses to work isn't "so ready to jump to divorce" territory. It's a pretty big deal. Being unable to work is a different story.

But yes, I do wonder about that. OP - are you saying your husband would want a divorce if you quit work completely, and didn't homeschool? Or that you think he would want a divorce even if you had a reasonable alternative to working - eg homeschooling the kids? Or even if you wanted to keep working, but in an easier, lower-paid job (if that were an option)?

Or if not threats of divorce, what do you think his reaction would be, if you just went ahead and made changes less drastic than becoming a full-time SAHM without his approval? (Although hopefully with many attempts to reassure him, eg drafts of budgets)