Unethical comment from doctor.

Ema of 5

Sun, Apr 30 2023, 3:09 pm

amother Yolk wrote:

This attitude defines a difficult patient. Saying please and thank you doesn't have too much to do with it.

But she’s right. His job as a doctor isn’t to make sure she is following religious advice. His job is to administer the test and, if needed, help guide the patient. He was out of bounds on this one.

amother

Sun, Apr 30 2023, 3:10 pm

amother Yolk wrote:

This attitude defines a difficult patient. Saying please and thank you doesn't have too much to do with it.

It’s not only the please and thank you. It’s the comments I consistently get from doctors and nurses after a visit. You’re such a good patient, it was a pleasure to deal with you today.

amother

Sun, Apr 30 2023, 3:10 pm

Ema of 5 wrote:

Thank you!

amother

Marigold

Sun, Apr 30 2023, 3:33 pm

It is easy to understand why , but is not really wise that OP is giving any attention to her doctor’s lacking professionalism and her husband’s genetic status. Women with BRCA mutations have almost a 100 percent risk of breast cancer. It’s generally recommended that they have bilateral mastectomies. Pregnancy accelerated the risk of breast cancer because of the very high estrogen levels present during pregnancy. In the view of many, the mastectomy should occur before any pregnancy. As far as the husbands genetic status, if one is going to do pre implantation screening of embryos, then one will screen out both heterozygous and homozygous for the BRCA mutation (I.e embryos that have it from one side and embryos that have it from both), so the genetic status of the husband doesn’t matter. .
BRCA patients are also at a high risk for ovarian cancer. Once they have had a few children, they should move quickly to also have both ovaries removed.
Please OP, take care of yourself. Just find another doctor and focus on what’s important.

PinkFridge

Sun, Apr 30 2023, 3:49 pm

That a doctor who can tell a patient who has a history that leads to BRCA testing, why do you want to live under the threat of cancer, is committing malpractice.

Last edited by PinkFridge on Sun, Apr 30 2023, 9:13 pm; edited 1 time in total

amother

Mulberry

Sun, Apr 30 2023, 5:12 pm

[quote="amother Marigold"]It is easy to understand why , but is not really wise that OP is giving any attention to her doctor’s lacking professionalism and her husband’s genetic status. Women with BRCA mutations have almost a 100 percent risk of breast cancer.

This is NOT TRUE!! I do not know where you are getting your information from but I am BRCA+ and I have been counseled by 2 genetic counselors at a major NYC teaching hospital, have had consultations with 2 prominent gynecological oncologists and a well known breast surgeon. EVERY single one of them made it clear that while I have an increased risk of breast cancer, it is most certainly NOT any kind of sure thing. Most breast cancers are NOT caused by BRCA. And NOT ONE, NOT ONE relative of mine has had breast cancer including the grandmother and aunt that I know for sure are BRCA positive. I was diagnosed at 52 and had a prophylactic oophorectomy 6 months later as advised and I get a mammogram and a breast MRI on a 6 month alternating schedule as advised. I am allowed to be on HRT which includes and ESTROGEN patch and Mirena IUD) for 2 years. Posting "100% risk" is fear mongering and ignorant.

Ruchi

Sun, Apr 30 2023, 8:05 pm

[quote="Ema of 5"]That is not for the doctor to determine, unless he is

When you want to do what's right with Hashem, you don't get so outraged if your doctor made you aware of something this important.
I don't say you have to particularly like it but I think you should be grateful if he pointed you in the right direction on something that is clearly important halachicaly. (And even more so if you claim its between you and Hashem)

Ema of 5

Sun, Apr 30 2023, 8:12 pm

[quote="Ruchi"]

Ema of 5 wrote:

That is not for the doctor to determine, unless he is

When you want to do what's right with Hashem, you don't get so outraged if your doctor made you aware of something this important.
I don't say you have to particularly like it but I think you should be grateful if he pointed you in the right direction on something that is clearly important halachicaly. (And even more so if you claim its between you and Hashem)

I live my life according to the torah, and I would NOT appreciate my doctor (or anyone else, for that matter) giving me unsolicited halachic advice. My halachic decisions are between me and my husband and a rabbi. NOT my doctor. His right direction might not be mine, and my right direction might not be his. He needs to stay in his own lane. It’s one thing if I ask….it’s another to give unsolicited.

notshanarishona

Sun, Apr 30 2023, 8:13 pm

[quote="Ruchi"]

Ema of 5 wrote:

There is a difference between making aware and pushing your opinion. It’s not the doctors business or ethical to probe to find out if someone had a heter or what their circumstances (besides the medical ones ) are. , But I don’t think there is something wrong with telling someone that typically one needs a heter to do x,y,z. I do think insisting on calling the wife (who is not his patient) is taking it too far. The husband can make his own decisions.

Ema of 5

Sun, Apr 30 2023, 8:20 pm

notshanarishona wrote:

Most things do not universally require a heter, so I don’t think it’s a doctors place to inform a patient that something requires a heter.

PinkFridge

Sun, Apr 30 2023, 9:12 pm

[quote="amother Mulberry"]

amother Marigold wrote:

It is easy to understand why , but is not really wise that OP is giving any attention to her doctor’s lacking professionalism and her husband’s genetic status. Women with BRCA mutations have almost a 100 percent risk of breast cancer.

This is NOT TRUE!! I do not know where you are getting your information from but I am BRCA+ and I have been counseled by 2 genetic counselors at a major NYC teaching hospital, have had consultations with 2 prominent gynecological oncologists and a well known breast surgeon. EVERY single one of them made it clear that while I have an increased risk of breast cancer, it is most certainly NOT any kind of sure thing. Most breast cancers are NOT caused by BRCA. And NOT ONE, NOT ONE relative of mine has had breast cancer including the grandmother and aunt that I know for sure are BRCA positive. I was diagnosed at 52 and had a prophylactic oophorectomy 6 months later as advised and I get a mammogram and a breast MRI on a 6 month alternating schedule as advised. I am allowed to be on HRT which includes and ESTROGEN patch and Mirena IUD) for 2 years. Posting "100% risk" is fear mongering and ignorant.

Thank you for clarifying.

amother

Banana

Mon, May 01 2023, 10:26 am

amother OP wrote:

Really? It is patients like me that make practicing medicine difficult? I’m one of the best patients when it comes to go to a doctor. I don’t make anyone crazy, I wait patiently, I say please and thank you at every interaction etc. your comment hurt me more than others cuz I really try and am considered a very good patient.

I sincerely apologize. I thought you were advocating for reporting the doctor but now I see you are not.

I honestly think this is a situation of miscommunication. I don't think he intended any harm and truly wanted to ensure you fully understood the ramifications. The situation was compounded by the fact that your husband was the first one he spoke to and we don't know what was said there. I wish you much hatzlacha and hope the test brings you menuchas hanefesh.

Ema of 5

Mon, May 01 2023, 11:26 am

amother Banana wrote:

I sincerely apologize. I thought you were advocating for reporting the doctor but now I see you are not.

I honestly think this is a situation of miscommunication. I don't think he intended any harm and truly wanted to ensure you fully understood the ramifications.The situation was compounded by the fact that your husband was the first one he spoke to and we don't know what was said there. I wish you much hatzlacha and hope the test brings you menuchas hanefesh.

But why is that his place? His job is to inform patients of medical ramifications, not religious ones. Ramifications according to halacha are complicated, because generally there is more than one opinion.