Peach Magazine - Don't force your ideas on everyone else

amother

Wed, May 07 2014, 11:00 pm

amother wrote:

are you telling me THIS is a lie
http://www.southmilwaukeenow.c......html

Or are you telling me its true but theres still no link and no proof all it has to do with is living out on the farm
Anti-vaxers are usually health conscious people, with a diet healthier than most.
but anti-vaxers will not credit diet alone for the statistics of autism among the amish.
an anti vaxer will not be terribly upset if their child ate some non-organic food, but they will regard vaccination as a much bigger player in this game.
Kindly read the link I provided. Perhaps you will say the info in the link is just a lie.
I wouldn't .

Still no response.
I'd like to see some of you pro-vaxers read the article in the link and tell me what they think of it.

Just a Lie perhaps?
or will you say the amish are full of ASD like the rest of us but for some reason we cant find them.
I've seen another journalist go to amishtown too just to check on this and he came back with the same findings. I'll post that too if anyone needs a second article as well.

out-of-towner

Wed, May 07 2014, 11:04 pm

amother wrote:

The Amish also don't drive. Perhaps autism is caused by the amount of CO2 in the air.

Scrabble123

Wed, May 07 2014, 11:05 pm

amother wrote:

Many Amish do vaccinate. There are Amish with Autistic children. The Amish would be less like to seek medical help to diagnose children with ASD 1. Less involvement with doctors 2. Social life: they have different standards and may not realize something requires evaluation and do not necessarily know what to look for. Again, is the only thing that the Amish do differently vaccinations? Come on.

goodmorning

Wed, May 07 2014, 11:24 pm

amother wrote:

He apparently missed about 25 of them. Rate of autism in Amish communities was estimated at 1 in 271 children -- not as high as the national average but not nonexistent either. See this study: https://imfar.confex.com/imfar......html

And the second half -- that the Amish do not vaccinate -- is not necessarily true either. This study found that 85% of Amish parents had vaccinated some of their children with at least one vaccination.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21708796

And again, even it it would be true that a) the Amish don't vaccinate and b) there are no autistic Amish children, a does not necessarily cause b. We're back to correlation and causation.

amother

Wed, May 07 2014, 11:42 pm

goodmorning wrote:

She. Not he!

amother

Thu, May 08 2014, 12:13 am

amother wrote:

Sigh. As I said maybe 20 pages ago, the Amish do have children with autism. See studies I posted already. And they do vaccinate. Ditto.

Repeating lies doesn't make them true.

Oh, and shockingly enough, my life does not revolve around responding to your increasingly silly arguments. I had to feed my kids.

amother

Thu, May 08 2014, 12:18 am

out-of-towner wrote:

The Amish also don't drive. Perhaps autism is caused by the amount of CO2 in the air.

Actually many Amish do drive farm vehicles. And they are more than willing to be passengers in their "English" neighbors' cars.

vintagebknyc

Thu, May 08 2014, 12:24 am

and also at the end of the day I've yet to be given real links to studies--I was provided real links to doctors, who seem like crazy people, but I'll address that tomorrow as I'm far too tired to do so right now.

suffice it to say that until I'm presented with a doctor who's written a piece for pub-med, new england journal, etc etc, I remain unconvinced. websites like "angryvegan" and "naturallife" (just make believe, too tired to look them up, but most should know what I mean) don't give me any info I believe. NYT, washpo, sun-times. something that's not a quote unquote "natural" website. do you not understand there's a reason they've provided only opinion and not trialed fact? doesn't that make you angry, watching those you believe in being bashed because they've not been accepted by the rest of the medical community? that would give me pause...

bedtime

chaiz

Thu, May 08 2014, 3:47 am

MaBelleVie wrote:

Dolly, researchers are still not sure where autism stems from. There are genetic cases, but many are not. It is nothing at all like blue eyes.

Yes, researchers are still not sure about the causes of autism. But it does look like there is a huge genetic component involved. I just recently watched a TED video of a geneticist talking about it. It is on the long side, but she explains it well, I think.
Web Page Name Wendy Chung-Ted Talk

MaBelleVie

Thu, May 08 2014, 7:41 am

chaiz wrote:

Full disclosure: no time to watch that now Smile

Do you mean genetic as in, caused by a gene? Or as in, inherited? Because while I agree that most of the research is focused on discovering the genetic basis, it would be news to me that most cases of autism are due to inherited genes, a la blue eyes.

chaiz

Thu, May 08 2014, 7:44 am

MaBelleVie wrote:

Full disclosure: no time to watch that now Smile

My understanding is that it is genetic and not hereditary. I will re watch. But even though genetics play a huge role, it is not the whole story. Paternal age at time of conception, for example, plays a role.
Another interesting point she brings up is that there is a spike of diagnoses for autism after the ADA was passed.

MaBelleVie

Thu, May 08 2014, 7:52 am

Right, my response to dolly was based on her assertion that an autistic child is born to two parents with the autism gene. She compared it to eye color. In fact, there is no evidence to support that theory in the vast majority of cases.

5*Mom

Thu, May 08 2014, 7:59 am

amother wrote:

I've seen another journalist go to amishtown too just to check on this and he came back with the same findings. I'll post that too if anyone needs a second article as well.

(Oh, L-rd, whyamIdoingthiswhyamIdoingthiswhyamIdoingthis)

Uh huh, I'm sure all the open-to-the-public Amish families rolled out the red carpet to a strange journalist and allowed him to take a medical and developmental census of their children. And that would be a very scientific study. And there is only one amishtown (sic).

chaiz

Thu, May 08 2014, 8:15 am

MaBelleVie wrote:

Right, she says there is no one autism gene; as a matter of fact there can be 200-400 genes that can be causing autism. They are starting to figure out which genes etc. are involved in the development of autism. And it is not hereditary from what the research shows us.

Think1st

Thu, May 08 2014, 9:04 am

5*Mom wrote:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/L.....ation

See how many States have Amish residents

Pretending something doesn't exist won't make it disappear !

Lady Bug

Thu, May 08 2014, 9:24 am

Think1st wrote:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_U.S._states_by_Amish_population

See how many States have Amish residents

Pretending something doesn't exist won't make it disappear !

I think you missed 5*'s sarcasm, unless you are now playing devil's advocate? Either way, your link supports the fact that it makes no sense to base the rate of autism/vaccination in the Amish community on the words of a lone journalist who visited just one Amish town. I think you should go live with the Amish. That way you will have less chances of contracting Autism yourself :shudder:

chaiz

Thu, May 08 2014, 9:25 am

5*Mom wrote:

Uh huh, I'm sure all the open-to-the-public Amish families rolled out the red carpet to a strange journalist and allowed him to take a medical and developmental census of their children. And that would be a very scientific study. And there is only one amishtown (sic).

Totally off topic, but I see sic often and do not know what means. Can you define what it means?

Think1st

Thu, May 08 2014, 9:36 am

Think1st wrote:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gardasil

http://www.medscape.com/viewarticle/731407

Gardasil targets only 4 HPV strains. 6, 11, 16 and 18

However HPV strains 16, 18, & 45 cause 94% of cervical cancers

8 HPV types cause more than 90% of all cervical cancers worldwide

1. So there are many more strains that cause cancer not targeted by the shot including strain # 45, & we have no idea if it may cause you to get more of the other strains

2. 10's of death's & 1,000's of injury reports from the vax http://www.cdc.gov/vaccinesafe......html

3. ask any Isreali frum or traditional woman they do not take HPV shot. Ask any bikur cholim org if they ever dealt with a frum cervical cancer case

June 2006 through December 2008

23,000,000 doses ,3 per person =7,666,666 people got the shot
12,424 adverse reactions reported =1 in 617
6% serious reaction 1 in in 10,284

That is assuming all case get reported if only 10% gets reported or 1% you do the math

2012 It only gets better hpvshot death toll over nearing 200

http://sanevax.org/hpv-vaccine.....2012/

Last edited by Think1st on Thu, May 08 2014, 9:58 am; edited 2 times in total