When I asked for Shabbos hospitality, told "stay in hot

Ima2NYM_LTR

Wed, Jul 21 2010, 8:32 pm

To finish answering both threads, because now there are 2, almost identical threads, I will cut and paste my final result in both threads.

I called back the Rabbi of another shul that I had spoken to alst week. He had been very nice and explained that they were a small shul, and that weekend most of their community would be out of town for a simcha, but if I had any more issues, I should call him back.

I called him back today and explained I had no luck. he asked me if I was willing to stay by chabad, which I was. he gave me the name and number of a chabad Rabbi I had not previously found online. I thanked him and hung up.

AS SOON as I called the Rebbetzen offered me a place, even before I finished my story - no problems! (I had assumed she would set me up with someone else, but she offered to let me stay with her directly) Later I looked them up and finally found out about them online, now that I had a name. Turns out they run a Jewish outreach center and right on their main page it says that people should call them for Shabbos hospitality!!!!!!!!

So why couldnt the 1st Rabbi just have said "Im sorry I cannot help, but Rabbi X often has guests, you can call him" ? Thats all I was asking for.

de_goldy

Wed, Jul 21 2010, 11:05 pm

I think you need to realize that even bringing your own blankets andmatrasses and helping with costs - it is still a HUGE imposition on someone, and it is not necessary. It is a VACATION. Why expect someone to go out of their way to accommodate your vacation because you would rather not drive back or stay in a hotel? I mean, seriously. In fact, I think someone dragging mattresses and bedding into my house would be MORE of an imposition than just using mine. But again, I would never expect or ask someone to host me for my vacation.

shanie5

Wed, Jul 21 2010, 11:08 pm

My parents spent 4 years traveling the country in an RV. They asked for shabbos hospitality many times. They recieved anywhere from a place to sleep and eat, to nearby hotels and a place to eat, to a place to park their RV and "plug in" with family to eat by. I have not once heard of them being told "If u can afford an RV, u dont need us to feed u!!"

They made lots of friends this way-and also shared recipes-my potato kugel comes from their travels in phoenix. My dad is an electrician and also very handy-people everywhere ended up benefitting from his advice or help.

HindaRochel

Wed, Jul 21 2010, 11:09 pm

This isn't an imposition, it is a request if there is space. If one can't the answer is no. I can't. One doesn't need to list a long list of reasons why and one really should not. "Just no, I'm sorry, wish I could help but can't. " If one knows of someone who can help then give that name as a suggestion.

This isn't coming to someone's door, knocking and asking if one can stay the night.

Ima2NYM_LTR

Wed, Jul 21 2010, 11:12 pm

HindaRochel wrote:

thank you

de_goldy

Wed, Jul 21 2010, 11:14 pm

Ima2NYM_LTR wrote:

HindaRochel wrote:

thank you

I don't see that the Rabbi did anything wrong here. He explained the situation to you and you are now freaking out about it - that is the problem. You do not sound like you were "just asking". You sound like you were very much expecting.

Mitzvahmom

Wed, Jul 21 2010, 11:35 pm

YESHASettler wrote:

For all those saying 'stay in a hotel for Shabbat', IMO asking for hospitality is more about wanting to spend Shabbat in a Shabbasdik atmosphere, having a Minyan, etc. than being able to afford a hotel for a weekend.

when we were vacationing at my (non-frum) in laws one summer in CT, we could have stayed at their house over Shabbat. But it meant my husband wouldn't have had a Minyan and we would have been in a house that wouldn't be Shomer Shabbat.

Personally, we had a better time staying with the community we got in touch with (IIRC it was West Hartford, CT) who were very welcoming.

west hartford is the warmest most welcoming community out there... I miss them so much!!

BTW my husband and I now live in LA and are always looking for guests!! It's incredible how difficult it is to find guests..lol

Last edited by Mitzvahmom on Wed, Jul 21 2010, 11:43 pm; edited 1 time in total

HindaRochel

Wed, Jul 21 2010, 11:42 pm

de_goldy wrote:

It wasn't what he said but how he said it.

If he had said "I'm sorry. I really don't think anyone can put you up this Shabbat, our community has many people visiting and most "ba'alie cheseds" are already booked. There is a lovely hotel on "x street" that isn't too expensive and is near "y Shul". There is a grocery store on "z street." You'll be able to get kosher food there. Leave me your cell and if I hear of someone I'll call you. But do come to shul; sometimes there are families that have a bit more room at the table who can invite you for a meal." (Or; we have a community email list; I'll add your name and cell phone number."

This would not take more than a few minutes and while the overall message is factually the same, emotionally it is quite different.

Tamiri

Wed, Jul 21 2010, 11:53 pm

HindaRochel wrote:

We weren't there and didn't hear any of the conversation. It could be that the Rabbi was in pain so he was snippy. It could be that OP was expecting a totally different response, that she "heard" what she did through her shock. In any event, I don't think it's the Rabbi's job to be a concierge. Perhaps he feels that way as well. If so many people are asking for hospitality, there should be a hotline. All the Rabbi would have to do is give the phone number, not list every Jewish convenience in the city.

energy11

Thu, Jul 22 2010, 12:49 am

de_goldy wrote:

I would never dare to ask...
I find it to be Chutspa to ask, and I'm surprised you are putting this thread...
It's like you can't accept his answer (even though you keep saying that you only asked "if")

COME ON, GROW UP! THEY'RE STRANGERS!
THEY DON'T OWE YOU ANYTHING JUST BECAUSE YOU ARE A JEWISH PRINCESS!!

Don't claim that a Rabbi should make a Mitsva for you.
Claim to yourself that you should be more humble and modest.

zipporah

Thu, Jul 22 2010, 4:27 am

I'm really surprised by the differences in opinion on this. Where I'm from (both in the States and in Israel), if someone needs a place for Shabbat, you try and help - very few questions asked, if any. There are many reasons to ask to stay with a family instead of a hotel. It's not just the cost, it's the atmosphere. Before we became Orthodox we walked 2 miles each way to the nearest Conservative shul. But when we got back home the whole atmosphere was not Shabbosdik. Staying one Shabbat in the Orthodox community taught us the difference. Unless the hotel is specifically for Jews, there is no way to recreate the feeling of Shabbat with a family.

Hospitality is a mitzvah. Whle researching the halacha, I found one Rabbi who commented that if you are going to experience a loss, that there is no obligation for hospitality. However, we should all be given the opportunity to choose to fulfill this mitzvah or not. I might find going to a brit at 8 am inconvenient, or I might jump at the chance. If I don't know about the brit, I can't even make a choice. The Rabbi can make an announcement, or keep a list of families who have agreed to be called before hand, or can direct people to Chabad since the Chabad Rabbi has already advertised Shabbat hospitality.

And yes, I'm not the greatest hostess, but I do give people a place to stay if they need if I can. And my friends do, too. If we already have guests or a sick kid, we say no and offer another time. As far as being suspicious of who people are, I can't walk two feet without finding someone who knows someone whom I know. You get a name and a city, and I'm sure you can check bonafides if you wanted to.

As an aside, I asked DH what he would do in this situation. He said that he probably wouldn't have scheduled camping to end at such an inconvenient time to begin with... but if the circumstances called for it, he'd ask for hospitality first, just to be able to get together with a chevra. But then again, he davens Carlebach, so what can you expect?

EveMotorcycle

Thu, Jul 22 2010, 4:46 am

Wow, who would have thought such a thread to be so explosive!!!

I've been forced by circumstance to be in strange cities more than once for Shabbat. Several times for work related issues, and a couple times when taking my children back and forth from visitation to their father. I ask for hospitality, and I have usually been able to find someone who can help.

There are few things worse than being stuck in a strange city, in a strange hotel, for Shabbos. And, if you are in a place where there are very few Frum families, you probably won't find an abundance of Kosher food, and appropriate hotels within walking distance of the shul.

Having said this, I always make a really big effort to make sure I am not traveling over shabbos, but when this cannot be avoided, I am glad people are willing to open their homes to me.

hila

Thu, Jul 22 2010, 4:57 am

I have to add a word here....

I wrote to OP asking something about her town and nearby ones.... and withing 2 minutes she had invited dh and me for Shabbat !!

So maybe she is holding everyone else to her own wonderful standards.

Thanks OP - we are very grateful and look forward to seeing you in October beH

Any other imamothers in her town - please say hi on Parshat Noach Smile

Inspired

Thu, Jul 22 2010, 6:30 am

hila wrote:

That's nice that she has the privilege to be able to do that. She has no right to expect others to also.

Inspired

Thu, Jul 22 2010, 6:31 am

hila wrote:

That's nice that she has the privilege to be able to do that. She has no right to expect others to also.

zipporah

Thu, Jul 22 2010, 7:25 am

Inspired wrote:

hila wrote:

That's nice that she has the privilege to be able to do that. She has no right to expect others to also.

People don't have the right to expect Tzedekah either (except on Purim, I think) but you're not supposed to make someone feel bad for asking. Give or don't.

Inspired

Thu, Jul 22 2010, 7:31 am

zipporah wrote:

Inspired wrote:

hila wrote:

That's nice that she has the privilege to be able to do that. She has no right to expect others to also.

People don't have the right to expect Tzedekah either (except on Purim, I think) but you're not supposed to make someone feel bad for asking. Give or don't.

I think those in real need have every right to expect the community to help them. Going on vacation willingly putting yourself in need of other's help cannot be compared to needing tzeddakah. I'm also still missing what the rabbi said that was so horrible.