The insanity of cooking suppers for someone who had a baby

ora_43

Thu, Mar 14 2019, 4:32 pm

southernbubby wrote:

I don't see anyone saying that nobody should do it. Nobody should be pressured to do it.

I think part of the problem is that if the community sees it as important, pressure is almost a given. For some people, just getting the call to say "hi can you please make a meal for so-and-so?" is already so much pressure that they feel like they can't say no.

I do think it's a shame if people feel pressured, and it's ridiculous if people feel like they have to make multi-course meals. The main thing is often cooking for the older kids at home! How often do kids even appreciate fancy meals like that?? I've cooked for pp women in my community a bunch of times, and the meals that people mentioned repeatedly that they loved were: 1. soup (nothing else, just a big pot of chicken noodle soup), 2. tuna patties (with rice, lovingly prepared by my rice cooker). If/when I cook for someone again iy"H it's going to be something simple like that, and I won't feel bad about it for a second.

amother

Cerulean

Thu, Mar 14 2019, 6:12 pm

ora_43 wrote:

This is why it was so much easier when my community switched over to online meal trains. A general WhatsApp message is sent out and each woman could privately view the request and available dates and decide if it's something she could do. If it didn't get filled up, the organizer sends out another group message and anyone who was on the fence may choose then to sign up. But no one gets into a situation of being directly asked.

SixOfWands

Thu, Mar 14 2019, 6:34 pm

ora_43 wrote:

We do emails.

Quote:

So-and-so had a baby, or is sitting shiva, or whatever, and we're arranging meals. Go to takethemameal.com to sign up for meals. There are __ adults and __ kids. Please remember that Malka has a nut allergy, and Tzvi is a vegetarian.

There's some pressure, I suppose, but not as much as talking on the phone.

amother

Bronze

Thu, Mar 14 2019, 8:40 pm

amother wrote:

I think it's important that people are self sufficient. It's nice to have help when you NEED it.
If 2 adults decide to have a baby, I hope they know that there will be a birth, the woman will need to rest and the family still needs to eat *gasp*.
Once the woman finds out she's pregnant, she has 7-8 months to prepare for this birth and the 2 weeks after. She's also hopefully not a single mom and has a husband who should care enough about hair wife and possibly kids to ask if he can cook sometimes.
If I ask someone for help it's 1. My husband , if he can't do it 2. My parents or siblings, 3. My friends and 4. Neighbours.
It's really not my neighbours problem, that I decided to have a baby and didn't prepare for it. That's my opinion. I have 14 and I've gotten food from neighbours over the years but I've always made it clear that I cook in advance and my husband cooks aswell.
What I like to do for my friends when they are sick or have babies, I invite their kids over for dinner, so the mother can actually rest.
Also if I know someone is super overwhelmed, had a complete bed rest pregnancy etc. Then they need food obviously. That's a need. Not someone who just couldn't care less, because why should I, everyone will send food.

Please don't give tzedakah.

"If 2 adults decide to get married, I hope they know that there will be children, there will be expenses, and the family will need money *gasp*.
Once they get married, they have at least 9 months to prepare for this impending expense of having a family. They are probably also not geirim and have family that should care enough to offer financial support."

I'm just requoting your words so that you can realize how you come across.

People can fall on hard times, so they may benefit from tzedakah.

Couples having babies can have situations that is out of their control to be independent.

And even if not, what's so wrong with offering a warm meal to a recovering mother? I'm must be super dense, because I'm not getting this thread at all.

amother

Maroon

Thu, Mar 14 2019, 8:54 pm

It sounds to me like the complaint started with being expected to send 5 course meals just because someone had a baby when we don't cook that way for our own families.
Maybe instead of saying that we don't need to send meals we need to restructure the expectations of what those meals look like. You should be able to send the same thing your family is eating.
Personally, I send something with protein, veggie, starch. Sometimes its all in 1 dish like a quiche, sometimes its 3 different dishes, but it's generally whatever I'm making for us, just make more. And if I'm at a stage where my family is eating frozen food for every meal that week, then I don't sign up to bring a meal.

amother

Navy

Thu, Mar 14 2019, 9:13 pm

so I'm in the camp of we try to be independent and don't like being a burden on the community. That being said- I had a baby this year. We knew my dh didn't get paternity leave. I arranged for my mil to come stay with us. She stayed for two weeks which is quite generous. When people asked if they could arrange meals I told them that she was coming. I got a number of offers. after she left I still wasn't feeling so well. turned out I was low in iron. I asked a friend who had offered to arrange meals if I could take her up on her offer. I told her I didn't want to make anyone feel like they had to but since people offered here's a list of those who offered. I was so appreciative of getting those meals. Yes I could have figured something out, my dh could have picked up takeout the night before ( would have been too late if it was that night) but I really appreciated the gesture, it was very helpful especially when I felt so crummy. I really don't think people felt put upon because I made it clear to the arranger that I would rather fend for myself then know that people were being pressured in to cooking for me. I think there is way to do it so that people can offer instead of being put on the spot.

amother

Lemon

Thu, Mar 14 2019, 11:05 pm

I am not sure if this thought was mentioned in the 27 pages of responses, here is another perspective.

I have received pp meals for my last two kids and not for the previous kids. Sure I managed with my first with no meals, I made the quickest and easiest meals for them and I myself would fill myself up on whatever food was available that can be eaten and prepared with one hand - which most of the times is cookies or some other junk. Needless to say I felt miserable.

When I received meals , I was able to eat a nutritious meal and the leftovers for lunch the next day.

My husband works full time and I have no family in town- these postpartum meals (and they were simple meals, main starch and veggi) made me feel so much better which naturally made a much smoother recovery.

If you don’t want to cook for someone pp- dont.

Life is a cycle- sometimes you are in the giving end and at times be on the receiving end- I hope to always be able to be on the giving end

amother

Oak

Thu, Mar 14 2019, 11:26 pm

Wow, this is a long thread, that started a few yrs ago. Didn’t read all the pages. All I can say is a BIG THANK YOU to my amazing community for providing me meals after having my babies. After baby #1 I was so overwhelmed and I had a Pesach baby too. My community brought meals for 2 weeks and we were so grateful.

With baby #2 the community brought me meals for 5 weeks! But I had a crazy situation where both my husband and I were hospitalized when I gave birth and then I ended up being hospitalized again when the baby was less than a week old. Then my FIL passed away right after that. It was a crazy time. I can’t tell you how much I appreciated all the meals provided. And I absolutely loved the simple meals. Mac and cheese and pizza are always a hit in my household.

I’m now in a position where I’m *sometimes* able to provide meals back to other community members. I only offer to make if I’m up to it. If my schedule is too busy or I’m too overwhelmed I just say no.

amother

Purple

Fri, Mar 15 2019, 12:00 am

When I had my csections (didn't tell all my neighbors it was a C) I really appreciated when suppers where sent over (though When asked if I wanted I always said no, I hate bothering people) .Most of the days I cooked myself, but the days that I did get supper, where such a big help; Physically I was able to focus on my healing and took it easier that day; Mentally, I felt like there was no pressure and my new mommy sleepless brain was put at ease.

amother

Amber

Fri, Mar 15 2019, 12:19 am

Having also been the recipient of this great chesed, I deem it an extremely great chesed - I still remember each meal that was given and I appreciated every single one of them - the simpler, the fancier, the very plentiful, the just enough. A new baby (first or after other children) is such a difficult transition for the family and when the community shows their care in this way, it is extremely special. Like any other chesed, a person should only do it if they can at this point in their lives. But there is no doubt, this is a very great chesed!

amother

Crimson

Fri, Mar 15 2019, 4:22 am

I also don't get this thread.
If someone doesn't want to or can't then don't make a meal.
There is no debate that a neighbor bringing a meal, any simple meal, makes life easier.
Sometimes a Mom can barely get up from the couch for those first few days or week. Sometimes, even planning which tin to defrost and adding a salad (which means shopping for fresh veggies) is too much.
Even if the Mom is feeling OK, knowing there is one thing off her mind for a week or two is unbelievable.
I've had meals after kids, meals during shiva. A friend and her husband even came over one evening with bags and bags of groceries. They didn't ask what we needed but brought all the basics: cereal, eggs, milk, bread, pasta, grains, cheese, chicken. They wouldn't accept payment. I was moved to tears by their generosity and compassion. They were a tremendous inspiration to me as well to pay it forward.
Why remove these opportunities to build positive relationships and doing chesed?

lefty1

Fri, Mar 15 2019, 6:25 am

amother wrote:

Agree. And perhaps the issue is the social pressure/ego telling people they have to make fancy multiple course meals. I think that is what needs to be changed, not the concept of taking someone food to help them out. There are plenty of simple, well rounded meals that would certainly be appreciated. Doesn't need to be over the top

amother

Chartreuse

Fri, Mar 15 2019, 8:16 am

amother wrote:

After years of cooking for my own family, I detest cooking. I ignore the meal train emails. In order to "do my bit" for the pp mom, I usually text her offering to do carpool whenever she needs it, something I am happy to do. No guilt, and everyone is happy.

southernbubby

Fri, Mar 15 2019, 8:33 am

Also in these lengthy debates about cooking for PP mothers someone brings up that the food often goes straight to the trash if the cleanliness or Kashrus of the donor's home are not acceptable to the recipient.

Another issue is that babies sometimes come in clusters so that it's feast or famine; several weeks without a birth and then several at the same time. Many women simply can't handle or afford to make too many meals in a short period of time.

I agree that it is a good idea to have people offer other forms of help, especially if the baby is a boy.

amother

Cerulean

Fri, Mar 15 2019, 9:08 am

southernbubby wrote:

Seriously? People ask/ agree to accept meals and then throw out the ones that don't meet their hygiene or kashrus standards? That's so sickening. If you have high enough standards that this happens "often," you should politely decline meals and figure it out yourself. I can't fathom knowing that someone went to all that trouble to prepare a meal for you family and you dump it. Unbelievable.

(I know you're not referring to yourself, sb)

southernbubby

Fri, Mar 15 2019, 9:30 am

amother wrote:

But remember, now that the meal trains are public online, anyone can contribute. The benefit of someone making calls is that they will only contact people who the recipient feels comfortable receiving from.
I see meal trains on a Chabad WhatsApp group with probably a couple hundred members and many maybe don't know each other.
There is nothing wrong with making a meal for someone who you don't know but the recipient has to decide if they are willing to accept it.
As you said, it's a horrible waste of this and money if it is immediately disposed of or given to the cleaning lady.

ectomorph

Fri, Mar 15 2019, 9:34 am

southernbubby wrote:

If you don't like it you don't need to participate but you don't need a make up things that don't happen.

I've never seen such a bunch of Debbie downers trying to stop people from doing something that really helps postpartum women prevent postpartum depression and brings communities together

amother

Seafoam

Fri, Mar 15 2019, 9:39 am

About the tossing of food- if it is a community what's app or posting but someone whose kashrus or cleanliness you don't trust offered, you don't need to toss it. You can always call the coordinator to call them in advance and say you have it worked out for that night and end up not needing it etc. there has to be a way to fix it in advance. Why waste the food and time of the giver?

bigsis144

Fri, Mar 15 2019, 9:58 am

All I can say is that every time I see this thread title, my brain translates “the insanity of cooking suppers for someone who had a baby” to “the insanity of receiving suppers after having a baby” as if needing help at that time is insane, unnecessary or to use imamother’s favorite phrase “entitled”.

This is the #1 reason why imamother is bad for my mental health... the culture of “if you ever need help, you are spoiled and weak. You can only be a receiver if you are literally at the end of your rope.”

My baby is 4 months old and receiving meals was SO appreciated, no matter how simple or repetitive. We also have an email meal train to keep from putting people on the spot. I got to meet members of my community who had names for but couldn’t match to a face. It was so nice to feel cared for!

With all this obsession with self-sufficiency, how can communities have any cohesion?? Isn’t that middas S’dom? “What’s mine is mine and what’s yours is yours”? Or is one only allowed to receive once they have proven themselves to not actually be in need of anything??

Last edited by bigsis144 on Fri, Mar 15 2019, 10:03 am; edited 1 time in total

ra_mom

Fri, Mar 15 2019, 9:58 am

southernbubby wrote:

That doesn't sound accurate. Nobody who has stricter kashrus requirements than the community would ask for a meal train.