Moshiach is here! (***Pretend Play)

southernbubby

Wed, Dec 27 2017, 5:48 pm

amother wrote:

I guessed it says something about me being in an utterly galus-dik mindset because my instinctive, immediate, pre-conscious-thought emotional reaction is dread.

No matter what kind of teshuva I do every year, how much I understand certain things are wrong, that’s at a personal level. But I can’t imagine a world without high fantasy books full of crazy pantheons/mythology or ridiculous haute couture magazines or time-wasting cat memes, or apikorsus as an *option*.

So many people say that was makes Judaism different and special and unique is that “questions are welcome” and our very name means “wrestles with God”. I identify so much more with that than with any emuna peshuta.

A world without war or sickness would be wonderful, but it’s the mass lobotomization of the world’s population that scares me.

If such a world is possible while still having Bechira (which people seem to postulate), then why didn’t Hashem make that world in the first place???

Sorry to derail. I basically think about Moshiach like I do about death - do my best in this world and don’t think about the future cuz that’s not “me” as I understand mySelf who will be experiencing it.

But this is why the world has had to evolve so that the world is ready to accept moral choices. For example, we now see slavery as evil but it hasn't been that long ago that it was commonplace. We feel that no child should ever die of malnutrition. Maybe eventually governments will enact policies to see that this doesn't happen. Then the world will have evolved into a world where we don't accept preventable situations that cause death.

amother

Burlywood

Wed, Dec 27 2017, 5:56 pm

southernbubby wrote:

Oh I certainly hope and pray that the world will progress and evolve for the better! And it has been, Baruch HaShem!

I just hope whiplash from abrupt change of direction won’t kill me physically or mentally

southernbubby

Wed, Dec 27 2017, 6:12 pm

amother wrote:

Oh I certainly hope and pray that the world will progress and evolve for the better!

But (a) too fast and the whiplash’ll hurt too much and (b) I still see pluralism as a value

Well I have been reading about how America is now "post-Xtian" and that without a common main religion and culture, a country resorts to tribalism rather than unity. Millennials are not centering their lives around a religious belief and many have no belief at all. This is happening not only to those who are raised X-tian but also to Jews. Pluralism takes place only if there actually are numerous values. Tribalism is the opposite of pluralism in that it says that we have to protect our way, rather than broaden out so that there is room for all ways of expression. Possibly, however, the weakening of X-tianity and religious neutralization may be a necessary pre-cursor to the coming of Moshiach.

I don't know if Moshiach will mean that everyone will suddenly and automatically all have the same views but it does mean that spirituality will permeate everything so that we will see the real reasons for everything that happens while at the moment we can't. Let's say that we are given 2 options for a tzedukah donation and both are equal in that they are both not relatives or both from our town, etc. but spiritually one may be superior to the other and we don't know which one that one is. After Moshiach comes, these choices will become more clear and moral issues will become more clear. I have never heard, however, that people will walk around like mindless robots. The Resurrection of the dead won't be immediate:http://www.chabad.org/library/article_cdo/aid/108400/jewish/The-End-of-Days.htm

This states that Moshiach will end the choice of evil but our choices will be between good and better.:http://www.chabad.org/library/article_cdo/aid/832728/jewish/Free-Choice-When-Moshiach-Comes.htm

PinkFridge

Thu, Dec 28 2017, 7:33 am

amother wrote:

Don't sweat this. Here's my take, based on what I've learned:
We'll still have bechira but it will be blunted. Chazal say that all the yomim tovim will be batul but Purim. I was taught that it doesn't mean that we'll no longer celebrate the yomim tovim. But the regalim are connected to nissim geluyim. We will have such clarity that we will so overwhelmingly appreciate the nissim nistarim that the regalim will pale in comparison.

As chatai ani mazkir hayom but I listened to secular music. Still do sometimes. But when we get the BHM"K back we'll have incredibly new experiences. We'll get back the asor, which is based on ten, as opposed to the octave which is based on the natural scale of seven. (Yeah, that prefix oct. But the 8 is a repetition of 1.) I can't wait to hear the Leviim.

As far as the uniqueness and majesty of wrestling with G-d you're in good company. Odom Harishon also thought it would be better for us to wrestle with an internal yetzer hara. But if questions are welcome, don't we want the bet answers?

The most important thing is that kavod Shamayim will be revealed. We won't have to live our lives witnessing the daily bizyonos the RBSh'O is soveil. I'm psyching myself up for that.

southernbubby

Thu, Dec 28 2017, 9:04 am

So maybe it would be similar to Bubby who tries to take her medicine without her glasses or tries to drive at night when she can't see.

Moshiach will provide both the light and the glasses so that we don't stumble around in the dark, not sure where we are supposed to be or what we are supposed to do.

PinkFridge

Thu, Dec 28 2017, 7:00 pm

southernbubby wrote:

they will get paid really well so they will be happy to do it, same as the uber drivers

I've been thinking about this.
Since the world will be running on some natural level people will have to earn a living.
I don't think I want to outsource our Israeli taxi drivers. They're too precious.

southernbubby

Thu, Dec 28 2017, 7:43 pm

PinkFridge wrote:

They are going to work in Klei Kodesh as shadchanim.

PinkFridge

Thu, Dec 28 2017, 8:36 pm

southernbubby wrote:

They are going to work in Klei Kodesh as shadchanim.

I'm sure there's at least one Tzivia Ehrlich-Klein story in which they already do Very Happy

Jewishfoodie

Thu, Dec 28 2017, 8:37 pm

Guys, lighten up. This is imaginary and just for entertainment purposes. So run with it.. OP is right. We don't know but we can, with our limited knowledge, imagine...

Moshiach tries to come into the US. They ask for a valid ID and passport. And they let him know his donkey cannot enter the country. He reaches for his shofar to alert the Jews. Mayhem ensues. They dont know what he's reaching for and assume it's a weapon. The shofar is safely detained and catalogued as a weapon of unknown origin. Poor Moshiach. He calls upon his trusty eagle, only to be overrun by 1000 insane Peta members and must listen to dumb chants about the endangered species and how they must be protected and, no way are they letting anyone SIT on one. ("you're eagles! Not seagulls. We'll save you! We're trying!" Those of u who shlag kapparos might recognize a similar chant)

Moshiach gets annoyed. Finally. He calls upon the lightening. The thunder. The rain. The snow. So the city starts salting and sending reporters to record rain drops and sending out cops to hand every single person on the palisades a personalized ticket for looking at another lane in the rain. And while reporters report lightning in the sky, the Jews slowly hear what they've been waiting for and praying for for so long... The call of Moshiach. And then the Whatsapps start.....

southernbubby

Thu, Dec 28 2017, 8:56 pm

Jewishfoodie wrote:

Jewishfoodie, Donkeys are Democrats and the Moshiach is a Republican for heaven's sake!!! I know you want us all to lighten up but we already know that Moshiach is a Republican who supported Trump who commuted the sentence of SMR. And Moshiach needs a motorcade with secret service protection. And flying on an eagle, come on Jewishfoodie, Moshiach will fly in Marine One, with Trump.

PinkFridge

Thu, Dec 28 2017, 9:00 pm

While I believe it is quite possible that Moshiach is a Republican Chassidishe rebbe, as per your posts, I am also open to the possibility that he is not American nor Chassidishe. Lotsa possibilities Wink

(But doesn't his sitting on a donkey mean subjugating all the donkey stands for?)

Jewishfoodie

Thu, Dec 28 2017, 9:01 pm

SouthernBubby, you can't be beat! Rolling Laughter

I did try, though... I'm just not as good as you Not worthy

southernbubby

Thu, Dec 28 2017, 9:05 pm

Jewishfoodie wrote:

SouthernBubby, you can't be beat! Rolling Laughter

I did try, though... I'm just not as good as you Not worthy

Tootsie pie, I have been around a lot longer than you have.

southernbubby

Thu, Dec 28 2017, 9:11 pm

PinkFridge wrote:

(But doesn't his sitting on a donkey mean subjugating all the donkey stands for?)

You know Pink Fridge, you are right, and by sitting on the donkey, all of NY will become a Republican state. Even if Moshiach is neither American or Chassidishe, Bibi and Trump will have to be involved because the new Jerusalem embassies that all of these countries are building will have to have Moshiach's quarters and you know what else? If he is Sephardic, it could mean that we will all get to eat rice on Pesach, for as long as Pesach will still be a chag!!! Think how nice that would be.

PinkFridge

Fri, Dec 29 2017, 7:38 am

southernbubby wrote:

Like I wrote was it upthread here? I was taught that the chazal that the other yamim tovim will become batul besides Purim means that they will SEEM secondary to Purim because our appreciation of nes nistar and the Divine jigsaw puzzle will be greater than appreciation for nissim geluyim, like what led to Pesach. But we'll still have yom tov.

amother

Coffee

Sat, Dec 30 2017, 4:44 pm

(I haven't read the whole thread, so apologies if this has already been posted)

http://haruth.com/Jewish/JSMoshiachsHat.html

PinkFridge

Sun, Dec 31 2017, 8:08 am

southernbubby wrote:

Actually, maybe the US will go back to the good old days of mutual respect and bipartisanship.
And elephants, used in way by the Greeks, does make one think of all the Greeks stand for. Especially this close to Chanukah.

mandksima

Mon, Jan 01 2018, 2:11 am

amother wrote:

I'm not disputing it, but I'm wondering how the signs moshiach is coming are more obvious now?

Sorry I didn't get to respond earlier. There are lots of shiurim and books on the subject. Some of the explanations have to do with the timeline for the world of 6000 years. We are now in 5778. That leaves 222 years. During that time, moshiach has to come, reign many years, techiat hameitim has to happen. At the 6000 year mark, the world becomes ready for olam haba. We are told in sources that moshiach reigns for 40 years. In the middle of that, the process of techiat hameitim lasts either for 210 years or 214. So, the most years we have left is 222-210 = 12 years left. That is the worst case scenario of Moshiach not coming until the last moment.

We constantly daven that Hashem should speed up the process now like he did in Yitziat mitzrayim. Hashem caused Pharoah to cause more work and suffering for the Jews towards the end in order to be able to give them ability to be saved earlier and move up the geula time. We are entrusted as Jews to do tikkun for the world. That is our job. We bring about tikkun through mitzvot (that's the best way), teshuva (this works too but requires a lot of self sacrifice and work) and suffering (last resort but if we don't do enough of the first two, suffering atones for sin and we can do tikkun olam in this less comfortable way. This is why tzaddikim don't complain about their own suffering. They understand the benefits for themselves but at the same time, daven very strongly for suffering of others to be relieved.)

This is one way to understand suffering as a blessing from Hashem. Of course Hashem wants to avoid it but causing sufferings can bring the geula now faster as well as it did in mitzrayim. Many believe the Holocaust was our last big suffering before the geula just like the last one in Mitzrayim. The complaints of life not being fair raged in Mitzrayim like after the Holocaust but isn't it strange how we never focus on that once they left? Once they were freed, Hashem did countless miracles for them, their enemies destroyed and they crossed the Yam Suf, their sufferings were well understood as part of the geula process. So too, when moshiach comes, we will understand why we suffered so much in this world and how after the geula, it won't be a main focus and no one will be sad or miss their old life. Moshiach will come to bring revealed truth to the world, the truth of Hashem for all to plainly see and the truth of why every single event was perfectly orchestrated in this world in order for it all to come together, be middah kneged middah and bring about the best possible good for us in the end. That is why, even after the horrors of the Holocaust, our generation is plagued with troubles. No one is immune. Everyone has some pekela they are dealing with. Marriage issues, financial trouble, health, children rebelling, abuse, etc. Hashem is speeding up the geula for us so our tikkun can be finished earlier and the perfect life Hashem wanted for us all along will be for us to enjoy. To say we prefer this life because we know it well and are familar with things should be an obvious similarity to the slave mentality in mitzrayim and the 80% who didn't want to leave and died there. Hopefully, everybody will accept the truth and will be saved and not keep their current slave to America mentality. We are slaves to this current world, there's no denying it. We let money run our lives and dictate our happiness. Hashem will open our eyes after Moshaich so we understand everything but our emunah now is to try to have faith in Hashem that even our everyday sufferings are bringing us closer to geula and we need to desire Moshiach and not be too hesitant of the unknown parts of his arrival and reign because we are promised to be thrilled beyond belief just as the slaves were to finally cross the Yam Suf and sing shira after witnessing mind boggling miracles of the makot.

There are lots of signs written that will happen before Moshaich. We have seen almost all of those already. The world is rapidly changing daily. Our last exile, which is Edom (western world) and Yishamael ruling over EY and the world, is coming to a close. This month, amazing changes have come about in Saudi Arabia and now we'll see what happens in Iran. Trump becoming president has enabled a lot of these changes and it was only the hand of Hashem which caused him to become president when all odds were against. The signs are all here, we just have to lose cynicism and look!

Here are a few videos which explain a lot but there so many books and other ones to watch.
How Do I Know Moshiach is Coming? by Rabbu Alon Anava
21st century #26 The Scope of the Geula Process by Rabbi Mendel Kessin (this is #26 in this series but you can watch anything from him on this subject. His breakdown of the 6000 years is mind blowing. 6000 relates to the 6 days of creation, 1000 years is like a day for Hashem. The Friday is the 5000-5999 mark and since we accept Shabbat early, Moshiach is brought before Shabbat. The dawn of Friday matches up with the dawn of enlightenment and the industrial revolution where a lot of light/knowledge was brought into the world. We are now past 12 noon on Friday, 12:39 exactly. It is said that Hashem will bring Moshiach before it is time to daven mincha on Erev Shabbos so we are waiting as early mincha can start!)
The Birth Pains of Moshiach by Rabbi Lawrence Hajioff (he has a whole series he teaches at Stern College, very informative to watch them all)
Moshiach - part 1 by Rabbi Yehoshua Zitron (the whole series of 12 parts is amazing)

Two books off the top of my head are Redemption Unfolding by Alexander Aryeh Mandelbaum and The End of Days by Shmuel Raber.