How many teachers in your school have formal education train

Pickle Lady

Sun, Nov 18 2007, 8:32 am

Ruchel wrote:

Pickle Lady wrote:

I have my own shtick about university degrees most are just there to keep universities making money. BA's are a total waste and just keep people thinking they are smart.

huh, ok... apparently bosses don't agree.
A degree = a better wage. A degree = if they hesitate between you and another guy, they'll hire you.
I can also tell by general culture who has a degree and who hasn't. And university here is free anyway.

I used to think like you until I moved out of my parents house and got my first job. Gettin my first job was the really the eye opener.I actually have a BS in which I actually needed my degree for my job, but I only need a small portion of what I learned for my job. But a BA just shows you went to college but will you really need what you learned in university when you get a job, doubt it? They just hire someone with a degree because its one up on the other applicant.

Clarissa

Sun, Nov 18 2007, 9:07 am

Ruchel wrote:

Quote:

will you really need what you learned in university when you get a job, doubt it?

certainly not. But it's always good to have more knowledge.

I agree 100%. It is such a valuable thing to know more and to be capable of understanding a wide range of topics. Life isn't just about learning to do a particular job, or keep a clean home and raise good children. We are capable of so much more, and it's a shame to waste this gift.

Ruchel

Sun, Nov 18 2007, 9:12 am

Clarissa wrote:

Ruchel wrote:

Quote:

will you really need what you learned in university when you get a job, doubt it?

certainly not. But it's always good to have more knowledge.

that's what I meant. Thanks. I'm always so sad when intelligent people don't get an education because "it's non jewish". I understand that in some circles it's not done, and in other circles it used to be ok but now it's not, but I just don't get it... Gedolim had degrees from universities, read secular books... and now it's non jewish?

amother

Sun, Nov 18 2007, 9:13 am

I am a Preschool director

1) Some Seminaries give a better aducation than others. Some have an excellent education oriented programs.
2) I have a degree in Early childhood ed. It hasn't improved my writing skills.
3)I learned much more from observing very good teachers and student teaching than from any proffessor.
.....and I still quote some of my seminary teachers more than any proffessor
4)Teachers should not be in a classroom w/o any training!
5)We have a range of teachers in our program. I have not found those with multiple degrees to be any better than those with a Seminary background. (Same w/ popularity w/ parents...unfortunately.... some of our most educated teachers are not the most popular)
6)Any first year teacher needs alot of oversight and traing regardless of her background.

I've learned this all the hard way... sorry I wish a degree meant more than it does. It would make hiring and training so much simpler.

Just 1 example: We recently had a substitute teacher in w/ impecable training. (4.0 avg)
She was horrible!

mumoo

Sun, Nov 18 2007, 9:14 am

tzatza wrote:

OP here,

Maybe I was not too clear with my initial post, but in no way do I imply that degree=good teaching skills,

then the questions would be:

Quote:

why isn't it a requirement for all teachers to have good teaching skills?

and that is a very good question.

on a tangent, why don't young girls who take a teaching position commit to a full school year-even after becoming engaged? By us, it's accepted that as soon as she is engaged, she leaves, no matter where in the year they are.

gryp

Sun, Nov 18 2007, 9:16 am

Since the OP mentioned preschool teachers, I'm talking preschool in this discussion.

Especially in the early years of a child, the most important thing is that his teachers are excellent examples of Yiras Shamayim and Midos Tovos. Well-roundedness and correct grammar is not needed for a child to learn that Hashem is watching every move he makes or to have Ahavas Yisroel. Or to learn Parsha and Alef-Beis, and to grow to love Yiddishkeit.

I used to wince at a certain assistants' English in my son's preschool until he was in her class, and her loving personality and the care she showed for my son instantly stopped my wincing.

And having letters after your name certainly does not guarantee you patience when a child spills apple juice, but experience with children does. Patience, tolerance, caring, and fairness, all fall under Midos Tovos.

amother

Sun, Nov 18 2007, 9:16 am

amother wrote:

Just because it didn't ensure that you would have great writing skills, doesn't mean it hasn't helped others.

amother

Sun, Nov 18 2007, 1:17 pm

Pickle Lady wrote:

Writing skills should be learned in elementry and high school not college.

Clearly they're not, if you judge writing skills that I've seen. Nothing wrong with advanced education hopefully reinforcing what people failed to absorb when they were in elementary and high school. Not to mention, there is so much to learn beyond just reading and writing, to impart to young minds.

amother

Sun, Nov 18 2007, 1:47 pm

ignoring the fact that you will make more money with a degree....

- a lot of what is taught in college has nothing to do with teaching
- most of what u need is experience , not gained in college
- teaching is a talent,a degree can't give u that talent
- many of my friends/neighbors got degrees in special ed etc and can't teach to save their life. these frum programs are a waste of time and are actually producing pathetic attempts at teaching
- now on to myself, I am posting as amother bc otherwise Id never say this about myself. I am one of the best teachers in my school of over 1000 kids. I never went to college bc of hashkafa reasons but I do take courses in education, individual classes by professionals, seminars on education etc all the time, but I dont have a degree. All I have is the talent hashem gave me, the knowledge from my personal quest for it, love of my students, and a desire to perfect my skills. I have no letters after my name ; but I must b doing something right.

just an interesting story. I took a professional course (costs 2,000 - school sponsored me) called all kinds of minds/schools attuned, facilitated by the director of p'tach. There I was asked if my degree was in education or child psychology, and when I said neither the director said to me "good for u, that u spent all these years giving to jewish children instead of wasting them in a college classroom. He said that the only incentive he sees is for monetary reasons.

so b'kitzur, training is needed, inherit talent is a must, letters after ur name = mean only that u have a degree not that you are a good teacher.[/list]

tzatza

Mon, Nov 19 2007, 2:37 pm

amother wrote:

My initial post was titled "..Formal education training", not a degree. And I think it is commendable that a teacher is seeking to enrich his experience through ongoing trainings, programs, materials and seminars. Every teacher, with or without degree, should be doing that. And (as with any profession, and especially the one that touches people's lives so directly) inherent talent is a must, as well as patience and love.

MWA44

Tue, Nov 20 2007, 6:18 pm

If I could add my 2 cents here...
I'm sorry to say, let's be realisitic girls! You're right that a formal education may not teach u how to be be good teacher, some have it in them some don't!
BUT PLEASE STOP BEING IN DENIAL: WHY IS IT THAT SCHOOLS WILL MORE QUICKLY HIRE A GIRL WHO HAS A DEGREE, FOR A HEADSTART PROGRAM FOR EXAMPLE, THAN A GR8 TEACHER WHO DOESN'T HAVE A DEGREE?????
We're not discussing who are the best teachers. The reality is, you have a degree, for the same efforts you put in, YOU'LL GET MORE MONEY!
If you don't need the extra money, then good, for you!
I got fed up to see, that girls who were way less talented than I was were paid at least DOUBLE than what I was making, for the same work...Guess what, I sat down, learn the textbooks, passed the test and got my degree: and I HAVE NO REGRETS!
It's all nice Hashkafa, but even Beis Rivkah that preaches girls shouldn't go to college, end having a gr8 interest hiring girls with degrees.
So start using your brain!!!