S/O where is the "I dont vax, AMA" thread???

amother

Burgundy

Sat, Dec 01 2018, 8:07 pm

amother wrote:

I made an intuitive decision not to put seatbelts on my kids in the car and hashem have us intuition for a reason. I use it. But just because my intuition leads me to not seatbelt my kids doesn't mean you shouldn't. If your intuition leads you to not seatbelt ur kids, go there.

I don't rely on other children being seatbelted or someone else crashing into me and killing my kids, yada yada. It's an intuitive decision entirely.
(Yes I'm being sarcastic)

How's this for intuition
I have always been intuitively anti Vax for myself - I remember at 10y begging my mother not to give me the tetanus shot and only reluctantly taking it after a lengthy discussion with the pediatrician
Lo and behold years later I am diagnosed with 3 autoimmune diseases, none of them curable, all chronic. I am part of multiple support groups. One with almost 10,000 members had a recent discussion about vaccinations. Almost all of the comments (except for a literal handful) said they do not take or give vaccines due to being immunocompromised (as I now am with diseases that are least 30% hereditary for my kids)
Tell me where "hishtadlus" even comes into this. For reference, I am that freaky person, even as a little kid, who loves vegetables and never touched snacks or junk. I am the healthiest, crunchiest eater. I've certainly done my hishtadlus for my health. I am currently taking medications that cost thousands of dollars.

amother

Goldenrod

Sat, Dec 01 2018, 8:08 pm

amother wrote:

He was preparing to launch a "safe" vaccine. Definitely had a conflict of interest. Do your research.

This is literally the first time I heard of this. AFAIK he was a gastroenterologist and his findings came about coincidentally in treating his patients for the gut issues. Do you have a source for this?

amother

Linen

Sat, Dec 01 2018, 8:57 pm

amother wrote:

I 100% support people with these issues not being vaccinated. You’re the reason most other people should vaccinate.

amother

Goldenrod

Sat, Dec 01 2018, 9:06 pm

amother wrote:

I 100% support people with these issues not being vaccinated. You’re the reason most other people should vaccinate.

I am not the amother you were responding to, but I am frustrated on her behalf as well as mine.
THanks for your permission and support (sarcasm). Do you realize her issues came out AFTER being vaccinated? Most people only stop vaccinating after the damage is done.

amother

Navy

Sat, Dec 01 2018, 9:26 pm

amother wrote:

She said her issues are genetic. How can they be blamed on vaccines?

amother

Burgundy

Sat, Dec 01 2018, 10:13 pm

amother wrote:

She said her issues are genetic. How can they be blamed on vaccines?

They are not genetic. they came out of the blue (oh the irony that my junk eating family (edit parents and siblings) doesnt have it)
however now that these diseases have been triggered I can pass them on to my kids meaning either thru pregnancy (which makes my illnesses worse) or bc my kids now have a genetic predisposition to them, since they were triggered in me.

amother

Pink

Sat, Dec 01 2018, 10:16 pm

Im not saying that it is impossible that vaccinations have caused deaths and conditions, etc.. But everything I've read here is anecdotal. You cannot say that someone died due to a vaccination because they died the day after they were vaccinated. You also cannot say that conditions you experienced later in life are due to vaccination. My daughters are experiencing issues that doctors really cannot find a cause for. Does this mean that they are due to vaccinations which were given years and years earlier? I suppose there always is a chance, but I wouldn't dream of not vaccinating. There is no proof. People have gotten sick and died of different things from the beginning of time. Why not blame it on plastics, or pollution? You cannot just pick vaccinations as the scapegoat when you are affecting others around you with your decision.

amother

Seafoam

Sat, Dec 01 2018, 10:36 pm

amother wrote:

They are not genetic. they came out of the blue (oh the irony that my junk eating family doesnt have it)
however now that these diseases have been triggered I can pass them on to my kids meaning either thru pregnancy (which makes my illnesses worse) or bc my kids now have a genetic predisposition to them, since they were triggered in me.

You realize you’re making no sense right? I’m sorry you’re sick but your illnesses are either genetic or not make up your mind. Your first rambling post didn’t make sense either.
I’d like to know how many polio survivors you’ve met and whether you’ve ever seen a baby die of whooping cough.

amother

Linen

Sat, Dec 01 2018, 10:39 pm

amother wrote:

Like a PP said, much of the “evidence” of harm from vaccines is anecdotal. Everything under the sun is being blamed on vaccines, but there is no clear evidence of causation.

And while I do believe some individuals may have been harmed by vaccines due to their particular genetic makeup, and I do understand that this may not be known until after the fact, the odds are still better for getting vaccinated, versus letting these diseases run rampant. These families that were unfortunately affected by vaccines would likely be touched in some way by horrible, preventable diseases if no one was vaccinated.

I’ll say again, if anyone knows beforehand that an individual is likely to have a bad reaction, the odds for that individual have changed, and they should now hopefully be able to rely on herd immunity.

amother

Ruby

Sat, Dec 01 2018, 10:44 pm

amother wrote:

"Even before publication of the study, Wakefield was working on patenting his own version of a measles vaccine, which he would sell at a great profit as a supposedly “safe” alternative to the MMR vaccine. The father of one of the children in Wakefield’s study was a cofounder of the planned business that would market this product."
https://www.badgut.org/informa.....myth/

southernbubby

Sat, Dec 01 2018, 10:56 pm

amother wrote:

Pharmaceuticals in general affect different people in different ways so it isn't exactly out of line to blame a recent vaccine any more than suspecting the cleaning woman of stealing if items are missing after she works. The suspicion grows stronger if her other clients have similar experiences. It might be impossible to prove until she gets caught.

The same is with all pharmaceuticals. When something is proven dangerous, it's removed from the shelves but it can sometimes take decades before that happens.

Someday if there is a reliable alternative to vaccines, we might be able to get retrospective answers but at the moment, there's no alternative so it's anybody's guess as to why some of these tragedies are happening and vaccines are just as valid of a guess as any.

amother

Burgundy

Sat, Dec 01 2018, 11:14 pm

amother wrote:

Something triggered it for me.
There is now a genetic predisposition.
If you can't figure out how that works, do some googling.

I didn't say vaccinations directly caused my illnesses, though I can't say that they didn't have a long term effect on my immune system (I suspect a more direct cause was actually back to back antibiotics). I was offering an anecdote for what intuition looks like.

I'm sorry that you don't understand my "ramblings". I'm out.

amother

Jetblack

Sat, Dec 01 2018, 11:20 pm

Just to explain about this generational question: I am old enough to have had measles, mumps, rubella and chicken pox.

One of my children ran a high fever after the DTP. They gave him half doses after that. Another child screamed for 24 hours.

Because of these experiencs, I told my doctor I will not give the next child the pertussis vaccine. He offered me the attenuated (DTaP) version (which at that time was not recommended under a year).

However, even that long ago, I refused everything after the polio, DTP and MMR. I felt it was better to wait a few years than to have my children be guinea pigs. (For instance, did you hear that many people died from the rotavirus vaccine?) I didn't realize that the doctors and CDC would avoid documenting side effects.

Also do you know that the other doctor who had his license revoked along with Andrew Wakefield appealed and was reinstated? And that Wakefield only documented what the other doctor did? And that he didn't appeal due to lack of funds? As far as I am concerned, his studies have not been discredited.

Serachba

Sun, Dec 02 2018, 12:29 am

Floralwhite, would you be willing to create a summary of concepts along with sources, arranged according to 1) GI system as it pertains to 2)immunology and
3)neurology
Also the back and forth "flow" of how one system affects the other. I would appreciate it immensely.
Thanks in advance!!