200 struggling businesses to open tomorrow in Brooklyn

fleetwood

Mon, May 25 2020, 2:15 pm

CiCi wrote:

https://abcnews.go.com/US/wireStory/judge-tosses-coronavirus-restrictions-oregon-governor-70751385

https://www.law.com/texaslawye.....ders/

https://chicago.cbslocal.com/2.....ager/

There are many of these rulings. I'm not interested in googling all day.

In any case, any government who forces their citizens to stay indoors is not a democracy.

These are rulings on procedural issues with the lockdown,not constitutional issues. None of these prove your point.

freilich

Mon, May 25 2020, 2:17 pm

southernbubby wrote:

It frustrates me that the permanent immunity theory is only promoted in the very right wing media. While we all hope that it's true, wouldn't you feel a little bad if someone took your post seriously and it wasn't true? No other media outlet claims to have the answer.

I haven’t read anything about lifelong immunity. But I did read about short term immunity which does make sense. The reason why the left isn’t talking about it, is because they would like for the fear mongering to continue. That gives them more power over the masses.

fleetwood

Mon, May 25 2020, 2:17 pm

amother [ Papaya ] wrote:

All of those cases are going to the state supreme court for a ruling. Because local judges don't want to touch it. So they are passing the buck.

Even if these cases make it to the U.S. Supreme Court they will lose on the constitutional issue. There may be procedural issues with the lockdown in each case,but that's a different situation

southernbubby

Mon, May 25 2020, 2:21 pm

freilich wrote:

Most scientists feel that there is short term immunity and possibly long term immunity but the virus is new so how can anyone know? The left has the LGBT community that has been adversely affected by the lock down so I don't think that it's black and white.

CiCi

Mon, May 25 2020, 2:24 pm

amother [ Papaya ] wrote:

All of those cases are going to the state supreme court for a ruling. Because local judges don't want to touch it. So they are passing the buck.

Ummm...that's not the case at all. In two of the cases the judges RULED against the governers and the other link is about two FEDERAL judges coming out against the governer.

I'm not going back and forth here anymore because frankly the US justice and legal system doesn't interest me much. I can only argue about something when the subject interest me. But I have see many more cases where judges RULED against Democrat power grabbing governors. Again, I'm not going to argue anymore.

No government has a right to shut down businesses indefinitely, even were they not to win in court. Such a government would be an dictatorship.

fleetwood

Mon, May 25 2020, 2:49 pm

CiCi wrote:

Let me give you an example. A murderer goes free,not because he is guilty but because he wasn't read Miranda. In these cases you cited it's the same thing. The lockdown wasn't ruled to be illegal. The procedure in place had legal issues and that's why the governors lost in court. The lockdown was never deemed illegal in any of the cases you cited.

Mama Bear

Mon, May 25 2020, 8:09 pm

ra_mom wrote:

Call your hosiery store over the phone during business hours. I am sure they take credit cards and have a way for you to pick up your bagged order.

thats what they were doing until now!
but with the police showing up suddenly, theyre afraid of even doing this now.
That's what I was saying. curbside pikup and private appts was already happening. this whole big media hoopla had been unncessarry. now the stores are afraid to do curbside pickup.
According to govt guidelines theyre not even allowed to do curbside pickup, that's part of phase 1 and NYC isnt even in phase 1.
mamish ridiculous.

Mama Bear

Mon, May 25 2020, 8:14 pm

amother [ Wine ] wrote:

Today is May 24. As of this week, all of the state other than NYC, Rockland and Westchester will be at least in phase 1, AIUI. Phase 2 allows retail to open, and much of the state will probably be there in a week.

NYC and the remaining areas are expected to reach Phase 1 no later than mid June. 3 weeks. If all goes well, retail is 2 weeks later, the end of June.

If you want to whine, please whine about accurate facts.

End of June, just when everyone is setting off for the catskills and there wont be any shoppers. it's after the summer clothing shopping season. It's just a tad too late. NOW is the the shopping season. Theyre mamish missing it by a month. It's such a chaval.

Mama Bear

Mon, May 25 2020, 8:15 pm

amother [ Sienna ] wrote:

Interesting to note BP had protestors outside the stores and Williamsburg had quiet spectators.

For those wondering why so many are there, Wallabout looks like that on any given day.

Wmsbg has a better relationship with the precinct that BP, I think. In general Wmsbg ppl dont usually protest the police, I think they get along great with Shomrim. I think in BP not as much.

Mama Bear

Mon, May 25 2020, 8:16 pm

SixOfWands wrote:

Check me before you get excited. I read mid Hudson not to include Rockland or Westchester, then I read an article saying it does include them.

Mid Hudson includes Rockland, Westchester, Dutchess, Putnam, Orange, Rockland, Ulster. Basically all the non-rural parts of upstate.
All other counties but LI & NYC are open already -- there's no other region these counties can belong to.

amother

Papaya

Mon, May 25 2020, 9:27 pm

Mama Bear wrote:

This is pretty much why I assumed it would backfire. And do more harm then good. Call it a misguided or even foolish plan. But hardly heroic.

amother

Wine

Mon, May 25 2020, 9:32 pm

Mama Bear wrote:

NYC doesn’t revolve around the Jewish community in Brooklyn. In my neck of the woods, not a single person will be heading to the Catskills, and only the extremely wealthy can afford vacation homes, not to mention taking off summers.

Will the same people who are crying that they cannot economically survive another day under Pause really be investing in summer homes, and eschewing employment when things open up? I’d be surprised.

amother

Beige

Mon, May 25 2020, 9:34 pm

southernbubby wrote:

How's LGBT community affected by the lockdown more than the rest?

amother

Denim

Mon, May 25 2020, 9:41 pm

fleetwood wrote:

Even if these cases make it to the U.S. Supreme Court they will lose on the constitutional issue. There may be procedural issues with the lockdown in each case,but that's a different situation

Are you a lawyer?
I think there's a decent chance to say that extended lockdowns lasting 3-6 months could be unconstitutional. The first amendment gives you the right to assemble and practice your religious beliefs. Therefore lockdowns restricting your right to assemble and your right to worship would be subject to strict scrutiny. I think the court, especially with a conservative majority, could find it unconstitutional because these regulations being promulgated aren't necessarily narrowly tailored. As in saying 50 people can go to Wal-mart but no one can go to church doesn't seem narrowly tailored.
The fourth amendment protects against illegal searches and seizures. I think there's an interesting argument to be made that by shutting your business, the government is illegally "seizing" it with not a lot of compelling science behind it (same argument as above, why can a Walmart practice SD but a small business can't?). I don't know how the court would fall out here, but I can tell you that the current court has interpreted the Fourth Amendment broadly. See US v. Jones.

fleetwood

Mon, May 25 2020, 9:50 pm

amother [ Denim ] wrote:

I am a lawyer, and I've actually been studying up on con law recently. It seems to me based on Supreme Court precedent, that suing the state won't really work for these businesses. In any case, by the time the cases make it that far, everything will be open anyway .

One last thing,it's not narrowly tailored and that's exactly why the church or synagogue has no first amendment claim. Everyone is equally locked down, except for essential services. Your 4th amendment argument also doesn't really fly. The 10th amendment gives the state the right in this case,bolstered by Supreme Court precedent. Justice Scalia wrote a very strong opinion on this topic. I linked the case a few days ago.

Last edited by fleetwood on Mon, May 25 2020, 9:54 pm; edited 1 time in total

southernbubby

Mon, May 25 2020, 9:51 pm

amother [ Denim ] wrote:

Churches are a problem because people sit near each other and sing while in large stores there is room to SD.