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Forum
-> Household Management
-> Kosher Kitchen
sky
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 Tue, May 26 2020, 2:49 pm
| MrsMalka wrote: | Thank you very much for your help. I emailed my rabbi and am curious what he will say...
Does nobody here use Dole fruit products? Or just does nobody eat whole berries? |
Fruits that are more often infested I only buy more stringent hechsherim that are according to my standards. Like blueberries and strawberries.
I’ll buy OU for things like peaches that don’t have a bug problem.
OU has diff standards in many fruit then my rav.
It’s like you can buy lettuce with diff levels of bug checking and certification.
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MrsMalka
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Tue, May 26 2020, 3:02 pm
| sky wrote: | Blueberries - according to my rav is a big problem. We eat very few brands
If you are in Lakewood you can call the KCL for brands of blue berries that are big free to a strict standard. If that is what you want. |
I have repeatedly said that I do not live in NJ and that I am not super picky about washing berries. I know how to wash fruits, even the “difficult” ones.
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amother
Blonde
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Tue, May 26 2020, 3:22 pm
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Incidentally, the CRC holds that frozen blueberries do not need a hechsher altogether.
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MrsMalka
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Tue, May 26 2020, 3:24 pm
| amother [ Blonde ] wrote: | | Incidentally, the CRC holds that frozen blueberries do not need a hechsher altogether. |
But wait, why?
Also - I’m not sure if these are frozen.
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amother
Yellow
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Tue, May 26 2020, 3:26 pm
| MrsMalka wrote: | But wait, why?
Also - I’m not sure if these are frozen. |
According to the CRC, the way frozen berries are processed eliminates the need for checking. In other words, there is no halachic problem of bugs with any frozen berries. No hechsher is needed at all for those products as long as there are no added ingredients that may be problematic.
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amother
Yellow
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Tue, May 26 2020, 3:27 pm
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The picture in the op is a bag of frozen blueberries. It says keep frozen on the bag.
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MrsMalka
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Tue, May 26 2020, 3:28 pm
| amother [ Yellow ] wrote: | | According to the CRC, the way frozen berries are processed eliminates the need for checking. In other words, there is no halachic problem of bugs with any frozen berries. No hechsher is needed at all for those products as long as there are no added ingredients that may be problematic. |
Which CRC? Chicago or Central?
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amother
Yellow
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Tue, May 26 2020, 3:29 pm
| MrsMalka wrote: | | Which CRC? Chicago or Central? |
Chicago rabbinical council.
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MrsMalka
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Tue, May 26 2020, 3:43 pm
| amother [ Yellow ] wrote: | | The picture in the op is a bag of frozen blueberries. It says keep frozen on the bag. |
I am the OP. I didn’t see the word frozen - thanks for the heads up!
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proudmomma
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Tue, May 26 2020, 3:52 pm
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I know someone who called the OU about strawberry pie filling & was told that they check the strawberries
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Mommyg8
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Tue, May 26 2020, 3:56 pm
I once called the O-U about Costco frozen strawberries and I was told it's ok (that I don't have to worry about bugs). But different people have different standards and I know some would not eat it.
I am really curious what the answer is here, though.
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amother
Honeydew
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Tue, May 26 2020, 4:01 pm
| MrsMalka wrote: | | Sorry - I'm not trying to be rude - this is just aggravating. I just moved to America from Israel and I have learned that kashrut here is a balagan. Why would you buy a hechsher on fresh fruit if it does not mean something? Do people not understand that fresh produce does not need to be kosher certified? If the hechsher means that the product is already washed and checked, however, then I completely understand the need for the mashgiach. |
Kashrut here is a balagan?
Please edit that to read, "Kashrut is a balagan."
An American I'm close with was traveling to Israel and asked a friend, who is also a prominent rav and possek, to advise him regarding what hechsherim he can use while he's in Israel. The reply was - the person is happy he's coming, he'll make arrangements to host him, go anywhere with him, help him in any way, answer any questions, but please this one thing don't ask him.
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Rappel
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Tue, May 26 2020, 4:05 pm
| amother [ Honeydew ] wrote: | Kashrut here is a balagan?
Please edit that to read, "Kashrut is a balagan."
An American I'm close with was traveling to Israel and asked a friend, who is also a prominent rav and possek, to advise him regarding what hechsherim he can use while he's in Israel. The reply was - the person is happy he's coming, he'll make arrangements to host him, go anywhere with him, help him in any way, answer any questions, but please this one thing don't ask him. |
That seems rather silly.
Here you go:
https://www.kosharot.co.il/ind.....HEB#B
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gibberish
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Tue, May 26 2020, 4:11 pm
I believe that the OU is of the position that cultivated blueberries do not need to be checked for bugs altogether and can be rinsed. I highly doubt they are checked.
http://ou.org.s3.amazonaws.com.....1.pdf
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MrsMalka
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Tue, May 26 2020, 4:45 pm
My rabbi got back to me.
He said “it is checked, but you should check again.”
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amother
Denim
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Tue, May 26 2020, 5:22 pm
1- the OU gives hashgacha on any product that the company request hashgacha on, that's why you'll see aluminnium foil or paper towel with a OU! That's why there's a OU on frozen fruit!
2- the washing in factories gets rid of most bugs, the question is how much they will tolerate: let's say they checked 5 lbs and found only 3 bugs, they might authorize it anyway! Let's say they check 5 lbs and find 8 bugs some hechesherim might be more machmir and some might authorize it...
The checking in factories with a OU are not as vigilant as the one that say "was checked for bugs"
That's why some rabbanim will let you use those but only for smoothies or ice cream which will be crushed or cooked and some rabbanim won't! (Because it's a bigger problem to eat a whole bug than a pc of a bug!)
Blueberries & strawberries are definitely more of an issue than pineapple, peaches or mango!!
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FranticFrummie
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Tue, May 26 2020, 5:40 pm
Oy, kashrus! My ex was a shochet, and knew a lot about kashrus issues in general. He says that at least half of the kashrus problems in the world are political and money oriented. That doesn't mean we don't check for reliable heksherim though, and we go by what our rav says is OK for us. That doesn't mean that something is mamash treif if another rav holds more or less stringently. So - it's complicated.
There are some Chassidic groups that won't touch OU at all, unless it has a heimish heksher as well. There are MO people who will accept Triangle K and Tablet K, and some people will even accept a plain K on anything - even though plain K doesn't really mean anything. You don't need anyone's permission to put a plain K on something, for example, yogurt that has gelatin in it, and you don't know what type of gelatin. Some people say that beef gelatin is processed to the point that you don't have to worry about whether the cow was kosher or shechted properly, and other people will only eat fish gelatin or plant based gelatin.
Hebrew National and Sinai brand hot dogs are not eaten by anyone I know who is Orthodox, but Conservative and Reform consider them kosher. My ex says that they are not mamash treif, but "we just don't eat them."
Back to the produce question, I once bought a bag of triple washed lettuce with a heksher, and found bugs in it! From then on, I have bought regular romaine, and done the checking myself. I eat broccoli and asparagus, and I check it myself. Keep in mind, you are only responsible for bugs you can see with the naked eye, assuming you have normal vision. We are not required to look at things with a microscope, and we are not required to judge other people's choices when it comes to checking.
I know several frum, Orthodox, lovely families that I will not eat by. Not because I think that they are bad, but because I am just holding at a different place (not higher, just different).
I have a good friend who will only eat food that is prepared in her home, by her. No restaurants, nothing from my house, NADA. That's where she's holding, and she doesn't judge me one bit if I eat at the kosher McDonalds at the mall. (I get the chicken, because the beef isn't mehadrin, but I don't judge the people with a kosher Big Mac.)
I'm just rambling at this point, but it goes to show that "is this kosher?" is never a simple question. When in doubt, the best thing to do is to contact your local Va'ad, and get a list of what is approved in your community.
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MrsMalka
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Tue, May 26 2020, 5:47 pm
| FranticFrummie wrote: | Oy, kashrus! My ex was a shochet, and knew a lot about kashrus issues in general. He says that at least half of the kashrus problems in the world are political and money oriented. That doesn't mean we don't check for reliable heksherim though, and we go by what our rav says is OK for us. That doesn't mean that something is mamash treif if another rav holds more or less stringently. So - it's complicated.
There are some Chassidic groups that won't touch OU at all, unless it has a heimish heksher as well. There are MO people who will accept Triangle K and Tablet K, and some people will even accept a plain K on anything - even though plain K doesn't really mean anything. You don't need anyone's permission to put a plain K on something, for example, yogurt that has gelatin in it, and you don't know what type of gelatin. Some people say that beef gelatin is processed to the point that you don't have to worry about whether the cow was kosher or shechted properly, and other people will only eat fish gelatin or plant based gelatin.
Hebrew National and Sinai brand hot dogs are not eaten by anyone I know who is Orthodox, but Conservative and Reform consider them kosher. My ex says that they are not mamash treif, but "we just don't eat them."
Back to the produce question, I once bought a bag of triple washed lettuce with a heksher, and found bugs in it! From then on, I have bought regular romaine, and done the checking myself. I eat broccoli and asparagus, and I check it myself. Keep in mind, you are only responsible for bugs you can see with the naked eye, assuming you have normal vision. We are not required to look at things with a microscope, and we are not required to judge other people's choices when it comes to checking.
I know several frum, Orthodox, lovely families that I will not eat by. Not because I think that they are bad, but because I am just holding at a different place (not higher, just different).
I have a good friend who will only eat food that is prepared in her home, by her. No restaurants, nothing from my house, NADA. That's where she's holding, and she doesn't judge me one bit if I eat at the kosher McDonalds at the mall. (I get the chicken, because the beef isn't mehadrin, but I don't judge the people with a kosher Big Mac.)
I'm just rambling at this point, but it goes to show that "is this kosher?" is never a simple question. When in doubt, the best thing to do is to contact your local Va'ad, and get a list of what is approved in your community. |
I have absolutely no respect for someone who will not eat anyone else’s food - that is literally the definition of being overzealous - being too strict and making up rules is equally as bad (if not worse) than not being strict enough and following all rules. Trust is important.
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FranticFrummie
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Tue, May 26 2020, 5:57 pm
| MrsMalka wrote: | | I have absolutely no respect for someone who will not eat anyone else’s food - that is literally the definition of being overzealous - being too strict and making up rules is equally as bad (if not worse) than not being strict enough and following all rules. Trust is important. |
I hear what you're saying, but in most cases it's not a matter of trust, as much as people following their rabbis.
If I didn't feel comfortable eating at someone's house, I would always find a graceful way of wiggling out, without saying a word about their cooking habits. "Oy, it's been such a long week! I'm hoping to have a quiet Shabbos lunch at home today, but I'd love to come over later and hang out in the afternoon. We could go to the rebbetzin's shiur afterwards."
By the same token, if someone is a member of a chassidus that I am not a member of, I have to respect that their derech is right for them, as long as they aren't looking down on me. Some people just don't "mish", and if that's their minhag, then I can live with that.
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MrsMalka
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Tue, May 26 2020, 6:15 pm
| FranticFrummie wrote: | I hear what you're saying, but in most cases it's not a matter of trust, as much as people following their rabbis.
If I didn't feel comfortable eating at someone's house, I would always find a graceful way of wiggling out, without saying a word about their cooking habits. "Oy, it's been such a long week! I'm hoping to have a quiet Shabbos lunch at home today, but I'd love to come over later and hang out in the afternoon. We could go to the rebbetzin's shiur afterwards."
By the same token, if someone is a member of a chassidus that I am not a member of, I have to respect that their derech is right for them, as long as they aren't looking down on me. Some people just don't "mish", and if that's their minhag, then I can live with that. |
I vehemently disagree - when someone tries to have you over, you need to think of every possible way to attend and make it possible. Chumrot are good for when they strengthen your emunah, but not when they cause you to separate from others and be insular. Of course if the person is knowingly doing something you vehemently disagree with on a halakhic basis (and not just as a chumra) that is different - for example, my husband and I keep chalav yisrael and pat yisrael, as do our rabbi. We believe that chalav yisrael is required and that chalav stam is just plain treif, so we can’t eat dairy at most friends’ homes. However, even though we keep pat yisrael, it is so clearly a chumra, so we keep it at home, but will definitely eat not pat yisrael at a friend’s house, especially if declining an invitation would hurt someone else’s feelings. There is no such thing as “wiggling out” of an invitation - people are not stupid - they will realise what is happening after you decline them so many times. There is the idea of ahavat yisrael - the more interconnected we are with all Jews, the better - we should never seek to be insular, no matter how right wing we are.
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