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Biden says Trump is first racist president
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SixOfWands




 
 
 
 

Post  Wed, Jul 29 2020, 11:49 am
shoshanim999 wrote:
I agree Trump should have said something (he actually did acknowledge his death a few hours later), but The john Lewis who was a fierce fighter for black equality in the 60's aged into a confused and disoriented old man.

1. He actually praised the 5th avenue mural as a powerful work of art. He didn't realize the divisiveness it would cause and how it would only serve to further strain racial tensions.

2. He said that despite real progress, his heart breaks as he watches video after video of unarmed black men being killed by cops.

We can talk about racial profiling and whether blacks are treated fairly by police. what's not debatable is that a total of 9 unarmed black people (vs 19 unarmed white people) were killed by cops in 2019. This doesn't include instances where there were other mitigating circumstances such as the victim was waving a toy gun. Anyway, shame on John Lewis for spreading these harmful lies that only contribute towards racial tensions.


It seems that you define "confused and disoriented" with "isn't a conservative."

My heart breaks when people deride someone whose heart breaks when they seen unarmed people being killed by the government.

BTW, a police officer should be able to tell the difference between a toy gun and a real one.
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shoshanim999




 
 
 
 

Post  Wed, Jul 29 2020, 11:57 am
SixOfWands wrote:
Did you know that only 9 people died at the Pittsburgh synagogue shooting? And only 1 in Poway. to the best of my knowledge, not a single Jew has been killed in an antisemitic attack this year. I'm not sure how any one could claim antisemitism exists.

And look at the issues in their communities. I read this online group, imamother. People there are always talking about how to get govenment assistance. Subsidized housing, Medicaid, food stamps, it seems like its a way of life for these people. Maybe instead of blaming "antisemitism" on other people, they should try to fix their own communities.

That's essentially what the conservatives here are arguing, but with respect to people of color.

I can't even read comments criticizing what John Lewis has done for the United States. For shame.



My point about *only 9* unarmed police killings in 2019 is that we have to be realistic about the situation. There are almost 1,000,000 cops in the U.S.. Surely some are racist, incompetent, or trigger happy. They are involved in thousands of incidents with the black community every year. We both know it is unreasonable to say that there will be zero unarmed people killed in a given year. It's not possible. Is there any country that has achieved that? No.

It is true that the Jewish community and many on imamother benefit from many government programs. There's a big difference. The frum community that uses various programs, do so gladly. Nobody is blaming Anti Semitism. They get married young, have children, and get on programs. They don't blame anyone for their predicament. For many, this is their lifestyle and they are content. It's the very opposite with the black community. Their narrative is that they are oppressed by racism. If only (to quote Al Sharpton) the white man would take their knee off our collective necks, we'd be able to prosper.
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shoshanim999




 
 
 
 

Post  Wed, Jul 29 2020, 12:20 pm
SixOfWands wrote:
It seems that you define "confused and disoriented" with "isn't a conservative."

My heart breaks when people deride someone whose heart breaks when they seen unarmed people being killed by the government.

BTW, a police officer should be able to tell the difference between a toy gun and a real one.



Can I ask what number of unarmed people killed would be reasonable? I know that question sounds crude, but it is reality. If in 25 years from now you look up the data and you see that 3 unarmed people were killed by police in the past 25 years, how would you feel? Would you say that it's 3 too many, or would you say that it's realistic that during the course of a few million interactions with people, mistakes will happen. At what number are the protests no longer justified? I'm curious to hear your thoughts on this.
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#BestBubby




 
 
 
 

Post  Wed, Jul 29 2020, 12:30 pm
Fact: There were FEWER unarmed black men killed by police under Trump than under Obama.

Fact: The number of unarmed black men killed by police has been trending DOWN

There is no "crisis" or "systemic racism" by the police.

It is unrealistic to expect with nearly a million cops that there won't be some mistakes
or bad cops. But it is VERY RARE.

Democrats have been FALSELY painting America as a Racist Country and Police as a Racist organization to WIN ELECTIONS. That is despicable!
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shoshanim999




 
 
 
 

Post  Wed, Jul 29 2020, 1:15 pm
#BestBubby wrote:
Fact: There were FEWER unarmed black men killed by police under Trump than under Obama.

Fact: The number of unarmed black men killed by police has been trending DOWN

There is no "crisis" or "systemic racism" by the police.

It is unrealistic to expect with nearly a million cops that there won't be some mistakes
or bad cops. But it is VERY RARE.

Democrats have been FALSELY painting America as a Racist Country and Police as a Racist organization to WIN ELECTIONS. That is despicable!



There's no question blacks are better off in 2020 in every imaginable way than at any point in their history. So why the huge fuss at this point in time? Might it have something to do with the upcoming election?
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PinkFridge




 
 
 
 

Post  Wed, Jul 29 2020, 1:23 pm
shoshanim999 wrote:
There's no question blacks are better off in 2020 in every imaginable way than at any point in their history. So why the huge fuss at this point in time? Might it have something to do with the upcoming election?


There's no question they're more in pain than they've been for a long time. Can we be empathetic?
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#BestBubby




 
 
 
 

Post  Wed, Jul 29 2020, 1:29 pm
PinkFridge wrote:
There's no question they're more in pain than they've been for a long time. Can we be empathetic?


They are in pain because Democrats are abusing Black People by promoting that
cops are racist killers and all americans are racist. Best way to stop the pain is to
point out the lies.

Although some black people maybe like the racism myth because it empowers them.
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shoshanim999




 
 
 
 

Post  Wed, Jul 29 2020, 1:30 pm
PinkFridge wrote:
There's no question they're more in pain than they've been for a long time. Can we be empathetic?



Why are they in more pain? Is it because their reality is really oppressed or is it because they are being trained to be in pain?

There's no way to know the answer to this question but of the many thousands of protesters, how many do you think are aware that there were fewer unarmed black people killed in 2019 than at any point in history? I suspect almost all protesters and rioters are not aware of this.
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Cheiny




 
 
 
 

Post  Wed, Jul 29 2020, 1:33 pm
PinkFridge wrote:
There's no question they're more in pain than they've been for a long time. Can we be empathetic?


Why do you suppose that would be? George Floyd is not the first victim of police brutality, so why now? What has emboldened them to this level, where they believe they will burn, riot, destroy, attack their way to getting demands met and being paid off?


Last edited by Cheiny on Wed, Jul 29 2020, 3:14 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Cheiny




 
 
 
 

Post  Wed, Jul 29 2020, 1:35 pm
shoshanim999 wrote:
Why are they in more pain? Is it because their reality is really oppressed or is it because they are being trained to be in pain?

There's no way to know the answer to this question but of the many thousands of protesters, how many do you think are aware that there were fewer unarmed black people killed in 2019 than at any point in history? I suspect almost all protesters and rioters are not aware of this.


Nor would they care. They found the time ripe because Dems now are desperate for black votes so they are being coddled and encouraged in their violence and criminal behavior.

If they truly were in pain because of George Floyd’s death, they would be just as much pained by all the murders committed just in the last few weeks alone, by blacks.
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saw50st8




 
 
 
 

Post  Wed, Jul 29 2020, 2:08 pm
shoshanim999 wrote:
Are they really working to improve both?

If you or I had multiple problems in our home for example, we'd prioritize and dedicate more time and effort to resolve the bigger problem first. If gd forbid someone's house is on fire and they also have a leaky sink, would it make sense to call a plumber?

There's no question that the problem within the black community that causes the most anger, and the biggest protests, is the issue that unarmed blacks are being killed by the police. How many of the thousands of protesters are aware that in 2019 only 9 unarmed black people were killed by the cops? The narrative that is being told in the media is that the reason the black community are the leaders in all the wrong categories (graduation, poverty, prison) is because of racism.

It's dishonest to say that the community rallies around issues like education, single motherhood, and job creation in the same way they rally against so called systemic racism. Why do you think that is? Why don't we see similar sized rallies in an effort to lower the single motherhood rate which stands at an absurd 72%? Any honest person would tell you that this is a far bigger problem than racism.


I actually think abuse of power is a much bigger problem than single motherhood. Abuse of power trickles down in ways we don't even understand.

I don't understand how you rally around prevention of single motherhood? The best thing we can do as a society for preventing single motherhood is 1) provide long term birth control like Colorado tested 2) stop targeting black men and sending them to prison. I am sure that there are plenty more ways to reduce the rates of single motherhood. Keep in mind that single motherhood itself isn't a problem (I was raised by a single mother), but it is a risk factor for additional problems. I don't have all (or really any) of the right answers here and I don't claim to.

I think generally Democrats across the board are doing a terrible job at trying to solve these problems. I don't think places like Chicago or NYC have figured any of this out and many of the things that they have tried haven't worked.

I also think that the reason all these protests happened now was:

1) The absolutely horrific nature of the George Floyd murder
2) The fact that it was recorded so people could watch it
3) The fact that it wasn't one rogue cop, but multiple cops were there watching and didn't step in to stop a murder
4) COVID quarantine has made plenty of people absolutely crazy
5) COVID quarantine has made many people more available at times they would be at work

Remember, it isn't just 9 unarmed black men who were murdered. It is also all the other black men who are targeted, charged and imprisoned at far greater rates than their white peers. I found this article interesting - it's not very new: https://www.washingtonpost.com.....lack/

These items feed back into problems in the black community as well and increase the other problems.
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PinkFridge




 
 
 
 

Post  Wed, Jul 29 2020, 2:26 pm
Believe me, I feel there's a lot of bad stuff going on in perpetuating this narrative. There's a lot of staying the victim instead of moving ahead. I don't know where "We Shall Overcome" vanished to.
I can still be compassionate.
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Fox




 
 
 
 

Post  Wed, Jul 29 2020, 2:27 pm
saw50st8 wrote:
Many of the issues that you reference (education, single motherhood, job creation) are actually exacerbated by racism from police. Black men are more likely to be arrested and then imprisoned for crimes, which increases single motherhood and it is cyclical.

I also think that many people DO rally around those issues at a more local level.

I am not claiming that all these communities are tackling these issues effectively.

But, to use a cheesy example - if two kids are fighting in the school yard, it is not as severe as the principal fighting with a student. Those in power have a lot more responsibility to get it right than an individual does.

I find this disturbing a somewhat disturbing take.

First, it infantalizes black Americans by portraying them as endlessly dependent on more powerful whites to set things right. This was the thrust of John McWhorter's rebuttal to White Fragility.

Second, it is dangerously simplistic. For example, there is little evidence of entrenched racism within most major police departments. In many cases, the mayors and police chiefs are black themselves, and a large portion of the officers are black or Hispanic.

What is true, however, is that city governments often make decisions that, while not overtly racist, have a disproportionate effect when it comes to disrupting the lives of black Americans. This is what Sonnie Johnson accurately pointed out about Ferguson, MO. The city was using the police to make minor arrests that would lead to fines -- thus providing the city with a revenue stream. That the suburb was largely black meant that young black men were disproportionately targeted, and once in the justice system, it became more difficult for them to avoid negative outcomes.

But the motive wasn't racism. It was greed.

Finally, pinning blame on allegedly racist police sidesteps the problems with the Violent Crimes Act of 1994, which resulted in the mass incarceration of black Americans. This is not some complicated theory of embedded racism; it's a law that didn't work. Judges were not given discretion in sentencing, resulting in draconian sentences for individuals who, while often not Sunday school attendees, were more valuable to their communities outside of prison than inside.

While there are obviously individual police officers who may be racist, this doesn't account for the widespread problems. A better approach would be to (a) support the First Step Act to a greater degree; and (b) admit that the Violent Crimes Act of 1994 was a bad idea and take it behind the barn and shoot it.
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Cheiny




 
 
 
 

Post  Wed, Jul 29 2020, 3:16 pm
saw50st8 wrote:
I actually think abuse of power is a much bigger problem than single motherhood. Abuse of power trickles down in ways we don't even understand.

I don't understand how you rally around prevention of single motherhood? The best thing we can do as a society for preventing single motherhood is 1) provide long term birth control like Colorado tested 2) stop targeting black men and sending them to prison. I am sure that there are plenty more ways to reduce the rates of single motherhood. Keep in mind that single motherhood itself isn't a problem (I was raised by a single mother), but it is a risk factor for additional problems. I don't have all (or really any) of the right answers here and I don't claim to.

I think generally Democrats across the board are doing a terrible job at trying to solve these problems. I don't think places like Chicago or NYC have figured any of this out and many of the things that they have tried haven't worked.

I also think that the reason all these protests happened now was:

1) The absolutely horrific nature of the George Floyd murder
2) The fact that it was recorded so people could watch it
3) The fact that it wasn't one rogue cop, but multiple cops were there watching and didn't step in to stop a murder
4) COVID quarantine has made plenty of people absolutely crazy
5) COVID quarantine has made many people more available at times they would be at work

Remember, it isn't just 9 unarmed black men who were murdered. It is also all the other black men who are targeted, charged and imprisoned at far greater rates than their white peers. I found this article interesting - it's not very new: https://www.washingtonpost.com.....lack/

These items feed back into problems in the black community as well and increase the other problems.


But all the reasons you gave, if true, should hold true for black on black murders as well. Babies and children have been murdered! Why no outrage or even much mention of those murders?
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saw50st8




 
 
 
 

Post  Wed, Jul 29 2020, 3:18 pm
Fox wrote:
I find this disturbing a somewhat disturbing take.

First, it infantalizes black Americans by portraying them as endlessly dependent on more powerful whites to set things right. This was the thrust of John McWhorter's rebuttal to White Fragility.

Second, it is dangerously simplistic. For example, there is little evidence of entrenched racism within most major police departments. In many cases, the mayors and police chiefs are black themselves, and a large portion of the officers are black or Hispanic.

What is true, however, is that city governments often make decisions that, while not overtly racist, have a disproportionate effect when it comes to disrupting the lives of black Americans. This is what Sonnie Johnson accurately pointed out about Ferguson, MO. The city was using the police to make minor arrests that would lead to fines -- thus providing the city with a revenue stream. That the suburb was largely black meant that young black men were disproportionately targeted, and once in the justice system, it became more difficult for them to avoid negative outcomes.

But the motive wasn't racism. It was greed.

Finally, pinning blame on allegedly racist police sidesteps the problems with the Violent Crimes Act of 1994, which resulted in the mass incarceration of black Americans. This is not some complicated theory of embedded racism; it's a law that didn't work. Judges were not given discretion in sentencing, resulting in draconian sentences for individuals who, while often not Sunday school attendees, were more valuable to their communities outside of prison than inside.

While there are obviously individual police officers who may be racist, this doesn't account for the widespread problems. A better approach would be to (a) support the First Step Act to a greater degree; and (b) admit that the Violent Crimes Act of 1994 was a bad idea and take it behind the barn and shoot it.


I'm not sure why you think I am referencing "more powerful white people to set things straight." When I reference power, I was talking about the police. They have a lot of power and they need to use it judiciously. Police come from all sorts of backgrounds.

I don't dispute that many of the motivations may be greed. I actually think that it is important to look at the root cause so that you solve the right problem, not just the problem that you think you are solving. It still disproportionately effects the black community and increases social problems. There may be better ways to solve the inner city problems, but it is extremely important (and really more important to a certain extent) to ensure that those in power cannot abuse it. As Jews, we should be extremely cognizant of that.

Mandatory sentences are a double edged sword that works as effectively as zero tolerance policies.
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saw50st8




 
 
 
 

Post  Wed, Jul 29 2020, 3:20 pm
Cheiny wrote:
But all the reasons you gave, if true, should hold true for black on black murders as well. Babies and children have been murdered! Why no outrage or even much mention of those murders?


There is plenty of outrage against those murders. But who are you going to protest - the gang members at your corner? Crime stemming from individuals, which is what citizens are, is different than crime stemming from those in power.
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#BestBubby




 
 
 
 

Post  Fri, Jul 31 2020, 9:34 am
saw50st8 wrote:
I actually think abuse of power is a much bigger problem than single motherhood. Abuse of power trickles down in ways we don't even understand.

I don't understand how you rally around prevention of single motherhood? The best thing we can do as a society for preventing single motherhood is 1) provide long term birth control like Colorado tested 2) stop targeting black men and sending them to prison. I am sure that there are plenty more ways to reduce the rates of single motherhood. Keep in mind that single motherhood itself isn't a problem (I was raised by a single mother), but it is a risk factor for additional problems. I don't have all (or really any) of the right answers here and I don't claim to.


Out of wedlock births were below 5% prior to 1960. The best prevention of out-of-wedlock birth is RELIGION which stresses ABSTINENCE. Democrat-Socialists, like all Marxists, have been indoctrinating ATHEISM with their indoctrination of evolution and LGBTQT - which makes most religions "hate". Democrat "s-x education" encourages pre-marital s-x, saying it is "unrealistic" to expect kids not to. Yet for thousands of years, with Religion, out-of-wedlock births were very rare!

Democrats also made welfare which REWARDED SINGLE women who got pregnant with their own apartments and $$$ and discouraged marriage.

After Welfare was implemented, the black out-of-wedlock birthrate skyrocketed to over
70% ! And this was deliberate. Trapping black people in poverty, dependent on welfare is how Democrats win elections.
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saw50st8




 
 
 
 

Post  Fri, Jul 31 2020, 2:20 pm
#BestBubby wrote:
Out of wedlock births were below 5% prior to 1960. The best prevention of out-of-wedlock birth is RELIGION which stresses ABSTINENCE. Democrat-Socialists, like all Marxists, have been indoctrinating ATHEISM with their indoctrination of evolution and LGBTQT - which makes most religions "hate". Democrat "s-x education" encourages pre-marital s-x, saying it is "unrealistic" to expect kids not to. Yet for thousands of years, with Religion, out-of-wedlock births were very rare!

Democrats also made welfare which REWARDED SINGLE women who got pregnant with their own apartments and $$$ and discouraged marriage.

After Welfare was implemented, the black out-of-wedlock birthrate skyrocketed to over
70% ! And this was deliberate. Trapping black people in poverty, dependent on welfare is how Democrats win elections.


We can back and forth about this, but abstinence only education is largely ineffective and doesn't prevent the spread of STD (or pregnancy really). Before 1960s, women didn't have access to birth control and were either married off young, shipped off to "boarding school" or had backdoor abortions. Women were still getting pregnant. I'm glad that young women are rarely forced into ridiculous marriages at young ages because of their pregnancy.

Programs like in Colorado that made long term birth control available freely has proven valuable in dropping the rate of unplanned pregnancy in young women.

While I personally promote abstinence until marriage, I don't think that's a decision that I should make for every person in America, especially as women are opting to marry later and later in life.
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chanatron1000




 
 
 
 

Post  Fri, Jul 31 2020, 2:30 pm
#BestBubby wrote:
The best prevention of out-of-wedlock birth is RELIGION which stresses ABSTINENCE.

Or perhaps it's the other way around, and abstinence is usually a religious teaching.
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Cheiny




 
 
 
 

Post  Yesterday at 11:11 pm
With all the racist remarks Biden has blurted out, “you ain’t black if you vote for Trump,” and just this week asking a black reporter if he’s a junkie on cocaine, and now this, he has the nerve to fabricate accusations of racism against Trump? Total projection!

Biden: Latino community is diverse, ‘unlike the African American community’
President Donald Trump quickly attacked Biden over the remark.

https://www.politico.com/news/.....92354
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