“YOU AND YOUR PRAYER BOOK CAN GET OFF!”

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amother

Crimson

Sat, Dec 05 2020, 6:50 pm

crust wrote:

At the 3.19 mark she said I was very compliant it just fell off when I talked and I wasn't given a chance to ask for another one.

What does that mean ask for another one? She lost her mask?

amother

Cyan

Sat, Dec 05 2020, 7:06 pm

amother [ Crimson ] wrote:

What does that mean ask for another one? She lost her mask?

I'm confused - I'm honestly trying to understand.

Was it as the YWN story makes it out to be that she was compliant and wearing a mask the entire time, and they just came after her because she was praying / anti -semitism. Or was it that she lost her mask ( "it fell down when she was talking and asked for a replacement"), so she technically wasn't be compliant during the takeoff process? Or was it that wasn't masked (cause it was lost), and her face was covered with her siddur, so it looked like she was trying to hide her face so no one can see that she wasn't compliant?

Not that any of the above makes the situation ok, but if I'd lose my mask in a situation where every single person is being scrutinized, I would have been very proactive in obtaining a new mask and not sitting back in my seat. A plane doesn't take off today if every single passenger is not masked, so I wouldn't wait for them to come to me and raise the flag. It's almost as if asking for trouble.

Regardless, the YWN story is very misleading.

amother

Sienna

Sat, Dec 05 2020, 7:24 pm

This is utterly confusing.

This shows some faceless people - an unknown person and what appears to be a helpful customer service rep of some kind who is getting her a seat.

Where is video of the actual incident of the alleged removal of someone wearing a mask?

If you are wearing a mask, how do you lose it. You need to be wearing a mask every single minute you are in an air terminal and on the plane. How could an adult lose a mask and not be aware that it is no longer on their face. A child could arguably lose a mask but an adult?

It is preposterous to think that someone wearing a mask would be escorted off a plane because they are praying. Or because they are Jewish.

This doesn't pass any kind of scrutiny because it makes no sense.

amother

Dodgerblue

Sat, Dec 05 2020, 7:26 pm

It appears that she told them if they don't like how her mask fits can they give her a better one. Airlines are notorious for picking on people and throwing them off instead of discussing what to change. I find it to be very believable. And it's confusing only because she herself was confused as to why she was being kicked off despite wearing her mask.

number

Sat, Dec 05 2020, 7:27 pm

For general comments and complaints, Delta accepts phone calls, letters, emails, and even tweets. In the U.S. and Canada, complaints can be called in at 800/455-2720 (8 am–7 pm, M–F), or mailed in to Delta Air Lines, Inc. Customer Care at P.O. Box 20980, Department 980, Atlanta, GA 30320-2980.

To complain online, use the 4-step form for emails or tweet @Delta (the old @DeltaAssist account is no longer attended). Customer service reps keep an eye on Twitter.

number

Sat, Dec 05 2020, 7:32 pm

crust wrote:

At the 3.19 mark she said I was very compliant it just fell off when I talked and I wasn't given a chance to ask for another one.

Did she say “it fell down in my palm”?

At any rate the comment in this thread title means delta will need to apologize and promise to train their employees to be more culturally sensitive. IMO we should be complaining regardless.

Fox

Sat, Dec 05 2020, 7:54 pm

I can clarify some of the details in this story -- the unidentified woman is one of my daughters.

The flight attendant, Erica Green, had walked back and forth several times without commenting on her mask. However, when my daughter took out her siddur to say Tefillas HaDerech was when the problem started. Ms. Green was very aggressive and told her that her mask wasn't adequately covering her nose.

At first, my daughter thought Ms. Green was complaining that it had slipped, so she tried to adjust it. Ms. Green said that was inadequate and brought another flight attendant over. At that point, my daughter thought maybe they didn't like the mask -- it was one of those blue, standard-issue ones -- so she offered to wear a different mask if they provided one. The initial conversation was not videoed; my daughter didn't realize that this was going to escalate.

No dice.

The pilots were told that a non-compliant passenger was refusing to wear a mask, and they turned the plane around. After she was escorted off the plane, she spoke with the pilots, and they seemed to have no idea what had happened -- they were surprised to see her in a mask.

But here's the crazy part: the gate personnel quickly rebooked her on a flight leaving to LGA 30 minutes later and escorted her to the gate to make sure the doors didn't close before she got there. If she'd truly refused to wear a mask, why would they have been so willing to rebook her without the slightest hesitation or without checking to make sure she would agree to wear a mask?

She's filed an official complaint with Delta, asking for a refund of her ticket price (about $250) and an apology. In addition to what has been reported, Ms. Green made some comments regarding the frum men who tried to intervene, including "You don't get to have your way all the time."

Fortunately, nothing really bad happened, but it was annoying and embarrassing.

On the plus side, she was wearing a fabulous handbag. There's no excuse for getting thrown off a plane with a tacky handbag!

117

southernbubby

Sat, Dec 05 2020, 8:07 pm

Wonder what would have happened if the "non-compliant" person would have been black. Delta airlines would no longer exist. I hope that the anti- Defamation League as well as Agudas Yisroel rabbonim sue Delta for all they are worth. Such pigs.
Mentioning the prayer book and 🐖 Green's remark to the frum men qualifies for anti-Semitism.
Fox, I hope that you get every Jew in Chicago to jam their website and their phone lines.

Rappel

Sat, Dec 05 2020, 8:10 pm

Fox wrote:

That sounds pretty straightforward. Delta is going to have to decide which they would rather keep - this flight attendant, or their good name. She sounds like a piece of work.

Fox

Sat, Dec 05 2020, 8:15 pm

southernbubby wrote:

Honestly, we're not litigious people. My daughter is in touch with representatives from Agudath as well as a couple of frum elected officials, and their advice is that publicizing the story will probably be more effective than a lawsuit.

As for the ADL, they're certainly not going to stand up for a Jewish woman if it means opposing a black woman.

amother

Ruby

Sat, Dec 05 2020, 8:21 pm

fox, how can we complain to delta on your daugher's behalf?
I am so sorry she had to go through this!!
I was beyond impressed with how she kept herself so collected, I probably would have been shrieking at them, or sobbing or a mixture.
what horrible chutzpa of this flight attendant, Hashem will remember this when Moshiach comes!!!

Fox

Sat, Dec 05 2020, 8:31 pm

amother [ Ruby ] wrote:

Thank you! I'm not sure, tbh. I'll see if I can find out.

amh

Sat, Dec 05 2020, 8:33 pm

Fox I am so sorry that this happened to your daughter. I just want to commend you and her for the way this was handled! Your daughter spoke so calmly and respectfully the entire time! Thanking the lady for explaining it to her and all!
That was a true kiddush HAshem!!

yksraya

Sat, Dec 05 2020, 8:37 pm

Fox, I feel bad for your daughter that she had to go through this. Eisev sona L'yaakov at it's finest!

She made a Kiddush Hashem by her calm and collected demeanor.

May she never have any bad experiences again.

Fox

Sat, Dec 05 2020, 8:44 pm

yksraya wrote:

Amen! It was unpleasant, but it wasn't exactly traumatic. She's fine.

smile18

Sat, Dec 05 2020, 9:17 pm

Fox, I'm sorry for your daughter's experience.
You raised her well on how she stayed calm and reacted in a respectful way all the time.

chestnut

Sat, Dec 05 2020, 9:31 pm

Wow Fox, this is really crazy. The attendant's comment to frum men really shows what she's all about.
I'm still not clear about the mask, though. The attendant was passing checking masks a few times and didn't tell anything to your daughter until she was davening from a book. Was her mask not covering her nose all that time and the attendant chose to talk to her only once she was davening?
Do planes now have empty seats on either side of each passenger or she had neighbors who saw her wearing a mask?

imorethanamother

Sat, Dec 05 2020, 9:37 pm

Delta is the absolute worst airline. They also threw my sister off their plane years ago for some insane reason. She was traumatized. We complained but got nowhere.

crust

Sat, Dec 05 2020, 9:39 pm

Fox wrote:

I love how she acts so calm and collected in the face of unfair nonsense. She doesn't raise her voice. What a mentch!

Fox, great daughter you raised!!

amother

Silver

Sat, Dec 05 2020, 9:45 pm

Wow this is such an upsetting story. Thank you Fox for going through all the details with her. I hope delta fires Erika green

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