Not inviting kids - how to make it clear

Sesame

Thu, Apr 28 2022, 12:34 pm

amother [ Mistyrose ] wrote:

Say the truth, go for it! I was quite surprised when my nieces brought their kids to my daughters wedding. Most didn't stay for the meal buy some did. In my days this wasn't done but apparently it's acceptable in certain communities.

If a kid doesn’t take up a place and doesn’t eat (like a little child 3 or under), would it be okay? Just wondering. Like a baby. I’ve often taken a baby or a tiny child cos I wouldn’t go otherwise. Baby doesn’t take a seat or eat (unless a bit of soup or off my plate).

Editing to clarify. WHERE A HOST (CLOSE FAMILY) DOES NOT MENTION NO CHILDREN AND THE INVITE WAS EITHER BY MOUTH OR TEXT SO NOT ADDRESSED TO MR &MRS

Last edited by Sesame on Thu, Apr 28 2022, 1:59 pm; edited 1 time in total

amother

Maple

Thu, Apr 28 2022, 12:36 pm

Sesame wrote:

If you mention money, ppl will often say, oh my kids won’t eat anyway.
I’d just be honest and if you can for cheap maybe send home a treat for the kids. “Hi did you get the invite? So so excited to see you! It means so much to us that you’ll be joining. I value our friendship so I’m going to be direct instead of being weird or hinting, but I know you’ll understand since we’re good friends. Regrettably, whichever way we look at things, we can’t make it work to invite children even though we would have loved that. (Don’t say why, just it doesn’t work). But I’m trying to set aside time to make a pekelach for you to take home so your kids know we were thinking of them and missed them.”

That's a really sweet idea. It makes the concept tangible to those who don't take hints or direct instructions.

amother

Outerspace

Thu, Apr 28 2022, 12:36 pm

Personally, if a "friend" called and told me she can only afford a plate for me but not my kids, I'd feel some combination of cringiness/pity/hurt and likely just not go. Certainly if I went and then did see other kids there, I would make a quick U-turn and head for the door.

Perhaps you could arrange to have babysitting at the event. Even if it will cost you some money, it will still be cheaper than paying for the additional portions, and then you could add on the invite - plus tell them verbally - that there will be babysitting on site for all kids under 13.

You should also check with the caterer, because in my experience little kids are often charged half the rate of adults, so perhaps you could squeeze a few kids into your budget to avoid a cringy uncomfortable situation.

Chayalle

Thu, Apr 28 2022, 12:43 pm

amother [ Mistyrose ] wrote:

In some communities, most halls/caterers have a minimum that most people don't meet. I've been at weddings where there are empty tables. My friend made a wedding and asked me to please bring my girls, because they were paying anyway and wanted more people. so some people think bringing is not a big deal. That's why you have to specify.
I would expect my nieces to bring their kids and have them sit at the kids table when I make a wedding IYH. I'll probably be paying anyway and my guest list is not that huge....unless, you never know the other side.....

However Bar Mitzvas are usually smaller events with smaller minimums and I would never take my kids if not invited.

Sesame

Thu, Apr 28 2022, 12:44 pm

amother [ Outerspace ] wrote:

That’s such a shame. Why would you be hurt if your friend can’t afford to invite all her friends kids? Do ppl really take kids to every simcha they’re invited to (unless it Shabbos)?
She’s already paid for your place but you’d rather leave cos she invited her nephew but not your kids?
Is this the norm? Do ppl normally expect to bring children to a friends bar mitzvah/wedding? Or is this a matter of something done in different circles? Genuinely asking cos I’d never expect to take children to a simcha.

Simple1

Thu, Apr 28 2022, 12:58 pm

Not sure if this was mentioned, but I've seen at many Simchas they serve kiddie meals which I assume is much cheaper than adult plates. They are not portioned out, it's served in platters in the center of the kids tables. Food includes things like fries, shnitzel, franks in blanks, onion rings, but not necessarily all of the above. Even my 12 year old was happy with this at my nephew's bar mitzvah.

Personally, if my friend would get offended, I wouldn't say anything. But I do come from a culture we're we don't restrict the invitation lists. (But I do admit to not having a large amount of people to invite as we're a small family.) I also wouldn't bring my kids uninvited. I have a friend who years ago did bring her kids uninvited to a simcha of mine. At the time I thought it was weird, but years later I have very sweet memories of them at our simcha having a great time.

Last edited by Simple1 on Thu, Apr 28 2022, 1:00 pm; edited 2 times in total

watergirl

Thu, Apr 28 2022, 12:59 pm

Chayalle wrote:

We chose the place we did because it is a budget place, no minimum, you literally pay per person.

dankbar wrote:

Most halls you can set up a table with kid friendly food in center not pay for a portion for each child.

Like they would put a plate of chicken nugget & french fries in mid of table

Or you can make your own mini deli sandwiches in center.

Nope, not where we are doing it. I do not live in NY/NJ, there is not a large choice of halls where I live, and this is not so much a thing here. I've never seen it.

I am not making a wedding. I am making a bar mitzvah, this is a very very small simcha.

watergirl

Thu, Apr 28 2022, 1:00 pm

Simple1 wrote:

This is not an option where we are doing it. Plated is more expensive, buffet is less but still per person. We are doing a kids buffet and plated for adults. It's just a few dollar difference.

amother

Hunter

Thu, Apr 28 2022, 1:08 pm

Personally, I feel that regardless of finances, children really do not belong at all simchos, only very close relatives and friends.

People spend so much on simchos and they want their guest to participate in conversation and dancing. I live in Israel and I do not have much company at weddings because most of my cousins are so busy with their kids as young as 0-6. I leave my kids at home. I know it's pricey so if I dont want to pay a lot, I leave early.

My grandmother recently made a sheva brochos and told the grandchildren that babies cannot be brought due to the small size of the hall.

The simcha was fabulous! She was thrilled at how attentive and respectful everyone was to the chosson kallah and guest speakers instead of having screaming and shouting. Everyone enjoyed it immensley.

I am all into giving our kids a beautiful childhood with fun memories but let's be considerate to the bal simcha who is shelling out loads of money. We need to be selective as to which simchos we bring them to.

watergirl

Thu, Apr 28 2022, 1:10 pm

amother [ Outerspace ] wrote:

Hi, I am your friend. Not your "friend". I was open and vulnerable with you, and I told you that I can not afford to invite children. That would add a few hundred dollars, and for me, it is a lot. BH you clearly have no idea what it means to have to make choices like this. We are also making a very simple kiddush (cookies and cake only), shabbos meals for my tiny out of town family at my home that I am catering myself. Evites, not paper invitations. Name the price cutting option, we did it.

This hall is a small place, there is not a place for on-site babysitting. It's literally a storefront. A children's table with half price plates is not an option this place provides.

The other kids who will hopefully be there are my two nephews. That's it. If you can't see that, it's on you, not me. They look identical to the rest of my family so it's pretty clear they are immediate family.

If your friend was honest with you and said she could not afford to invite children, was making a bare bones simcha she is largely doing herself, she is a BT with almost no family, her mother is gone, her side of the family won't even show because they think the frum stuff is weird, and of her small guest list, she chose to include you because she feels close to you and wants you there to enhance the simcha, you would turn and leave? And say it's cringy?

You will have more friends like me in your life. Some are making their simcha from tzedakka funds. They can not invite your kids. Some have other reasons they can not invite them. Maybe your kids don't know the names of the baalei simcha. Please learn to look favorably on your friends who are living real life and have to make tough choices.

keym

Thu, Apr 28 2022, 1:37 pm

Maybe you can figure into the evite
Mr and Mrs Smith- invited for the dinner
Avrohom, Yitzchok, Yaakov Smith and Mr and Mrs Smith- can't wait to see you all at the kiddush.
And then follow up with a conversation "hi Chani. So we're great friends and you know my finances and family drama. So I can't have your kids come to the dinner, in fact the only kids coming are nephews. But tell your kids that Aunty Watergirl can't wait for them to come to the kiddush".
This is assuming that they can come to the kiddush and it's not too much to buy/bake a little more chocolate chip cookies.

Mazel Tov

watergirl

Thu, Apr 28 2022, 1:41 pm

keym wrote:

This is perfect actually because they will be invited with kids for the kiddush. I'll leave out the part about finances/drama and just be simple, and if anyone pushes, I can be more direct. Thank you!

amother

Hyssop

Thu, Apr 28 2022, 1:55 pm

Sesame wrote:

No. If the host says no children, it means all children. People don't want children at simchas for reasons other than financial as well. Amother Hunter already referred to this earlier. People spend lots of money for simchas and they may prefer a classy, quiet elegant affair. Children make lots of noise, babies cry, and carriages look very much out of place at such affairs.

You don't have to be of the same mindset to accept other people's preferences. Some people enjoy the children at their simchas, and for some people just don't. If the host clearly states their preferences, it's rude and inappropriate to bring along unwelcome guests.

Sesame

Thu, Apr 28 2022, 1:56 pm

amother [ Hyssop ] wrote:

I obviously mean where the host had not said no children!