S/O - boys and girls not sharing rooms - from when?

amother

DarkOrange

Mon, Jan 08 2024, 8:05 am

amother OP wrote:

From what age would you say a brother and sister shouldn't share a room?
Is there a difference between in general & occasionally on a vacation?

I moved out my daughter at 8, before onset of puberty.

amother

Tiffanyblue

Mon, Jan 08 2024, 8:11 am

amother Lawngreen wrote:

I worked in social services.
You can call it incest or you can call it abuse - but the most common form of abuse I have seen is with pubescent boys "trying things out" with or without consent with there sisters (sometimes brothers, but less common). There is also a TON of literature on this

Across the board, jewish and non jewish, across socio-economic circles, and in the jewish world across religious groups ( from super chassidish to completely secular)

So while I would not suspect my children, I think a healthy home fosters a sense of seperation between genders and mitigates opportunity. And Btw I have seen more issues with 9-11 year olds who came across p_rn and tried the stuff they saw out then with 16-17 year olds....

I understand abuse, especially preteen boys “experimenting”. That’s why I think the gender of the older kid matters.

When people write incest, I think of a consensual s*xual relationship and I guess I’m just naive because no I don’t think sleeping together would translate to incest.

amother

Cadetblue

Mon, Jan 08 2024, 8:13 am

amother Tiffanyblue wrote:

Yes it would.

amother

Lawngreen

Mon, Jan 08 2024, 8:17 am

amother Tiffanyblue wrote:

Incest means any s-xual behavior between first degree relatives - consensual and non-consensual (usually when its siblings the concept of consent is blurred)

But I have heard of cases where a 9 year old pulled down his 13 year old's pj's while she slept, and she woke up to being fingered....

Age doesn't necessarily protect. I our home we separate genders from around 6

amother

Hyacinth

Mon, Jan 08 2024, 8:17 am

amother Seafoam wrote:

This is a general statement that doesn't only apply to that situation.
If your daughter or son expresses discomfort over their having to share a room with their sister/brother, it's your responsibility as a parent to not ignore their discomfort & to find a different solution for them.

Gotcha. I misunderstood your previous post.

amother

Hyacinth

Mon, Jan 08 2024, 8:19 am

amother Navy wrote:

When I was in 6th grade I shared a room with my brother (2 years younger) and sister (5 years younger). Lasted about a year. We actually had a lot of fun together. I know this is different because 1- I was older and 2- there were multiple kids in the room but I don't think it's inherently malicious. You have to know your kids

And how would you know them?

amother

Iris

Mon, Jan 08 2024, 8:22 am

When we had company my yeshiva brother(off shabbos, etc) and I (I am younger by 7 years) shared a room, with a room divider.

When we went on vacation, my parents got one room and everyone slept in the one room.

It wasn't the norm, but once in a while, yes we did sleep in the same room as single adults.

amother

Zinnia

Mon, Jan 08 2024, 8:35 am

amother Cadetblue wrote:

They can create separations, with mechitzas or curtains etc…There really isn’t an excuse to do it. And many wrongs don’t make a right, so you can bring all the examples of people that did it, it’s still inappropriate for teens to share.

Innapropriate? And if there is no other space?
If everyone is dressed or covered, what is the actual issue?

Ema of 5

Mon, Jan 08 2024, 8:35 am

amother Tiffanyblue wrote:

We hope that more often than not, sharing a room (I assume that’s what you mean by sleeping together) won’t lead to incest/abuse, but we are not naive enough to think it never happens. Therefore, we try to minimize the risk in the first place.
We hope that more often than not, being in a car without being properly restrained won’t cause harm. However we are not naive enough to think that it never happens. Therefore we try to minimize the risk and wear our seatbelts.

amother

Zinnia

Mon, Jan 08 2024, 8:36 am

amother Cerulean wrote:

People that I know in that situation will have teens of one gender sleep in the living room area.

And for some, there is no space in their living room as the living room is also the dinning room so there is one couch and a large dinning room table. No sleeping room at all.

amother

Zinnia

Mon, Jan 08 2024, 8:38 am

Bnei Berak 10 wrote:

I live in Israel and apartments are *small*. Still nobody would mix boys and girls sleeping arrangements. The boys would be sleeping in the living room on a sofa turning into beds and girls in the room.
My SIL with a three bedroom apt and 9 kids (six boys and three girls) had this set up. Two of the boys in the living room.

Nobody? The first example is of my relatives who live in haifa. The kids all sleep in one room. The living is the dinning. One couch, cant open, and a large dinning room table.
But Im glad that you know "nobody" would mix genders.

amother

Hyacinth

Mon, Jan 08 2024, 8:39 am

Ema of 5 wrote:

The voice of reason

shabbatiscoming

Mon, Jan 08 2024, 8:39 am

amother Whitesmoke wrote:

If I’m not mistaken modern orthodox are always okay with it, because they don’t believe incest will occur. But, if someone else is modern orthodox and thinks I’m wrong, you can correct me.

What a truly bizarre response.
And quite rude.

Bnei Berak 10

Mon, Jan 08 2024, 8:43 am

amother Zinnia wrote:

And for some, there is no space in their living room as the living room is also the dinning room so there is one couch and a large dinning room table. No sleeping room at all.

There are sofas that open up to a double bed for two adults.

shabbatiscoming

Mon, Jan 08 2024, 8:45 am

amother Tiffanyblue wrote:

Huh? Then what did you think incest means?
Here is the definition: s-xual relations between people classed as being too closely related to marry each other.

Bnei Berak 10

Mon, Jan 08 2024, 8:48 am

amother Zinnia wrote:

I should have stated that I refer to my circles which are chareidi.

amother

Zinnia

Mon, Jan 08 2024, 8:49 am

Bnei Berak 10 wrote:

There are sofas that open up to a double bed for two adults.

As I said, there was no room. Couch, large table. That was it. Why is this so hard to comprehend?

ShishKabob

Mon, Jan 08 2024, 8:54 am

It's really a halachic issue and I don't know all of the nitty and gritty of it. But it's not a 'feeling' or personal opinion type of thing. All you have to do is ask.
However, I do recall something to the effect that brothers and sisters should not share a room over 30 days or something like that. I'm not sure about the ages.
Of course, if it's over a shabbos or a very temporary thing it's different.