8-year-old DD with Poor Attitude. Why?

amother

Sun, Jun 06 2010, 10:10 am

I have an 8-year-old daughter who often displays a poor attitude. By "poor attitude", I mean that she regularly whines, moans, and just generally seems unhappy with little reason.

I believe that we have good discipline in the home. Since my kids were little, I have not rewarded whining, complaining, or arguing. The kids know if they start with that they don't get what they want. If they speak to me in a demanding or whining tone of voice, I require them to correct their tone and communicate in a pleasant way. I have tried to teach them that there are polite and pleasant ways to state one's desires without being petulant.

I don't believe that she is spoiled in other ways. We give her occasional gifts at appropriate times and supply her other needs in a modest way.

She seems to be happy in school, where she is doing well and has friends. We try to show her a lot of love at home.

Sometimes she seems very happy, but we generally have at least one period (and sometimes multiple extended sessions) a day of moaning, groaning, whining, and even screaming with little cause. For example, this morning, I told her to do her hair, so she started whining. "It's too hard. I'm hot." She's eight and has been doing her own hair for a while now. I told her just to put it back in a simple pony tail to get it off of her neck. She started whining and then threw the brush so that it hit the wall. Then she proceeded to whine and stomp around like a wronged being. I really don't get it. I generally ignore her or tell her that she will miss out on some excursion if her attitude continues to be poor. If it is appropriate, I may validate her feelings, yet remain firm in my requirement that she change her attitude. This has little effect. If the consequence is something that really speaks to her she will often pull it together, but is often still somewhat sullen and unpleasant to be around. Sometimes she does have cause to be upset, but long after my other children would have gotten over it, she seems to revel in any injustice or discomfort and unhappiness.

Confused

yo'ma

Sun, Jun 06 2010, 10:33 am

I can't help you because my 7 yr old ds is the same way. Maybe it's the age. Sometimes I think he needs to see someone because he seems so unhappy, but then he's fine. When he's calm, I try to explain to him that not everything is a big deal and we can try to figure out how to deal with the problem like normal people. I also remind him to smile because it's very hard to be upset while you're smiling. Smile

amother

Sun, Jun 06 2010, 6:04 pm

GreenEyes26 wrote:

What is she, a science experiment? Your clinical and cold summary of her attitude speaks more volumes to me than your daughters behavior.

Okay. You are really jumping to lots of conclusions here.

GreenEyes26 wrote:

She's an 8 year old girl. Girls are obnoxious, moody, and temperamental. Zehu.

That is little sad. Do you have an 8-year-old girl? If you do, I think it is a little sad that you feel this way about her. I want to have a good relationship with my daughter, to enjoy spending time with her, and have mostly positive thoughts about her. I expect a certain amount of immaturity and annoyance, but if I'm thinking, "Oh, here we go again. She's going to be impossible to be around for the rest of the morning," or whatever on a regular basis, then, in my mind, there is a problem. It might be my problem, it might be hers, it might be something else, but I am not going to resign myself to think that dd is just "obnoxious, moody, and temperamental." How do you enjoy being around someone who fits that description?

amother

Sun, Jun 06 2010, 6:11 pm

OP, your DD and my DD (also 8yr old) should form a club of whiney-and-upset-because-they're-wronged-by-the-world 8yr olds. Mine also behaves in a similar manner sometimes, thogh I dont really keep track of how frequently she does. I usually don't take it too seriously so long as she is generally happy. Like adults, they can have have ups and downs in their lives. I've learned threatening or bribing is not effective and won't make it easier for her. She probably knows she's old and sensible enough to follow your instructions or routines, but for whatever reason doesn't want to follow. I don't want to focus too much on negativity, though I admit it's really challenging not to lose my own temper.

amother

Sun, Jun 06 2010, 6:18 pm

yo'ma wrote:

Yes, sometimes she just seems so unhappy, I start to really wonder what is wrong. Then other times she seems very happy. My other kids definitely have their moments, believe me, but they do not give me the impression they they are just unhappy/unsatisfied in general. When my five-year-old loses it, sometimes she really loses it, but then she goes back to being normal. When my two-year-old has a tantrum, it can be all-out, but he gets over it and the total impression I get is "normal kid". I don't know why, but that is not the impression I get from dd when she is in one of her moods. Maybe it is just the age, as you write, I don't know, but she has had this issue for several years now.

yo'ma

Sun, Jun 06 2010, 6:34 pm

amother wrote:

yo'ma wrote:

My ds also has always been like this, but since school started, in March, it just seems worse and more often. I try to relish when he's in a good mood, but the littlest nothing could bother him. When he does start losing it, I tell him to go to his room, until he's calm and we can talk like normal people. Just before, he started complaining to me about something and I wasn't listening, so he said, as usual, you don't care about me, blah, blah, blah. I basically told him, he's like the boy who cried wolf. He complains so much and so many things bother him, when am I supposed to know when it's a real problem. I'm just hoping he'll grow out of it. Good luck!!
BTW, when he's in a good mood, he's such a pleasure to be around and have a conversation with.

amother

Sun, Jun 06 2010, 6:34 pm

GR wrote:

Sounds to me like she needs some listening to.

What kind of listening to do you mean? We talk everyday, for at least an hour or two a day. If she has frustrations or complaints, I really try to listen to what she has to say. That said, I think she is old enough to at least try to talk about things in a normal way. If she is going to scream, whine, and so on, then, no, I don't really feel like hearing it. If she voices a complaint at a time when she is unable to communicate normally, I may not listen then, but I will try to bring it up later when we can talk in a more neutral way.

I really try to make her life nice for her, like most mothers probably do. Where can I go if I am just constantly getting "not fair" kinds of complaints? Like when she is upset that her sister has no to little schoolwork, while she has to do more? I can explain to her 100 times that it is normal for a girl her age to the amount of work she has, while is is normal for a girl her sister's age to have the amount she has, but it does no good. I can tell her that when she was her sister's age, she also had very little work to do, but it doesn't matter to her. I can explain that she has certain privileges as an older girl that her sister doesn't have because she is younger, but it is still "not fair". Where can I go from there?

What am I supposed to think when her younger siblings can accept and move past minor disappointments, but she cannot? I just don't listen to her enough? If you have any more specific suggestions, I would be happy to hear them. Thanks.

amother

Sun, Jun 06 2010, 6:42 pm

amother wrote:

At least I am not alone. Very Happy

She definitely has ups and downs! I just wish the downs were less frequent.

I also wonder why she doesn't want to follow routines when there is a clear pay off for her. It seems like she sabotages herself! Like if we are going to do something fun that I know she wants to do, but she cannot get past her mood to do what she needs to do to make the fun thing happen. That leaves me really scratching my head. Confused

gryp

Sun, Jun 06 2010, 6:59 pm

amother wrote:

GR wrote:

Sounds to me like she needs some listening to.

I think that everyone needs some kvetch time. It's okay to be kvetchy sometimes and still be heard. Like you, I can't stand kvetching but I try and remind myself that a little kvetchiness is perfectly okay and I should give some leeway with it.

I hear that you are explaining things to her when she starts her "it's not fair" routine. How about skipping the explanations and just hearing her out? She can probably repeat back to you all of those explanations and yet still feel like she was not heard. Validate, sympathize, do some wishful thinking on her level. And she will feel understood.

These are my thoughts based on what you posted.

AlwaysGrateful

Sun, Jun 06 2010, 10:13 pm

Just to add on to what GR said, I think she means NOT trying to solve the problem for her. Instead, just saying things like "It must be really frustrating that your sister seems to have all this free time,a nd you're stuck studying" or "You sound really upset about that." I know that I don't like it when poeple try to "fix" my problems when really I just want sympathy. You're obviously trying very hard to be a good mother. It seems like this might help.

daisy

Sun, Jun 06 2010, 10:48 pm

I have a child like that too and it is challenging. One suggestion I have is to try to look for patterns when this behavior occurs. I noticed that my daughter gets particularly difficult when she is hungry. I have pointed this out to her, and now she will come to me in the middle of a tantrum and say (not always in the nicest way) "I am hungry, give me food". She is usually a different person after she eats.

I also agree with GR about listening, and I am working on doing this with dd. It does help.

yo'ma

Sun, Jun 13 2010, 3:26 pm

I started a few days ago with my ds making him "coupons". At the end of the day before he goes to bed, if he doesn't kvetch at all, I give him one coupon. When he's ready to cash it in, I'm going to give him something. The more he has, the bigger the thing. I have no idea what yet, but he's giving me ideas Wink

. We did decide that one coupon gets him a balloon. Yesterday morning he threw a fit about something, so quite awhile before bedtime I mentioned matter of factly that if I don't give him one and he throws a fit that I didn't give him one, he doesn't get one for the next day. He's very logical and said of course, I know. Bl"ah, it's working out really well. He has 2 coupons and should be getting one today, so far. The only day he didn't yet was yesterday. He's trying very hard because he wants the coupons.

amother

Thu, Jun 17 2010, 2:03 pm

Thanks for all the posts.

Regarding the "listening" (validation, etc.), I have tried that tack in the past and still use it sometimes. Yes, I've read How to Talk So Kids Will Listen.... LOL

For example, with the school work example, I might say. "You don't want to do your schoolwork. I wish you didn't have to do your schoolwork. It must be hard to do your schoolwork when your see your sister playing," etc. I wouldn't necessarily say all those things at once in exactly that way, but you get the idea. I personally have found that she has to be in just the right mood for those kinds of statements to make a positive difference. Often, if I validate her feelings, she just gets more upset when the expectation (that she do her work, for example) remains. It's as if she thinks, "Now I know Mommy understands me, so why is she still making me do this? It's so unfair."

As far as patterns I have noticed when dd gets like this, it is mostly when she does not want to do something I have asked her to do. I am pretty careful to make my requirements age- and ability-appropriate, so I don't think it's that I ask too much. Yes, if she were hungry or tired, it would be worse, but she has these issues when she is perfectly well rested and fed and wonderfully happy only moments ago. Like this morning, she was in a good mood, playing, etc. Then I asked her to do her regular chore. Lots of whining, complaining, and banging around ensued. Her chore is harder than her sister's; it's not fair and so on. I've seen her do this chore many times easily and quickly. Today she doesn't want to do it. That's it.

FranticFrummie

Fri, Jun 25 2010, 12:23 am

Oh no, you mean my 7 year old won't grow out of it? shock

It's totally normal. It's hard for me to look at my beautiful, sweet, charming little mitzvah girl, and realize that sometimes she can be a real jerk!

What I do is I use reflective listening, and DON'T feed into the negative behavior.

*pouting in the corner*
"It sounds to me like you are very upset about xyz right now. That's too bad, because we're going to go have some fun doing abc. When you're ready to join us we'd love to have you come over."
*whines some more*
"You seem very worried about that. How would you like to see that get fixed?"
*grumbles*
*eventually wanders over to join the rest of the family*

It doesn't always clear up so quickly, but if you stay calm and keep reflecting back, she'll know that 1. you're listening to her and 2. you're not freaking out and getting upset. She needs to know that you're still in charge. If you have a meltdown too, then she'll feel very insecure. Your stoicism is very reassuring to her.