Baby left unattended at a wedding - WWYD?

Raisin

Sat, Sep 04 2010, 9:09 pm

Tova wrote:

shlomitsmum wrote:

amother wrote:

http://www.pbs.org/parents/experts/archive/2010/09/is-it-ever-safe-to-leave-your.html

Why amother???

Honestly ...If you are so sure child endangerment is so OK post using your own name.

It takes ONLY second for a tragedy to happen ,I DO NOT TAKE CHANCES! Exploding anger

I don't think any of the examples in the article constitute child endangerement (even if I wouldn't do it myself).

It was a short interesting read, actually, a different twist than what you usually read.

I agree. I think walking kids across a supermarket car park is probably more dangerous then leaving them in the car while you return the cart.

I certainly leave my kids in the car while I return the cart. Having said that, the cart drop off is close enough that I can see the car while I do it. the supermarket with a very large car park actually has lots of cart return areas.

Mommastuff

Sat, Sep 04 2010, 9:51 pm

Tova wrote:

Question - how would you rate the following options in terms of safety? Let's say kids in question are ages 1.5 to 3.

You are at the supermarket and have kids in the cart plus a full cart of groceries. Obviously when I talk about "leaving the kids" there are no adults you know in sight to ask them to keep an eye out.

1) Leave kids and groceries in cart at front of store while you get the car and drive up to the front to load everyone and the stuff in.

2) Take cart to car, load kids and stuff in, leave kids there while you sprint across lot to return the cart.

3) Leave groceries in cart at front of store, cross busy parking lot with the squirming kids. When you get to the car you have to release grip of one of them to open doors and buckle the other one in the carseat.

I have this dilemma CONSTANTLY. Thankfully the supermarket is moving to a location where they will have cart pick-up/returns in the lot so it should make option #2 much more safe.

I always have at least one kid with me when shopping.
In response to each:
1- I would never leave a kid in the cart and walk away.

2- I recently went shopping with 2 kids (all my kids are under 6) and was VERY tempted to dart back to the store with the bags and kids tucked in the car, but couldn't bring myself to go, even with the door openned to see them all the way there. I was about to unpack the kids when I asked a passerby a favor to return the cart, which she so generously did for me.

3- I'd hate to leave my purchases for anyone to smoothly pass by and lift something, but if that were the only choice, I'd bribe the kids to make it to the car quickly and hope that nothing is missing.

As mentioned by someone else, why can't you leave an empty stroller outside and either carry the kid in a carrier or in your hand? I many times take my tiniest stroller into the store so I can go through the narrow isles.

I'd hate for someone to learn their lesson only after something happens!!

Atali

Sat, Sep 04 2010, 9:57 pm

Tova wrote:

I do option #2 or #3, depending on the store.

Tova

Sat, Sep 04 2010, 10:36 pm

I don't understand the stroller option. I've done small shoppings with the snap-n-go before but that's only when I've had the baby with me. I've also on occassion walked to the store in question with my double, but again, small basket (also, it blocks aisles during busy times and from experience don't fit through check-out lane. So I have to load items on conveyor belt and then take the stroller around.

Option #3 - the emphasis is on the dealing with the kids in the parking lot with them not being in a cart. Not on the fact of leaving my groceries. I have zero concern of leaving groceries and in the remote chance that someone took an item or two would not care enough to have regreted doing it.

the world's best mom

Sat, Sep 04 2010, 10:56 pm

I would not leave my kids on one floor of the library while I go upstairs. They might wander off, take hundreds of books off the shelves, attack the computers, or something like that. Danger doesn't have to mean kidnappers, it could be the kid climbing up the shelves to reach a book and toppling it on himself. I know my kids do these things, and I wouldn't put it past most other kids.

Kayza

Sun, Sep 05 2010, 1:54 pm

mammele26 wrote:

About your question of how would I deal? I would walk off with both, and leave a note on the wall near where they left their babies with a # to reach me. When they would call I would only return the babies after the mothers VERBALLY give me their promise (not just them nodding to my words) that they will never do this again.

Nice fantasy, but totally out of line. This would never have to reach a court for you to be totally messed up, bit legally and for your family in the community. See, if you walk off with the kid(s) and leave a number, the police could wind up on your doorstep - and they could prosecute you regardless of what the parents decide to do. And, of course, it's your word against theirs as to what actually happened. Which means that even if you wound up winning a court trial, you would be up against serious trouble. From the police's pov, if it really was such a dangerous situation for the child, you should have called them. If you get lucky and the parent calls you, the second you say "I'm not giving the kid back unless" you are again in deep trouble, and at that point you have an even bigger problem if the police decide to charge you (which they can, even if the parents are not interested.)

Of course, if you do manage to make the claim that attempted kidnapping (which is what you could be charged with) was justified, a highly likely result would be that the child(ren) would be taken from the family. Nice result - and something that could have some seriously nasty repercussions for you and your family.

Kayza

Sun, Sep 05 2010, 2:04 pm

Merrymom wrote:

Why is it the shopkeeper's fault now? The mothers have to go out davka at that time of the day? Let them wait until their husbands come home and they can go out without the baby.

Your husband must have quite unusual schedule. For most women shopping during the day is their only realistic option, and most formal work schedules keep employees at work during the day.

Merrymom

Sun, Sep 05 2010, 10:23 pm

Kayza wrote:

Merrymom wrote:

Why is it the shopkeeper's fault now? The mothers have to go out davka at that time of the day? Let them wait until their husbands come home and they can go out without the baby.

Your husband must have quite unusual schedule. For most women shopping during the day is their only realistic option, and most formal work schedules keep employees at work during the day.

My husband has an unusual schedule because he's home in the evening? That's a new one even though I have to work my schedule around his minyan etc.

It's not my right to leave my kid outside because it's difficult for me. That's just life. You chose to have those babies, now take care of them!

Kayza

Sun, Sep 05 2010, 11:08 pm

[quote="Merrymom"]

Kayza wrote:

My husband has an unusual schedule because he's home in the evening? That's a new one even though I have to work my schedule around his minyan etc.

Nice try at twisting words. It's pretty surprising though, although I really shouldn't be surprised that someone would make suggestions that she should know are totally nonsensical. If your husband is home only in the evening, then you know that it's not practical to shop only when you husband is home. But, since you don't have a stroller, and don't like having strollers in the store, you made that suggestion.

Quote:

It's not my right to leave my kid outside because it's difficult for me. That's just life. You chose to have those babies, now take care of them!

Which, as you know, is not what I ever said. You said women should not shop when they need strollers - only shop when their husbands are home, rather than trying to get stores to be more stroller friendly.

flowerpower

Sun, Sep 05 2010, 11:45 pm

Since it's erev yom hamishpat, let's be dan lekaf zechus. Perhaps there was a sitter or girl watching the babies and they went to look for the moms because the babies were getting hungry. I don't think this situation is thaaaaaaaaaaaat bad sounding as leaving a toddler in a car or outside a store alone.

I would shake the babies until someone would fetch them or have a kid ask around the whole ladies side while shaking the strollers.

shanie5

Mon, Sep 06 2010, 12:07 am

There is a debate about shopping carts, kids & groceries. Do you put the kids in the car, then the groceries (car can be stolen while you load and there go the kids) or put groceries in the car first and then the kids (cart can roll away when you turn to put groceries in trunk, or cart can get hit by a moving vehicle).

Some things are just no win and one has to do their best and trust in HKBH. Though leaving a child unattended at a wedding or in front of the store while one shops is not a healthy thing in my eyes.

louche

Mon, Sep 06 2010, 2:36 am

united we stand. why in the world don't women in these communities--and you know who you are--COOPERATE with each other? take turns: you watch my kids for an hour while I shop and I watch your kids for an hour while you shop. Or ask an adult at your table to watch your kid while you go to the bathroom. Surely one doesn't need to be a member of Mensa to figure this out?

Also, and I may be risking getting flamed here, but when it comes to a simcha, you can't expect to behave as if you're a singe girl or a newlywed and dance the way you did once upon a time. Either hire a sitter yourself, or be satisfied with simply being at the simcha and not participating fully. As a mother of an infant, you're not in a position to dance every dance, or possibly any dances.

personally I think that, because of the noise among other things, the best place for an infant to be at a wedding is in his own home. If that's not possible, then hire a sitter to watch him full time outside, or content yourself with coming for just a short while, making sure the baalei hasimcha see that you were there, and then go home.

Kayza

Mon, Sep 06 2010, 10:44 am

Louche, you make some good points. When you have young kids, then, yes, even getting a quick pair of stockings may take some logistical planning. That's a reality, and you have to live with it. Cooperative shopping can be an excellent idea (much like round robin babysitting). It does mean more planning, but that's life with very young children.

And, I agree that if you have very young kids, you are generally better off with them staying home, rather than taking them to a wedding. If it's not practical, you are going to have to make some compromises - either spend money on a sitter or limit your activities.

The problem is when the unexpected happens. Even with the best planning, things just don't always go the way you expected, especially when young children are involved. It's important to cut people some slack, and not to assume that people are horrible, selfish, disorganized and just lapin awful mothers without some solid information. "the baby was alone for 20 minutes at the wedding" may very well be only a small part of a larger story you have no clue about.

Merrymom

Mon, Sep 06 2010, 11:14 pm

[quote="Kayza"]

Merrymom wrote:

Kayza wrote:

My husband has an unusual schedule because he's home in the evening? That's a new one even though I have to work my schedule around his minyan etc.

Quote:

It's not my right to leave my kid outside because it's difficult for me. That's just life. You chose to have those babies, now take care of them!

No, I never said anything remotely like that. What I did say is not to give a whole sob story about how it's so hard to get around that you have no choice but to leave your child unattended if you want to get any shopping done.

manhattanmom

Mon, Sep 06 2010, 11:28 pm

flowerpower wrote:

Um. I wouldn't trust a sitter or girl who does this. If the baby is hungry and needs its mommy, pick the baby up out of the stroller and carry him/her into the simcha hall/store, etc. to its mommy.

And at a simcha, finding a crying baby...I know it may be embarrassing, but maybe have the band announce it?