Child abuse or something to ignore?!?

supermommy

Mon, Jul 17 2006, 3:18 pm

The other day when I was walking to drop my dd at school I was walking behind a woman and her children. Suddenly I noticed her PINCHING her dd all the way up her arm. At first I wasn't sure I really saw what I saw and thought maybe there was something wrong with her sleeve or something but then the mother did it again and hard. shock

This girl mustve been 8 or so years old and didn't seem to be doing anything wrong (which still wouldn't justify this.) WWYD? should I say something to the school? I don't even know the name of this woman I just recognize her as a parent in the school. Or maybe I should just keep my nose out of peoples business?

avigayil

Mon, Jul 17 2006, 3:32 pm

Maybe the girl was giving her mother a hard time about going to school?
If she was kvetching a lot, the mom might hav lost it and used the pinching as a last ditch tactic to make her walk with her.

Did the girl look like she was in distress?

amother

Mon, Jul 17 2006, 3:36 pm

My mother used to do that to me all the time in public as a way of abusing us "secretly." But when we were home, behind closed doors, it was much, much worse. So there is definitely the possibility that this girl is abused. But even if I saw it happening, I wouldn't know the correct way to approach the situation...

supermommy

Mon, Jul 17 2006, 6:03 pm

to me it didn't look like the girl was refusing to walk or anything of that sort but when I passed by she had teary eyes and was sniffling. The only reason this rang alarm bells for me was because when I was young we had some shabbos geusts and the father of the family had his small son sitting next to him and every so often for no reason at all kept pinching him. Later we found out that he was very abusive to his children and his wife. Sad

The problem with talking to someone in the school is that I don't know her name, I would have to keep an eye and point her out when I do see her.
Also, what if it's nothing? Would I be responsible for tearing apart a family for nothing?(and what if it is something and don't do something to stop it?)

carrot

Mon, Jul 17 2006, 7:28 pm

supermommy wrote:

Also, what if it's nothing? Would I be responsible for tearing apart a family for nothing?(and what if it is something and don't do something to stop it?)

If you make sure to talk to someone who you know to be sensitive and "emotionally intelligent," (and not just whoever happens to be in the office in the moment) this can be looked into without tearing any families apart. If it turns out to be nothing, no harm done. If it turns out to be something, you will have been glad you spoke up. (Although in many/most cases if there is ongoing physical abuse the school is already aware of it.)

Secbeb

Mon, Jul 17 2006, 8:24 pm

I personally would alert the teacher. I don't think that this action would "tear the family apart". I can't imagine that the woman will get arrested right away or the children getting taken away but it would probably heighten the awareness of the teacher and staff and they would know to look out for it. If the mother is abusive something should be done for the safety of the child.

Last edited by Secbeb on Mon, Jul 17 2006, 8:44 pm; edited 1 time in total

healthymama

Mon, Jul 17 2006, 9:00 pm

Quote:

to me it didn't look like the girl was refusing to walk or anything of that sort but when I passed by she had teary eyes and was sniffling

Okay, I know we are supposed to be dan lekaf zhus and all, but what scenario could you come up with that explains a pinching parent, a crying child and no abuse ?

If I were you, I would look out for the child, ask her name if you see her ( make up a pretext) and tell the nurse/teacher/school counselor

what is the school like ? Has no one else noticed ?

avigayil

Mon, Jul 17 2006, 9:09 pm

Hmmm, maybe you could meet with the principal or call her and discuss the situation. Usually they are well trained in dealing with these situations and know how to deal with them appropriatly. I might just call her and tell her...then it is off your conscience.

Nachisdoll

Mon, Sep 11 2006, 4:26 pm

Definitly tell a principle...and follow up on it! Make sure its something being monitored and taken care of. Unfortunatly not everyone takes these things seriously and I personaly know a few ppl who have been abused as kids and noone said a thing SPEAK UP! Its YOUR RESPONSIBILITY if you saw something...its a child...and a jewish child at that! And if its not abuse nothing will happen besides investigations...If I pinched my kid in public that bad and someone saw and call ASC or whatever children services is called and they investigated me I dont think id be so upset id think twice b4 I over pinched again!

Tefila

Mon, Sep 11 2006, 5:58 pm

Quote:

Even if the mother is not abusive, maybe she can be taught that there are better methods of discipline... Definitely tell someone, just use common sense and tell someone who is not an alarmist

Hisorerus

amother

Mon, Sep 11 2006, 7:36 pm

Be very careful before you accuse someone of abusing her child.
Someone very close to me was once falsely accused. The child's grandparents were babysitting and noticed a bruise on the 4 year old's leg while getting her ready for bed. The woman's in-laws called their son and requested that their son call them from a public payphone to discuss something "very serious" without the wife there. The husband told the wife what was going on and she would not let him go alone. She remained quiet throughout the conversation. When she was told what she was accused of her life changed drastically. It was a major shock to her. She is a loving, caring mother who doesn't even spank her children and now she was suddenly accused of abusing them! The accusation has made her extremely distrusting of her in-laws. She is afraid to this day to even reprimand her chidlren in front of them. As a result of this (her in-laws insisted that they were correct), she became very depressed and withdrawn.

Just be careful...you may end up accusing someone comepletely innocent and permanently changing her life!

sarahd

Tue, Sep 12 2006, 5:24 am

Amother, the situations are not at all comparable. Supermommy saw a woman painfully pinching her child and the child was crying, so this is not a mommy who "doesn't even spank her children".

Why would you be having more rachmonus on an adult than on the child in her care who might well be suffering abuse? What if you end up permanently ruining (or endangering) this child's life because you were more worried about the mother than the child?

Flowerchild

Tue, Sep 12 2006, 8:25 am

abuse is a very huge accusation and its tough to deal with. in this case its very important to take it slowly because you really honestly dont know why she was pinching her, what if the girl was crying before the mother pinched her and what if the mother was pinching her to make her stop crying, and just because she pinched her doesnt mean she abuses her. anytime you accuse a parent of abuse and bring it to light it will permanently stick even if there is no abuse because if people find out and there was no abuse this woman will have looks and maybe the community will scrutinize her for a long while which can cause some issues. now if you truly feel that you want to do something the best person to speak to about this is the teacher. the reason for that is because she sees the girl most of the day and she has a better understanding of girls personality and her home life hopefully and if she is a certified teacher she is trained in recognizing abuse. I dont think that its ok to involve the principle yet.

so speak to the teacher in private and make sure that this will be done discreetly until you make sure that there is no real abuse, try to keep this quiet until the teacher figures out things. if it is abuse the teacher will know what to do.

leahj

Tue, Sep 12 2006, 7:29 pm

I would say something to the principal or nurse. Stating the facts of what you observed is not accusing anybody of anything. You are just pointing out what you saw. Maybe the nurse/principal will then be more aware or maybe they "thought" they saw something but didn't follow through or maybe someone else mentioned something and now they will follow through - or maybe it is nothing - at least you will have piece of mind.