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Book "Unchosen"
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Motek




 
 
    
 

Post Tue, Apr 18 2006, 9:21 am
nicole81 wrote:
I'm a bt; my husband is from a chassidishe background. we are both modern now.


nicole - Did your husband read the book? I wonder what his thoughts are on this subject.
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chocolate moose




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Oct 25 2006, 7:58 am
Anyone read it?

please see previous posts - mod
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ny21




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Oct 25 2006, 8:00 am
I saw this book in a Ex- satmers

persons home .They offered me the book but I was not interested .
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HappyPurim




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Oct 25 2006, 8:06 am
Yes I read it, its written nicer then I though it would be.....
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busymom




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Oct 25 2006, 8:18 am
read it some months ago, so don't recall every detail, but I had very mixed feelings about it. obviously, she is representing just one part of chassidic society that isn't very pretty, but she does so in a pretty straightforward, objective manner, so it would probably have been worse had she been judgemental and critical of chassidim as a whole... also, one character whom she discusses at length clearly has emotional (mental?) issues that would be there no matter how he had been raised. so what's the point of using him as an example?

I think most characters would fall into one of these catagories:
1. they are rebelling for the sake of rebelling. s/th in their upbringing has made them bitter/angry, and so in turning against their parents/community, they also turn against the values they preach. (emotional reasons)
2. some (less of these) are davka intelligent ppl who were disappointed in the narrow-mindedness of those around them, believing that this is not what Hashem wanted yiddishkeit to look like. ("robotic" jews, discouragement of questions or too much thinking, corruption in society...) basically they are disillusioned. if I remember correctly, one such person gave up on yiddishkeit as a whole b/c of it, but one became a "chassidic rebel", meaning he may have left the chassidic lifestyle but didn't become irreligious. (intellectual reasons)
3. yetzer hora: quite simply, they had desires and not a strong enough upbringing to resist them. the just wanted to see "what's out there"

one thing I found disturbing in this book is the author's repeated discussions about chassiddishe women being discouraged from any intellectual pursuits. b/c most her time with "non-rebel chassidim" was spent with satmar women - who DO learn less than others - she got this impression, and even in satmar, I think the phenomenon is not as bad as she made it out to be. (perhaps w/ rare exceptions)


Last edited by busymom on Wed, Oct 25 2006, 12:18 pm; edited 2 times in total
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busymom




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Oct 25 2006, 12:08 pm
Amazon reviews:
Quote:
Reviewer: Tenorgil "Gil" (Sharon, MA USA)
This is an easy to read book, with important true-life stories. Told well and honestly. I recognize many of the characters from my own experiences in the litvishe yeshiva world. If you want to gain insight into the complexity of a wonderful but imperfect community -- read this book. It is not condemning, and it does not mean that all Hasidim are sad and wanting more. The author is quite matter-of-factly about what she found. And many of the accounts and stories made me laugh. Although the topic as a whole is challenging. There is a good story here, one that is hopeful, especially with people like Malkie, and others who humanize these people. Read it, think, hope, and maybe even help out. See others as people, real people with real issues. Don't be fooled by the garb. There are real people in the black coat, some happy, some sad, and many are quite wonderful.


Quote:
Reviewer: Ester B. Lubman "Ebala"
This book shouldn't be a surprise to anyone. Such phenomenon as these "rebels" reflects the state of many chasidic groups today. Do they really have anything in common with the original intention of the Baal Shem Tov? Most of these "rebels" living in chasidic communities never knew what real chasidus is. Surprising? Not at all! Learn history of Chasidus and you'll understand. But such rebels can't be called smart people either. Instead of throwing away Yiddishkayt altogether betraying their Jewish brethren, they could rather seek the real chasidus, which does exist, and one who wants to find it can do it. But "rebels" think it is easier to throw everything in the garbage (together with their lives) because of frustration, rather than to seek. But this is not what the Bashefer wants from them. And they can't justify themselves saying that they couldn't hold it anymore. They could search deeper if they only wanted to, they could leave not the Yiddishkayt, but those who made an external game out of it. And they could find real Yiddishkayt if they only wanted to, instead of committing a spiritual suicide. Such books can't offer any help to these troubles souls because they have no idea how to do it. They only can present "juicy" stories and retell such problems more and more instead of offering real spiritual help to these people.

Quote:
Reviewer: Just another Jew (USA) poorly written, and clearly biased. I was extremely disappointed in the book.

Quote:
Reviewer: Educated Hassidic Female (Brooklyn)
Reading this book made me sad and angry. It paints a picture of a people that is in large part, untrue. Yes , there are misfits in any community, but the Hassidim as a whole are G-d fearing people with very intact and emotionally healthy families. If Hella Winston is searching for acclaim as a writer - it would have benefited her to have interviewed the families of her subjects to find out their perspectives. I have personally met at least two characters in her book and they are highly unstable and chemically imbalanced. How unfortunate to characterize an entire people by its misfits. Some her research is just plain false.For example, although our children are initially sheltered from as much immorality as possible, Ultra Orthodox women can engage in as much intellectual stimulation as they please. Case in point: the writer of this review.

Quote:
Reviewer: RaynaL (New York City)
I found this book to be a very compelling read. I could not put it down. The individual stories were fascinating and I learned a lot about the Hasidic way of life--something that has always interested me living in New York City. Any reader who comes to this book with an open mind will I believe see that this book is not fundamentally a critique of the Hasidic way of life but an exploration of the thoughts and feelings and experiences of people who do not want to/cannot live that way. Even if you are not Jewish I believe you will get a lot out of this book because we all struggle with conflicts in our lives and while these people's struggles might be magnified, it is possible to see elements of our own within theirs.
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chocolate moose




 
 
    
 

Post Thu, Oct 26 2006, 1:19 pm
I left it out as a coffee table book with the other 3 Jewish boks I picked up this week.

Not a few minutes, later, DH brings it into the bedroom, hides it in a pile of laundry, and states - not for a frum house!

I didn't think much about it as I knw it'd be a little offbeat, until I glanced inside........

Offbeat isn't the word. It's a nasty book.

And yes, I read the Mystics Mavericks and it was along the same lines.............
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