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Forum
-> Interesting Discussions
amother
Floralwhite
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Tue, Dec 25 2018, 2:48 pm
I know a lot of people ask for tuition breaks from the yeshivas but is it fair when they live lavish and spend on everything for themselves. Pls don’t start about how vacations are ‘necessary for health” and all the nonsense. How is it right to cut back on the cheshbon of the yeshivas at the same time you refuse to cut down on your on luxuries, yes going away for Pesach is a luxury (and people go to hotels while they don’t pay full tuition) and even if they don’t they spend and spend on themselves, fancy sheitals, clothes (it’s necessary for mental health uh huh) vacations, eating out. It’s wrong, if you’re living on the dime of the Yeshiva by not paying full you shouldn’t be splurging on your own lifestyle. Shouldn’t the tuition come first and be paid first before you spend on other things?
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amother
Beige
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Tue, Dec 25 2018, 2:55 pm
It is not right. I do everything in my power to pay fill tuition. My childrens education is more important than luxuries. Bh we never had to ask for a break.
But there will always be people that will cheat the system and mooch off from wherever they can to live a luxurious lifestyle, theres nothing we can do about it.
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amother
Maroon
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Tue, Dec 25 2018, 3:07 pm
Some people get company cars. Or grandparents who pay for vacations and they are not the type to ask for money for tuition. Just saying.
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amother
Cyan
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Tue, Dec 25 2018, 3:11 pm
The schools that are responsible will check to make sure that people who ask for tuition breaks are not going to hotels, expensive vacations, making lavish simchas etc.. My problem is that even the schools my kids went to did not go far enough. There were still many "minor" expenses that shouldn't have been allowed, and that add up but were treated as - well those are things that everyone is entitled to. Which is ridiculous, because in the end, if you are asking for a tuition break, someone else is paying for that small vacation, summer camp, more than basic kiddush, etc..
There is only a certain amount of tzedaka to go around. When people give money to families where the husband sits and learns instead of working, or for lavish gifts (such as the 2K linens we're all reading about) then there is less money to give to people who truly need and deserve our tzedaka (like the BT who cannot make a wedding because her parents cut her off. I am not connected to this situation, but I hope it would be apparent to people that some people who ask are deserving and some are not.)
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amother
Cyan
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Tue, Dec 25 2018, 3:12 pm
and responsible schools will not let you ask for tuition breaks even if you say that a relative paid for the new car, hotel stay, etc..
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DVOM
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Tue, Dec 25 2018, 3:22 pm
amother wrote: | I know a lot of people ask for tuition breaks from the yeshivas but is it fair when they live lavish and spend on everything for themselves. Pls don’t start about how vacations are ‘necessary for health” and all the nonsense. How is it right to cut back on the cheshbon of the yeshivas at the same time you refuse to cut down on your on luxuries, yes going away for Pesach is a luxury (and people go to hotels while they don’t pay full tuition) and even if they don’t they spend and spend on themselves, fancy sheitals, clothes (it’s necessary for mental health uh huh) vacations, eating out. It’s wrong, if you’re living on the dime of the Yeshiva by not paying full you shouldn’t be splurging on your own lifestyle. Shouldn’t the tuition come first and be paid first before you spend on other things? |
You’re not wrong, OP. Of course, tuition should come before a luxurious lifestyle.
But sweetie, it won’t help you any to spend your time feeding your anger about how other people prioritize their spending. It will just make you unhappy. In truth, you have no idea how people spend their money. You don’t know what their lives are like. The people who take fancy vacations and take tuition breaks will have to square that away with god and their own conscience. Look at your own life, be proud of your own ethics and morality. Bless the people who you think are swindling the system with so much money that they can pay their tuition, take their vacation, and still have tons left over to help another family who is struggling.
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amother
Scarlet
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Tue, Dec 25 2018, 3:26 pm
amother wrote: | and responsible schools will not let you ask for tuition breaks even if you say that a relative paid for the new car, hotel stay, etc.. |
Why can't a relative pay for things for someone that doesn't pay full tuition ? When my husband was still in school we did not pay full tuition. No we didnt drive fancy cars , I didn't have fancy jewellery and we didnt go on fancy vacations but our grandparents/inlaws/parents wanted us to spend yuntif with them so they paid for us to come with them. Why is that a big deal ?
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DVOM
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Tue, Dec 25 2018, 3:27 pm
amother wrote: | The schools that are responsible will check to make sure that people who ask for tuition breaks are not going to hotels, expensive vacations, making lavish simchas etc.. My problem is that even the schools my kids went to did not go far enough. There were still many "minor" expenses that shouldn't have been allowed, and that add up but were treated as - well those are things that everyone is entitled to. Which is ridiculous, because in the end, if you are asking for a tuition break, someone else is paying for that small vacation, summer camp, more than basic kiddush, etc..
There is only a certain amount of tzedaka to go around. When people give money to families where the husband sits and learns instead of working, or for lavish gifts (such as the 2K linens we're all reading about) then there is less money to give to people who truly need and deserve our tzedaka (like the BT who cannot make a wedding because her parents cut her off. I am not connected to this situation, but I hope it would be apparent to people that some people who ask are deserving and some are not.) |
Please, let's not set ourselves up as the judges for who is 'deserving' of charity and who isn't, who 'needs' the vacation even though they get a tuition break and who doesn't. We're not god. We don't know what people need and deserve.
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amother
Silver
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Tue, Dec 25 2018, 3:28 pm
amother wrote: | I know a lot of people ask for tuition breaks from the yeshivas but is it fair when they live lavish and spend on everything for themselves. Pls don’t start about how vacations are ‘necessary for health” and all the nonsense. How is it right to cut back on the cheshbon of the yeshivas at the same time you refuse to cut down on your on luxuries, yes going away for Pesach is a luxury (and people go to hotels while they don’t pay full tuition) and even if they don’t they spend and spend on themselves, fancy sheitals, clothes (it’s necessary for mental health uh huh) vacations, eating out. It’s wrong, if you’re living on the dime of the Yeshiva by not paying full you shouldn’t be splurging on your own lifestyle. Shouldn’t the tuition come first and be paid first before you spend on other things? |
Unless you're the principal of the school, don't worry about it too much. Just keep doing the best that you can, and don't look over your shoulder at everyone else.
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amother
Mint
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Tue, Dec 25 2018, 3:46 pm
The problem is not the people, the problem is the schools.
As long as schools tuition programs are set up in a way that they dont consider how much income you have as much as they look at how much "savings" you have, this basically encourages people to live whatever lifestyle they like, and then get tuition breaks because therea not enough money left over.
I was talking about this with a friend-she and her husband make double our income but they get tuition breaks and we dont. Because they bought an 800,000k house and have a much bigger mortgage than our 450k house. They both lease new infinitis, while we drive old cars that break frequently, I buy a 1000k shaitel every 6 years, she buys 2 shaitels of 3k each every 4 years. Etc etc.
It's really not rocket science. Tuition board flat out told us, if we see significant money, we take it for tuition-forget about responsible saving for the future, bar mitzvahs, wedding, nada. Us being frugal just slaps us in the face. My friend who spends all her money just might have the right idea...
Theyre basically incentivising people to spend money irresponsibly and not save. Why not...
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Geulanow
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Tue, Dec 25 2018, 3:48 pm
Some parents need more commitment to mitzvosand don't see Torah education as a priority. A lot of people suffer nowadays from not keeping the 10th of the asiras hadibros - jealous of what others have so they get new cars and vacations and are even jealous of tuition breaks that people get.
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amother
Blue
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Tue, Dec 25 2018, 3:49 pm
I live in an area where you need a car to get around. DH and I both work full time and share one car. I don't have cleaning help.
I am going on vacation soon. It's either that or quit my job. I need it for my sanity. $1,000 for vacation will allow me to keep my job that pays my discounted tuition fee.
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amother
Tan
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Tue, Dec 25 2018, 3:50 pm
This conversation has happened about 300 times here. I recommend searching as you won't get any new insight by starting it again.
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amother
Pewter
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Tue, Dec 25 2018, 3:54 pm
Geulanow wrote: | Some parents need more commitment to mitzvosand don't see Torah education as a priority. A lot of people suffer nowadays from not keeping the 10th of the asiras hadibros - jealous of what others have so they get new cars and vacations and are even jealous of tuition breaks that people get. |
And some people are so overworked and are under extreme pressure with all the necessities of a Jewish lifestyle that they need a little 'something' to brighten the circumstances.
"Don't judge a person until you've walked a mile in their shoes."
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Chayalle
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Tue, Dec 25 2018, 3:58 pm
I have a pretty ironclad rule that I do my best to enforce for myself, which is: I don't try to make other people's cheshbonos.
Everyone has different needs and reasons for it. I drive a pretty old car for most peoples' standards (a 2007 Honda Accord) but you know, there are cars out there that are even more "yeshivish"-looking and falling apart than mine (mine happens to be in pretty decent shape despite its' age B"H B"AH kein yirbu cuz I really don't want to have to buy a new car right now) so someone out there could think, you know Chayalle could probably manage with a 2003 impala (that was my last car, and it was costing me more to keep it than to junk it and replace it) and pay more tuition $$, how dare she buy a "new" 2nd hand decent-looking car......
I know some people who commute to work (I work from home) so having a reliable car that won't stall on them is an absolute must, especially if they don't have a good days-off policy from their job (I work for my company long enough that B"H I can take off when I need to by now). Or maybe they do alot of long-distance driving to OOT parents that make a decent car worthwhile (it's cheaper than flying, and Kibbud Av V'aim, to boot).
So there are so many variables that contribute to people needing the cars they drive, that make their needs different than mine.
So I try my best not to judge them. One less stress in my life....
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thunderstorm
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Tue, Dec 25 2018, 4:12 pm
I have no idea who does and who doesn't get a tuition break. It's not my business. All I know is that what may look obvious to you may not be the real picture.
I pay full tuition at all of our schools and therefore my credit card is now $25k in debt because the tuition gets charged to my card. I live simply, maybe even poorly sometimes.
A sibling of mine once told me that tuition is also his biggest expense. He recently made a simcha . For his standards it was simple , for me it was extravagant.
At our family Chanuka party my relative mentioned that they owe $30 k in tuition. I found out this week that this sibling borrowed the money from my other sibling to pay for the entire simcha and he won't be able to pay it back before 3 years.
Here , we technically have the same debt. He owes it to the school. I owe it to the credit card. I'm making the same simcha in my home with only 30 people and I'm doing everything myself. For me , that is what I have to do as I can't afford more. My sibling earns more than us , and are part of a more affluent crowd. That sibling has the pressure of living up to a higher standard. But they are struggling MORE than we are financially. It made me realize that nothing is as it seems and therefor I can never judge.
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amother
Wheat
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Tue, Dec 25 2018, 5:01 pm
My uncle works for one of the tuition committees in a rich School in Queens and they decide whether or not a person to get a tuition break. He said there are some people that live in mansions and yet are on Tomchei shabbos and are asking for huge tuition discounts because they have no money. He explained to me that it's basically like they're living in Golden cages. Their Mansions are in foreclosure. Appearances can be very deceiving
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OBnursemom
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Tue, Dec 25 2018, 5:27 pm
I’ve noticed that most times I see people with new cars, their previous lease recently ended. I don’t consider new cars a richness thing. Just a fact of life. Newer cars also cost less in terms of maintenance, which is why people tend to lease.
And let’s be honest, tuition costs more than many people make in a year. People have to feed, clothe, and otherwise take care of their kids. This does not change because they can’t pay $75K a year in tuition. I don’t know anyone who can pay that much.
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amother
Coral
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Tue, Dec 25 2018, 5:41 pm
seriously - Why do you care? What does it change about your life? You have to pay tuition anyway.
And please don't tell me you are paying for their children, because that is wishful thinking at best. (at least here in Lakewood in any case)
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amother
Wine
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Tue, Dec 25 2018, 5:48 pm
thunderstorm- you are very sweet but your sibling made his choice, they CHOOSE to be part of a more affluent crowd and feel the need to live up to the jones, no one is making them.
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